Reply To: Wasting Other People’s Time

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#1950876
Avram in MD
Participant

Always_Ask_Questions,

“Avram, I was totally not nogea b’davar: I was not in a hurry and not cold.”

Those are not the only factors that would make you nogea b’davar.

“I did not need rationalizing.”

So why are you? You have not stated any direct halachos or opinions in this thread that you are relying on for skipping kaddishes. Your main arguments have been rebbe stories that are irrelevant to the issue at hand and the fact that the gabbai and rabbi at the minyan are not directing you to say the kaddishes. That is textbook rationalizing.

“I saw other people being cold.”

So perhaps it is your personal rachmanus that makes you nogea b’davar. Or perhaps like the OP you feel embarrassed for some reason making people wait for you. Who knows? Unlike what you accused below, I’m trying to avoid speculating. All we see is that you have made a controversial halachic decision without consulting a rav, And when pressed on it you have provided no halachic basis, only rationalizations, and you have decided to make not asking a shaila your hill to plant your flag on and make your stand. And that’s a really strange hill on which to make a stand. Everything you have brought forth in the rebbe stories about not asking a shaila pertains to pikuach nefesh situations where taking the time to ask a shaila may increase the danger. This situation is NOT equivalent. At worst it is a question of tircha d’tzibbur (and I maintain that a regularly scheduled kaddish is NEVER tircha b’tzibbur). It is incorrect to extrapolate from one to the other. And we have psakim for these situations, not maybes and rebbe stories.

“I agree that if I were to have personal inclination to skip, I should have asked the Rav in the minyan. The problem was – the Rav might have been cold, so he was nogea b’davar :). He would have been forced to tell me to say all of them in order to resist his own yetzer harah! In truth, if I were nogeah b’davar, I would not have skipped.”

That’s not how things work. The rav cannot change his psak based on whether or not he is cold. The halacha is the halacha, so he is not “forced” to tell you one way or the other based on his feelings. If he’s concerned that his personal involvement may color his psak somehow, then he can ask his own shaila.

“As to Hashem’s will, maybe He wants us to take care of other people despite our desire to say an extra kaddish – rather than ask shailos about it.”

Just ask the shaila. It’ll take 5 minutes and you can remove the “maybe” from your sentence! We don’t want a lot of “maybes” when doing Hashem’s will. That becomes very dangerous very fast.

“please notice that you seem to put in the worst assumptions about any missing pieces in my story: I had my own interest, I don’t know whether my Rav will correct me or not.”

I am only responding to what you have written. I have made no assumptions about your motivations or anything else.