Home › Forums › Family Matters › Chumros = Kids Off The Derech? › Reply To: Chumros = Kids Off The Derech?
well, notpashut, I don’t know why you have to stoop to this rather low level in our discussions. It is almost as if you have no argument to present and so all you do is make ‘ad hominem” attacks- calling your interlocutor all names under the sun. ooo646 is sadly right in his appraisal of many chareidim who will brook no discussion of any of “their’ gedolim’s words. But I digress. Let me deal with the crux of your counter-argument.
Yes, I will say ,quite explicitly, that – IN MILEI DE’ALMA – matters of day-to day conduct ,Rav Elyashiv shelita can be wrong and I- or any other human being – can be right.You can rhapsodize all you want about gedolim’s gadlus and their tsidkus and affirm that this makes them all-knowing. I do not accept that.The biggest gedolim have made mistakes and this still happens every day. “maaseh bechol yom”. Of course, I accept their exalted status- and it is indeed exalted- but this does not make them smarter or more clairvoyant. Otherwise, every business deal that they recommend will be succesful, every sick person that they advise will recover and every moissad or cause that they espouse will prosper. But this is not true. Plenty of business deals that they recommend fail ( I have first hand knowledge of this), many “choilim’ r’l die and many yeshivas and moisdos are bankrupt.
If you accept this -and I think you probaby do NOT accept this view because of your understanding of ‘daas torah”- then it is irrelevant who disputes the godol’s view. If he is wrong ,then it dones not matter that it is the little child who shouted that the emperor has no clothes. You did not need a smart man to see this.As a matter of fact ,the smart man was duped in denying this.
Similarly, if any human being-regardless of his age, status, religious standing- thinks that a godol is wrong in MILEI DE’ALMA – he has the full right to follow his conscience. What happens afterward will either prove or disprove his view and yes, the layman does take responsibility for his view.
I am not even going to argue why YOUR gedolim are BETTER than mine. I would say that the Lubavithcer rebbe was a pretty big godol, wouldn’t you say? Yet, none of your machane approve of him or his derech. And don’t bring me the case of Rav Tendler, How about quoting Rav Shlomo Goren zz’L? Why is he a lesser godol than the gedolim you follow? Give me ONE good reason why he should not be followed also.
My point is that the tsidkus status of a person does not make him automatically all-knowing.He is prone to make mistakes too. And ,ironically, you will only grant this omniscient status to gedolim that you approve of while totally rejecting others that you do not approve of.This a classical case of hypocrisy.
After all this is said, I absolutely deny that I bash chareidim, At best, I disagree with some of the views and apporaches of SOME of the chareidi gedolim.
As to your question on R’Moshe- you just made the case for the discussion earlier. R’Moshe’s kullos are talked about BECAUSE you need true gadlus to find and “pasken” hetteirim. You do not need gadlus to be machmir. Hence, R’Moshe’s kullos are what mark his as one of the great Poskim of the past generations.