BP Oil Spill & Moshiach

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    Right before Mashiach, Hashem will fill the seas with oil and the fish will die……

    by Rav Shmuel Brazil (hat tip: Yeranen Yaakov)

    Oil in lashan hakodesh is equivalent to ???. Are we really accepting the daily yoke of Torah and mitzvos upon ourselves? In the ?? ??? we mention our failure for ????? ??? throwing off this yoke. Even though we recite Shema could it be that at some instances like at work we do not accept this wholeheartedly by saying that in the work place this ??? must be modified or compromised? Could the same apply to the way we make our simchas that the ??? has slightly been repressed. Well maybe this spill over is sending us the message that the ??? ????? ???? has to emerge from its hiding place.

    To be very honest, no one can say exactly why this disaster has happened. Oh yes, we do know that it was man made and not natural. However this knowledge sort of removes many of us from the teshuva mode for the disaster can be easily attributed to human error. However, the gemarrah in Sanhedrin and Rav Chaim Vital negates this very clearly. This catastrophic disaster is no other than a severe wake up call from Hashem. It is not a one day disaster or even a week. It has started in April and continues until today bringing its havoc upon more and more people. The Muslim World and the Oil are intensely amplifying its destruction right on our doorsteps so we better start shaping up. Believe me when I say that I would rather write some nice dvar Torah and make everyone smile and say geshmak and insightful. I am sure the Neviim of Klal Yisrael would have also wanted to do the same. A navi I am not. But I am a Yid, who takes to heart what I learned in that gemarah and in Rav Chaim Vital. We all must be acutely aware and understand that Iran is sending its navy with the next flotilla to deliberately start a war with Am Yisrael and bring the entire world against us. How much further evidence do we need to stir us to initiate rethinking our lives and make a few changes in order to change the natural flow of statistics which stack up against us.


    Nice one!


    It IS very nice. I remember that inyan in Sanhedrin quite differently. Maybe someone could look it up.


    I was toying with the idea for a BP thread, but I’m glad Ty beat me to it, becuase his post was much better.

    The only thing I would add is, oil is one of Hashem’s resourses, and one we can and should put to good use. But when greed governs mankinds motives, we can do lots of damage to ourselves. And we have no one to blame but ourselves. I am not suggesting we go back to the horse and buggy days, but do we really need to have such an insatiable appetite for the black gold that we go to any lenght to get it? I mean, drilling a hole in the ocean floor? It must have been a great idea when it was first done, but in retropsect, you have to wonder, did they even consider how they would stop it, if they needed to? Or did they have so much confidence in thier pumps and systems that the mere thought of failure never entered thier mind?

    Now we see what happens when you exploit a gift from Hashem.


    For me personally I do not become interested in specific signs of the coming of Moshiach. General trends of the world, yes, it is clear that we are living in the generations shortly before the arrival of Moshiach. But specific signs I tend towards not paying much attention.

    I remember the war when iraq invaded kuwait. In my parts, Moshiach fever was epidemic. Every day new allusions to the imminent arrival of Moshiach were being discovered. I was caught up in it. Seriously, I would look at the headlines of the newspaper every morning, hoping to see: “MOSHIACH IS HERE!”

    My Emunah was not destroyed, Baruch Hashem, but I was deeply disappointed for months afterward.

    Feif Un

    I think Rabbi Brazil made a typographical error – I think it’s daf 98, not 88.


    wow, it’ certainly food for thought.

    mod, isn’t that essentially what can happen to kids if we lay it on too thick? i wonder, b/c when i was a kid, an adult told me one tisha b’av that if i really daven hard enough and i’m nice to the other kids, mashciach will come on tisha b’av. i guess he didn’t mean that year, cuz i’m still waiting…


    the Chafetz Chaim who writes that many of our tzaros such as sicknesses and the premature death of young children chas vashalom are caused by the compromising of our strict standards in modesty

    where does the chofetz chaim say that?


    I think it is VERY important that we tell our children ONLY Emes. If we aren’t sure of something we should make that clear. And I mean even children before they can walk.

    And particularly I think the tooth fairy thing, though cute and sweet, is terribly, and at a very deep level, damaging to a child’s developement of Emunah


    i agree. how do you suggest that one teaches his child to expect that mashiach can come any day w/o making it sound like that person made it sound to me?


    Stress that he CAN come any day, but we don’t know which day he will actually come.


    Here is the exact translation of the Pasuk that is brought in Sanhedrin 98a, by Artscroll:

    Then I will make their waters settle and cause their rivers to flow like oil


    To paraphrase the short discussion in the Gemorah, al pi Artscroll, based on Rabbi Chanina’s droshoh on the above Pasuk:

    Before Moshiach, all the waters of the earth will congeal and there will be no fish to be found to heal a person.


    I recently heard a story about R’ Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld. It was the time of the Belfour Declaration and jews were rapidly immigrating to Israel causing many people to believe it was the time of Massiach. (Im not sure the exact details of what brought this up…maybe someone asked him why he became rav but regardless…) he explained: When he was in Pressurg yeshiva the roshei yeshiva used to get drunk on Purim so before Purim they appointed a “purim rav” to paskin shailos over purim. He said i”m like the purim rav- i”m only rav because everyone else is drunk.

    Point: We should not be deciding this or that means massiach is coming, we just gotta keep doing our best and keep daving and iy”H…


    OK. This is quite literally nonsense. The pasuk as beautifully quoted by mod 80 states that the water will be LIKE oil. Rashi states that since the water will have congealed the fish will be unable to swim.

    The water has not congealed.



    it’s not nonsense, rashi says the waters will be filled with oil, so far that’s happening

    he also says it will kill marine life, also happening, they’re not all dead yet, but give it some time. as of now bp has no real plan to stop the leaking!


    I wouldn’t call it nonsense either, but Rashi said the waters will be LIKE oil, not that they would fill with oil. Also Rabbi Chanina says that there will be no fish to be found, not that a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a percent of the seas fish will be killed.



    rashi isn’t talking about the whole world, just a part of the world.

    if the oil continues, which it will, there will be no marine life left.

    PS rashi actually says the fishing lines will come back empty, you can still technically try 100 times and catch one fish, and still be called coming back empty if normally it takes 2-3 times to catch something.



    rashi isn’t talking about the whole world, just a part of the world.

    That’s true, although it was Rabbi Chanina, and probably he was referring to Eretz Yisroel and it’s surrounding countries (I would think).


    There are virtually hundreds of medrashim about moshiach and one needs to know pshat. However I am fairly certain that Moshiach can come through everyone doing Teshuvah and having Ahavas Chinum and it wont require bloody wars and destruction of the earths oceans and the like.




    i don’t know about the others, but no I’m not happy about it, I’m so depressed (mostly because i didn’t short BP)

    but it doesn’t change the fact this should be a current discussion among all yiddin, how the gemaras words are here.


    I assumed BO was Barack Obama – i’m curious if that was the OP’s intent or if it was really a typo…


    I don’t want to take away from the chizuk in Emunah from this Gemarah but alibah d’emes you should know that the exact same type of oil spill happened in 1979 in the gulf too. Aderabah it could be that we were close to deserving Moshiach to come then too.


    I make it a point to NOT get excited about any “sign” or “prediction” about when Moshiach will come. Far too many people either misinterpret sources, just plain make things up (yes, I have examples) or are just plain wrong when it comes to predicting that Moshiach is close because event X happened.

    I wait and daven for Moshiach’s arrival every day. When he gets here, he gets here.

    The Wolf


    Government spokesman Magdy Rady said the amount was “limited,” but he did not say how much. He said the spill was detected last week and has now been largely contained, according to comments carried by the official Middle East News Agency.

    Oil company officials in the port city of Suez said the spill was caused by a leak from an offshore oil platform in Jebel al-Zayt north of Hurghada and has polluted about 100 miles (160 kilometers) of coastline including tourist beach resorts. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak to the media.


    Oy! Not only does he pronounce the word “oil” but he makes a drasha out of it. http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/oh-vs-oy

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