Davened for Trump?
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- This topic has 24 replies, 14 voices, and was last updated 2 years, 5 months ago by Always_Ask_Questions.
September 23, 2020 8:28 pm at 8:28 pm #1904031The FrumguyParticipant
Did anyone in the Coffee Room have our President’s re-election in mind for a moment when davening on Rosh Hashanah?
Just curious.September 23, 2020 9:52 pm at 9:52 pm #1904046Sam KleinParticipant
No I did not have it in mind and that’s for various reasons.
First of all the presidential election results have already been decided by Hashem himself directly who win or lose the election.
Second, there are more important things for a person to focus on rosh hashanah on when a person is sitting in Hashems court on a scale between life and death and being decided on who will live and who will C”V Die this year etc…
Closing. Yes when it comes to elections we all have to do our hishtadlus and go out and vote but in Truth we all know who really is running the entire united States and the entire world for that matter
May everyone have a gmat chasima tovaSeptember 23, 2020 9:57 pm at 9:57 pm #1904048
In our small improvised outdoor minyan, the shaliach tzibur wisely avoided including the usual tefillah after the haftorah for the leaders of our government so as to assure we still had a minyan for musaf.September 23, 2020 10:42 pm at 10:42 pm #1904053NerliParticipant
Why would we pray for him?? If anyone needs our prayers it’s our brother’s and sistasSeptember 23, 2020 10:47 pm at 10:47 pm #1904052
Keep Trump in mind by אתה חונן לאדם דעת as he does not listen to anyone other than himself.September 24, 2020 1:10 am at 1:10 am #1904063charliehallParticipant
“have our President’s re-election in mind for a moment when davening”
Any Jew who prays for Trump’s re-election has rejected everything the Torah teaches.
“the usual tefillah after the haftorah for the leaders of our government”
Why? We were willing to bring Korbanot in the Beit HaMikdash for Caligula, who was even worse than Trump. (And Trump is really bad.) He needs our prayers.September 24, 2020 8:18 am at 8:18 am #1904073
I daven that democrats should failSeptember 24, 2020 8:21 am at 8:21 am #1904094OtherTzadParticipant
I had in mind that hashem should bless us with a good president, who is favorable to yidden and allows us to grow in yiddishkeit.
I didnt have anyone specific in mind, because hashem ultimately controls all rulers of the world, so who he chooses to be the president doesnt matter. Trump could go bad, or Biden could snap. So they’re just a name. They rule as hashem desires.September 24, 2020 10:03 am at 10:03 am #1904159
OtherTzad, Please capitalize the name Hashem as He is greater than Trump or Biden.September 24, 2020 10:41 am at 10:41 am #1904179HBSParticipant
“Any Jew who prays for Trump’s re-election has rejected everything the Torah teaches.”
Harav Shmuel Kamenetzky begs to differ.September 24, 2020 10:41 am at 10:41 am #1904176AzoiyParticipant
No need to specify Trump. Daven that we have law an order and a good economy and Yidden can be free and safe. That will not happen with the DemocratsSeptember 24, 2020 11:00 am at 11:00 am #1904190
1, you don’t want a democratic government as Trunp. Democrats is with a capital letter.September 24, 2020 12:19 pm at 12:19 pm #1904238hershhParticipant
reb eliezer; just remember ‘ lev melachim vesarim beyad Hashem’ it’s not how you judge him.September 24, 2020 1:05 pm at 1:05 pm #1904258
The president is not a melech. He is ruled by the constitution. Hashem changes the environment to rule over.September 24, 2020 3:24 pm at 3:24 pm #1904268
“Harav Shmuel Kamenetzky begs to differ”
Just as we are free to differ on matters of electoral choice and select that candidate who best reflects the totality of our concerns. For some of us, another 4 years of the status quo would be a disaster for the U.S. and also for EY. Obviously, the large percentage of those here in the CR passionately believe the opposite is true if Biden wins. Thats what a democracy is about and lets hope that whatever the outcome on November 4-10 (since I really believe it could be a week for final determination) the peaceful transition that has governed our democracy for over 200 years continues.
G’mar tov to ALLSeptember 24, 2020 3:26 pm at 3:26 pm #1904337
Reb Eliezer they don’t deserve the respect to be capitalized. dems are evil.September 24, 2020 3:26 pm at 3:26 pm #1904338
Reb Eliezer The president can carry out an execution. He can impose martial law as well. He is your President. Get over it.September 24, 2020 4:21 pm at 4:21 pm #1904354HBSParticipant
1. The Torah is not a democracy. If R’ Shmuel Kamenetzky says something, us common folk have no say to the contrary. That I need to spell this out is sad commentary.
2. Charliehall said “Any Jew who prays for Trump’s re-election has rejected everything the Torah teaches”. That was not a political choice, but a hashkafic statement.September 24, 2020 4:22 pm at 4:22 pm #1904370
1, You are not 1. You speak as your president, projecting, faulting people by your own faults, כל הפוסל במומו פוסל.September 24, 2020 4:23 pm at 4:23 pm #1904364jackkParticipant
POTUS cannot carry out an execution and he definitely cannot impose martial law. Do some research.
He is an elected official not a king.September 24, 2020 10:26 pm at 10:26 pm #1904492
HBS: Sadly, America is still a democracy and as citizens we ARE free to make our own decisions on voting for candidates. We certainly can consider the views of rabonim, askanim and those we respect but the final decision is our own. Yes, I’m sure there are still areas where everyone moves in step with directives from their Rav on everything from hashgacha to local elections but most yidden actually retain the ability to make their own decisions on political matters.
edited. The picture you paint with your word choices are not hashkafically appropriate. -29September 25, 2020 9:16 am at 9:16 am #1904573
Looked Rav Shafran’s of the Agudah and others’ Open Letter how character maters.September 25, 2020 4:56 pm at 4:56 pm #1904720KilaolomchasdoParticipant
Honestly, there should be nothing wrong for davening “whichever govt. officials will be best for kllal yisroel should win.”September 25, 2020 5:27 pm at 5:27 pm #1904749Always_Ask_QuestionsParticipant
We had more difficult cases.
Look up old machzorim. I have mahzor from one side of my family with a prayer for Kesar Nikolai Alexandrovich (and a named list of his wife and children) and from another – for Franz Jozef.
I don’t think one would be allowed to have both in his house during WW1…September 26, 2020 8:43 pm at 8:43 pm #1904888
Always Ask: No doubt the Mahzor is authentic. You may recall that In the opening scene of Fiddler on the Roof, the rebbe’s son asks his father: “Is there a proper blessing for the tsar?” The rabbi responds: “A blessing for the Kesar?”ponders the question for awhile, then pronounces: “Of course . . . May God bless and keep the Kesar . . . far away from us!”. In our case, such a baracha for the leadership of our country on the yom tovim wouldn’t be enough so silence is perhaps a preferable option.September 27, 2020 4:07 am at 4:07 am #1904946Always_Ask_QuestionsParticipant
@GH, I agree that sometimes this bracha does not feel authentic. Indeed, I once witnessed how an elderly congregant broke down on Yom Kippur in some country during this prayer “Why do we say this? They are murderers.. They killed my family” …
At the same time, as we all choose to live in this country (we are all free to leave, right?), I think we should acknowledge it. Thankfully, we do not have to say “adoneinu” as both my Russian and Austrian machzorim say, but why not wish “Hashem give wisdom to …”. Should also apply to governors, unless you are still voting Federalist.
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