Halachically okay to be liberal?

Yes. But, someone will bring their 1940 ideas or yeshiva funding lies.

@fakeyeshivabochur why be a fake bochur if you can be a real one?

Just the opposite

Our Neviim tell us explicity to vote for the liberal eg:
פְּתַח־פִּ֥יךָ לְאִלֵּ֑ם אֶל־דִּ֝֗ין כָּל־בְּנֵ֥י חֲלֽוֹף׃
פְּתַח־פִּ֥יךָ שְׁפָט־צֶ֑דֶק וְ֝דִ֗ין עָנִ֥י וְאֶבְיֽוֹן׃
Mishlei 31:8-9

Compare the number of timses caring for the poor , the downtroden the yosam and almanah is mentioned in Tanach vs how many time abortion is mentioned and you will have your answer

See this is what happens when you don’t learn Tanach

Define “liberal”. Depending on place and time the term varies. In some countries, the “liberals” are actually the “conservatives”. Whether “liberal” or “conservative” has little to do with abortion (and related policies such as infanticide, population control, etc.).

Whether it is acceptable for a Jew to support a movement the favors abortion other than when necessary to save the mother’s life, e.g. as a means of population control, or for the convenience of the mother, or to prevent inferiors from reproducing, etc., is a different question that support of overall economic and political policies. Whether you support (or oppose) free trade, or capitalism or democracy, has limited correlation to whether you favor killing babies that someone (not necessarily the mother) doesn’t want.

Whether the Democrats in the 21st century are “liberals” is problematic. Certainly 19th century “liberals” in the Anglo-phonic world would be horrified at many of the policies embraced by today’s Democrats.

Ubiq,

שלמה המלך said לב כסיל לשמאל

“Conservatives care far more for the poor , the downtrodden, the yosam and almanah whereas the liberals use them as a tool and prop for political gain while giving them no help and nothing of use or import.”

That may be true about the American Democratic party in its current state, but I don’t think that’s always been true of Liberalism. I don’t think that–all throughout history–the entire concept of liberalism has been a scam to control poor people. I think certain people today use it for that purpose.

Neville, yes, I support strong gun control and am more than fully in line with the Democrat position than Republican. I look everything issue-by-issue and don’t necessarily toe the party line. Nevertheless, especially on social issues, but even on most economic issues, those in America referred to as conservatives are far closer to a correct position — in the vast vast majority of issues — than those referred to as liberal.

Mr fake yeshiva buchor.
As long as u follow halachah what does it matter if the rest of the country is following the Constitution. In following the laws of the country, u must be more machmer but u can’t be more maikel
The Torah said no on abortion, end of story.
This question is very similar to aisuvs question on miser for salt. I see where u get ur screen name from. Lol

Is it halachically okay to be a Libertarian? A Green? An independent?

Joseph those republicans that are for the poor will be suggesting cuts in SNAP, cuts in TANF and a 6 child limit, cuts in HUD section 8 funding and cuts in WIC, cuts in SSDI, and limiting support for special needs individuals, cuts in medicaid for children and adults. These cuts would prove disastrous to many in the frum community who depend on these public benefits for survival.

ליב רעל. Liberalm Poison heart.
Kamala harris- קמ על ה הרס. Getting up against Hashem to destroy.
Ilhan omar- the eitz hadaas is speaking
Rashida tlaib-רשעי דעת לב

ACS
I love this game!

conservative: כאן סר טיב, here good is removed

(though I’m a bit surprised that you referred to Ilan Omar as the tree of knowledge, I’m not so sure ou thought that one through)

Joseph, about abortion look up ‘אהלות פרק ז’ משנה ו, אשה שהיא מקשה לילד מחתכין את הולד במעיה וכו

Ubiquitin,

It isn’t just in Nach. It is in Chazal and Rishonim. See for example the draconian business regulations found in Bavli Bava Metzia and the mandated support for the poor in Yerushalmi Peah that Rambam codifies as halachah. On economic matters real Judaism is to the left of Bernie Sanders. (I bet he never learned any of that at his socialist kibbutz.)

On social matters of course halachah is very conservative.

Avi I agree with you 100%. Unfortunately this isn’t a situation that will be quickly turned around. Work requirements (for women and men) will help change things in the long run. In the meantime without adequate secular/vocational education may of these folks will need assistance. In cases like KY, it’s unlikely that chessed will be able to support their needs once TANF is reduced or timed out.

Joseph, I’m not going to chase your strawmen.

Good shabbos to all.

Tanchuma RE’eh

Some drowned in the flood even if they themselves weren’t degenerate for their disinterest in the moral degeneracy

“On social matters of course halachah is very conservative.”

WB Charlie.

Having recognized that Halacha is “very conservative” on social matters, would you say that you are very conservative on social matters — in accordance with Halacha?

@FakeYeshivaBochur
“liberals are EXTREMELY pro-abortion,”

Keep posting lies.
I am politically Liberal, but fiscally conservative. Have been active in Democratic Party Politics at local and state levels for decades, delegate to national conventions. elected official, etc.

I don’t know a single liberal who is pro-abortion. I know many liberals who are pro-choice. They believe it is the individual woman’s right to choose, not society’s right to demand that she carry a pregnancy to term.

Personally, I do not believe in abortions of convenience. If it is medically necessary to save the life of the mother, I believe it should be an avenue for consideration.

I serve on my local Democratic Town Committee. There are more than 50 members. At least half are Catholic and oppose abortion, period. They still consider themselves liberal. Abortion is not the litmus test that determines if one is liberal.
I am pro-civil rights, education, universal healthcare, etc. BUT I am not Pro-Abortion, certainly not extremely so.

More than 60 years ago when my late MIL was in the local Catholic hospital (closest to her home) to give birth to Mrs. CTL things were not going well. The administrator said to my late FIL, we have to save the baby and not your wife because the baby is free from sin. My FIL informed the admin that we Jews did not believe that way and they were to save both mother and child. They did.
Today, I am on the board of that hospital. No elective abortions are performed there, only those critically medically necessary to spare major medical damage or death to/of the mother.
This standard is considered liberal by Catholic authorities, but when a hospital serves a diverse population it must serve them, not dictate that their religious policy trumps sound medical advice.

@1
More Falsehoods from the peanut gallery
My town has more than 30,000 residents and less than 100,000
It is not stuck in the 1990s, but is modern without destroying traditions. The main part of my home was built in 1803 and there are many older homes than that in town, along with new McMansions in recently developed neighborhoods.
We are near a large city, but don’t consider ourselves a suburb. Many residents make their livelihood here and many large corporations are in our industrial and office parks. What we do have is a nice racial and ethnic mix that gets along and respects all traditions and practices.

Your baiting and insults show how shallow you are. You could not reply to my comments so you instead post an insult.

As I have stated before, I’ll not address anything you say more than once in any one thread

And CTL plays his word games to make his party look good.

bk613
“I agree that when the mothers life is in danger you must perform an abortion, the baby is considered a rodef.”

who do you want to make that determination?

“I trashed it.”

Mod, what was the objection? It was very pareve.

I disagree. The tone was off and the questions were already answered in his previous post.

Bk613

Very well put.
The problem is the only way to achieve “In the frum world a Rav should be involved as well.” Is to allow the woman to choose.
Halacha and lehavdil secular law have very different approaches to determine “when the mothers life is in danger”

@AviK
“A suburb is a residential district located on the outskirts of a city. If you live in the suburbs, you probably travel to the city for work” from dictionary.com
Our town is near a major CT city but has about as much residential as non-residential acreage. Fewer than 20% of the population work in that city, in fact more residents of the city commute to our town to work than vice versa. Of those residents who do not work in our town (my office is here) 5% commute to NYC and the rest are likely to work in other small towns within 25 miles.
This is different than the bedroom communities that grew up on the train lines to NYC or new (post WWII) suburbs such as Levittown in NY. They were planned for commuters and to be suburbs.
We are not inferior (Sub) the city, nor economically dependent upon them. They receive far more in tax dollars than they send to Hartford and we receive less, subsidizing their existence.

ubiq: On that token you should be advocating for the legalization of homicide since, to borrow your argument, Halacha and lehavdil secular law have very different approaches to determine what is self-defense. The only way to insure that if someone kills someone in a halachicly justifiably self-defense that secular law will deem to be homicide is to legalize homicide much as you advocate to legalize most abortion. Do you support making illegal abortion for purely economic, non-medically necessary, reasons?

CTL: Do you support that abortion in the first trimester for exclusively economic (non-medically necessary) reasons should be legal? If so you negate your earlier argument.