September 2, 2011 5:36 pm at 5:36 pm #599107
I have two questions and yes, I will ask my lor but I’m curious to know if anyone has had any experience with this.
1. If I go to the hospital before shabbos and want to come home once shabbos started (if I am in the er let’s say) how would I go about it? Or is it better to stay in the hospital over shabbos so I am not michalel shabbos?
2. If I need to go in on shabbos but do not want to call hatzala because the issue is to private then am I allowed to go by cab? And how would I go about paying for it?
Again, I am going to ask my lor but I am apprehensive about it because I will have to give information that I am not comfortable giving right now.
Thank you in advance and have a great shabbos!September 2, 2011 5:55 pm at 5:55 pm #805256real-briskerMember
If the issue is an emergency that requires hatzolah, than privacy should not come first. And vice versa too, if the issue does not require hatzolah, than haztolah shouldn’t be used (for sure on shabbos) as a taxi service.September 2, 2011 6:17 pm at 6:17 pm #805257zahavasdadParticipant
Given you have already posted things about yourself, I am assuming you are refering to such events.
Are you afraid to call Hatzolah because they will tell the whole neighborhood or are you afraid because all your neighbors will ask ARE YOU OK and WHAT HAPPEND?..Which you are probably not in the mood to answer
Hatzolah people are not allowed to speak to others about a call, now if you are afraid someone you know will answer, I dont have an answerSeptember 2, 2011 6:29 pm at 6:29 pm #805258
You can generally trust Hatzolah people to keep secrets, but if it’s Mamash a Pikuach Nefesh issue and a cab or regular ambulance would get you there just as quickly there is no reason not to call a cab. (There is no reason not to call Hatzolah either.)
If leaving the hospital involves Chillul Shabbos then why would you be allowed to leave?September 2, 2011 6:39 pm at 6:39 pm #805259ZosHaTorahParticipant
I once accompanied my LOR to the hospital on Shabbos when he thought he was dying (ended up being dehydration from the flu). After IVs and the such, he was well enough to go home around 5pm. Being summer, Shabbos ended a few hours later, and home was 10+ miles away. We understood that we could get a ride to the hospital for pikuach nefesh, but not home when he was well again.
In Hashem’s great mercy, he sent us an off-the-derech nurse at the end of the day who suggested to us (without asking) to do another round of IV’s to ensure (his health) we were not kicked out of the hospital before sunset. We made havdalah a few hours later, then calld for a ride.September 2, 2011 6:43 pm at 6:43 pm #805260YW Moderator-80Member
i dont know the parameters of the Halachah, such as when and to whom it applies, but there is definitely a gezairah the Chochomim made that if a person has to be mechal Shabbos by traveling for a matter of pikuach nefesh he is allowed to come back on Shabbos, for otherwise people might not go in the first place, something along those lines. i know a physician who occassionally has to go to the hospital for emergencies on Shabbos and a major Posek allowed him to return on Shabbos.September 2, 2011 6:49 pm at 6:49 pm #805261apushatayidParticipant
whatever the psak. refua shlaima.September 2, 2011 7:00 pm at 7:00 pm #805262CheinMember
Mod 80: I don’t think it is a gezeira per se, but rather the practical realization of contemporary poskim that disallowing a physician or Hatzalah member to return home from the hospital would discourage such people from going in the first place, and thus potentially making them unavailable to save lives.September 2, 2011 7:01 pm at 7:01 pm #805263
If you are in the hospital on shabbos, of course the best thing to do is to stay until after shabbos. While a Hatzalah member is permitted to return because otherwise we are afraid he won’t go to begin with, as 80 said, I think this only applies to the Hatzalah member or a doctor, but not to the patient himself.
As far as going to the hospital on shabbos, if it is a serious emergency Hatzolah should be called as they are the quickest responders, but if it’s not a life and death thing but you need to go, I think local EMS or a cab may be called. Not sure how to pay a cab though.September 2, 2011 7:02 pm at 7:02 pm #805264
Absolutely not 80. That Heter is only for someone going to save someone else, not to save himself.September 2, 2011 7:06 pm at 7:06 pm #805265charliehallParticipant
If it is a pikuah nefesh issue, don’t call the cab, call hatzalah or 9-1-1!!!September 2, 2011 7:08 pm at 7:08 pm #805266
Thanks for answering everyone.
My dilemma is that I could technically go another day, doesn’t nec have to be shabbos so I’m not sure if I’d be allowed to do this.
I’m not worried about hatzala telling people. I’m worried about my family finding out. I also do not want to go in an ambulance. I know I’m being picky but I just want to make this very awkward and not pleasant situation as pleasant as possible for me.September 2, 2011 7:24 pm at 7:24 pm #805267
If you could “technically” go another day without adding any risk to your life, then how would it ever be okay to be Mechalel Shabbos?September 2, 2011 7:39 pm at 7:39 pm #805268zahavasdadParticipant
happiest has posted information about herself that I am fairly certainly most would agree its best for her to go to the hospital if she needs too ASAP.
I think this is an example where a very specific PSAK would be needed.September 2, 2011 7:39 pm at 7:39 pm #805269
Cuz it is a life and death situation but it is a life and death situation that I keep pushing off…September 2, 2011 7:54 pm at 7:54 pm #805270aries2756Participant
Happiest, if you are in danger then go NOW and don’t think about it. Call Hatzolah and go, they will give you the support you need. If you are 18 and over they will NOT tell your parents what the issue is if you ask them not to tell. They will tell you what the local Rabbonim paskened on whether you can return on Shabbos or not. In my neighborhood, Hatzolah has an account with a local car service so people can come go home. They give a card to the patients and the hospital calls for them.
Happiest, please don’t wait till Shabbos begins. Just know although the complications because of chill Shabbos just makes the anxiety worse. If you are not capable of getting the issue under control and feel that you should be in a hospital let Hatzolah take you otherwise you will be sitting in the emergency room forever and a day. Refuah SheleimahSeptember 2, 2011 8:49 pm at 8:49 pm #805271popa_bar_abbaParticipant
Hatzala is very good at keeping confidentiality.
My brother is in Queens Hatzala, and once took his neighbor to the hospital on shabbos. He did not tell his own wife even though she would have gone over to help the guy’s wife. My sister in law found out from someone else after shabbos.September 2, 2011 9:49 pm at 9:49 pm #805272
Aries, I’m not in danger as in like going to kill myself right now but I need to go to take care of s/t that is life and death. Complicated… I know.
Popa- I know hatzala wouldn’t say anything. I know that. But it is a crazy thing and I can’t have ppl in the community knowing and finding out… Its a delicate situation.September 2, 2011 10:42 pm at 10:42 pm #805273am yisrael chaiParticipant
Your health comes before your community finding out.
Try to keep yourself hydrated in the meantime, if possible.September 2, 2011 10:52 pm at 10:52 pm #805274
just remember–if it’s life and death, or even if it’s doubtful if it’s life and death, you must call on shabbos. You could call 911 if you want.September 4, 2011 1:34 am at 1:34 am #805275
I took care of it everyone.
Thanks for all your input and advice!September 4, 2011 1:36 am at 1:36 am #805276am yisrael chaiParticipant
Thanks so much for taking care of it and letting us know!
That was so kind and thoughtful.September 4, 2011 1:38 am at 1:38 am #805277
So glad for you! Thanks for letting us know!
All the bestSeptember 4, 2011 1:44 am at 1:44 am #805278MiddlePathParticipant
Thanks for letting us know, happiest. I was thinking of you over shabbos.September 4, 2011 4:10 am at 4:10 am #805279realmenchParticipant
Please everybody stop paskening and go ask your dayan
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