Israel Is No Better Than The States..???

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  • #590825

    real613
    Member

    I have been feeling alot lately that the time is coming to move to E”Y. The war is getting closer (if not already begun) and I’m tired of living in a world where people are ignoring/forgetting/ ignorant of the fact that we are in galus etc. In my mind, E”Y is a place for all yiden/jews for everyone of us who seeks the truth and growth and mashiach etc no matter what level we are at or came from. In my mind E”Y is where the ‘love is’………….

    And then i started reading the posts….then the comments…

    I am horrified. I cant believe it. I’m almost speechless. Looks pretty hopeless to me right now! The amount of hatred, fiery words, and thats just about the posts! what about what is going on in our worlds? In our so called communities? If it is so bad in E”Y then there is no place left to go. It is a bad bad time for the jews when you are affraid to move to E”Y because of its ‘FRUM YIDDEN’ !!!!

    Hashem Please Give us The Clarity To Love One and Other and Unite in Our One Goal!

    #681308

    mybat
    Member

    Real, wherever we live (even eretz yisrael) we are still in galut.

    #681309

    Rochelle
    Member

    That is the defined problem with the land of Israel, We forget we are in galus, we feel comfortable with the fact that the UN proclaimed it a land for jews… ha, how riduclous could our thoughts be? And yes as long as we are in Galus we need to endure so we could feel Hashems pain.

    There is no place to go that we will feel safe until moshiach comes.

    #681311

    Jewess
    Member

    There is no problem with the land of Israel. There is a problem with feeling safe while we are still in a spiritual exile. Israel is our land, but the complete presence of God is not with us now.

    I’m not sure what war you are talking about, but from your post you sound like you are in pain.

    #681312

    MaKesher
    Member

    It is painful to see what goes on in EY between and in our communities, but its a good thing to express. We hear and see every day the Sinat Hinam that’s passed from person to person even in the holiest of places. We feel Hashem’s pressence here (in EY) more than in any other place in the world. And even with all the hatred and hardship we have to live with day by day, Israel is still an amazingly great place to live. There is Chessed happening on every corner, there are all different kinds of gemachs, everyone you meet on the street is your friend and everyone worries about everyone else as if he were part of the family. Your greatest security is nosy neighbors, because they’ll always notice when something is amiss and they’ll come and tell you so.

    #681313

    Bais Yaakov maydel
    Participant

    if you look back at our history over the centuries, every 80-150 years we were persecuted and exiled and uprooted from the country that we happened to be occupying at that time. it can happen while were living nice and comfortably in the US–like mybat said, were in galus no matter what country we live in. pretty soon were probably gonna havta pick up again and leave

    #681314

    speaktruth
    Member

    Coming to Israel does not by definition make s/o a better person.

    There is no question that (a) E”Y has more kedusha, (b) there is s/t very special about being in a Jewish country which is run according to the Jewish calendar , (c) there are maalos and chisronos in every place you live. To say E”Y is no better than the states is like comparing apples and oranges.

    Totally different lifestyle. Much different tayvos and yetzer haros for children. etc… I can go on for pages if I had patience.

    #681315

    haifagirl
    Participant

    I definitely think EY is the place to be. And I highly recommend Haifa. To me it’s the best city in the entire world.

    #681316

    speaktruth
    Member

    I vote for Jerusalem.

    But to be fair, its the only city in Israel that I have lived in…

    What is so gr8 abt Haifa? What’s there?

    #681317

    haifagirl
    Participant

    1) Check the weather forecast. We have a much better climate.

    2) Check the apartment ads. Our rents are much, much, much cheaper.

    3) The people here are amazingly friendly, and everybody seems to get along with everybody else. In fact, the last time I was in Jerusalem, one of my “friends” told me I should start davening at a different shul than the one I usually daven in. She didn’t think I should be friends with this particular group. I don’t hear that kind of thing in Haifa. The people here accept me for who I am.

    4) In Jerusalem I hear mostly English spoken. I always feel as if I’m in America.

    5) There is no neighborhood in Haifa that I won’t walk through during the day. (Okay, night is a different story, but that has more to do with my paranoia than any basis in reality.)

    Haifa isn’t perfect. No place is. But I lived in Jerusalem. I’ll take Haifa.

    #681319

    haifagirl
    Participant

    And BTW, when I say everybody seems to get along with everybody else, my friends here run the entire spectrum: not frum, modern Orthodox, Litvish, Chassidish. Do you find that is true in Jerusalem?

    #681322

    mamashtakah
    Member

    “We forget we are in galus, we feel comfortable with the fact that the UN proclaimed it a land for jews… ha, how riduclous could our thoughts be?”

    Actually, Rochelle, the UN didn’t declare it a land for Jews – HKB”H did. It’s in the Torah. That’s why I am here and not in the States. The Torah doesn’t mention Monsey, Flatbush, Boro Park, Lakewood, Baltimore, Cleveland, Waterbury, Teaneck, Five Towns, Crown Heights, Deale, Toronto, Montreal, or anyplace else in North America.

    But like I tell my kids – they can wake up and be in Hashem’s holy city Yerushalayim in an hour, on a bus that costs 15 shekels. Their friends have to take a plane that takes 11 hours and costs $1000.

    I would suggest that y’all read the book “Eretz Yisrael in the Parsha,” by Rav Moshe Lichtman.

    #681323

    volvie
    Member

    Actually, mamashtakah, HKB”H also threw us out of our land and sent us to Golus.

    #681324

    speaktruth
    Member

    Haifa Girl-

    In some ways you might be right about everyone getting along. Here, there are def. politics btwn askenaz, sfard, chasidich, litvish, etc.

    But, I lived in Har Nof in a bldg with chasidim, litvish (me) , dati leuimi, and sfardim and somehow we are were friendly to each other. On an ind. level every one is nice to any Jew, on a group level ppl not as much.

    #681325

    speaktruth
    Member

    Its true , Israel is flooded by Americans. First, it depends what neighborhood u live in. Also, sometimes it is nice to just speak in English!

    It is nice the amount of ppl who are making aliyah now and i enjoy helping ppl get adjusted.

    #681328

    miamimiami
    Member

    You should ALL come. It is Lovely here in “G-d’s Holy Land for Jews” !!!

    #681329

    boredstiff
    Participant

    dont you get a mitzva for every step u take in jerusalam? or is it also anywere in israel?( even haifa!)

    #681330

    estherrv
    Member

    Bored stiff, you get a mitzva for every “dalet amot” you walk in any area of Israel! That means any piece of ground I’ve not yet walked upon, can gain me more Olam Ha’Ba.

    (My hubby is a Rosh Kollel; he told me this a while ago but I don’t recall the source.)

    After stayng here in Netivot throughout last winter’s war (Oferet Yitzuka) and witnessing firsthand Hashem’s miracles and hashgacha pratit, I ask myself how anyone can compare living abroad to living here? Yes, there are imperfections. Yes, there is polarization and not enough ahavat chinam. However, the chesed here; the warmth between your average everday Israeli, no matter what his religious status, and primarily the closeness you feel to Hashem…. these things make everything worthwhile!There is perfection in only one place- Olam Ha’ba, and until we get there, Israel is the closest you can get!!

    As a student in Touro College in the mid ’70’s I felt more fear living in N.Y.C. than I do here in Netivot, kassams and all. And, if someone here ever shouts “help,” people come running from all directions to do just that. Come! You won’t regret it!!

    #681331

    HaKatan
    Participant

    The achdus and chesed is nice (and is in abundance in both Eretz Yisrael and, lihavdil, in Chutz LaAretz), but if you’re at the stage of raising children, then you have to know the chinuch options of the place you choose to live in.

    And unless you’re independently wealthy, you and/or your spouse will likely need a job wherever you choose to live.

    Hatzlacha Rabba in your decision.

    #681333

    postsemgirl
    Member

    If you have the chance to go visit or to go live in Eretz Yisroel, GO! You are so lucky. I wish I could just go to Eretz Yisroel! And all of those people who are thinking that I’m saying this because I am postsemgirl, you should know that I am a few years postsem and I already came down from the clouds. But the desire to be in Eretz Yisroel never went away.

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