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Avira > why you don’t think it’s important to look different than the non Jews
I acknowledge we have many times when we dressed differently (from midrashim on Mitzraim to medieval Europe), we have cases when Jews apparently got dressed as non-Jews maybe with certain exceptions, such as red color. Both in certain parts of modern Europe, Spain, Sephardim, Italian Jews, Talmudic times. In some cases (Germany) dressing like non-Jews was a sign of assimilation, but not always. We discussed this even for Talmidei Chachamim, kal vehomer for the general community, even if you call the community “bnei torah”.
inquisitive, +1 on using the work ehrliche. Maybe you should be telling your friends that this is what you are looking for and, B’H, you’ll find!
edited!
he never wore one bc his father in law the previous rebbe never gave him one
Thank you, AVIRA, and ALWAYS ASK QUESTIONS for your support. Not everybody is willing to answer such questions. I have a lot of Emunah that Hashem will send me the right one.
To OP:
When you have a several different groups of people (all in large numbers) dressing a certain way, it becomes part of the culture.
@inquestive, what is your other SN?
Common saychel, it’s clear that you are in the missing saychel category. Ever thought of opening a 4th account under that name? Are you accusing me of faking and changing genders here???
Sincerely,
Yocheved- I mean Yochanan. I’m still deciding on my gender. Gimme a break!!!!! Is that all that guys think about????
@commonsaychel, your negativity will get the best of you.
I hope whatever made you so cynical gets rectified.
In today’s Taanit daf, one is allowed to be immodest and behave like a Talmid chacham in matters where he has a loss – such as not working around 9 Av. So, someone who behaves like a Talmid Chacham (dresses up) in matters where it brings positive attention to him, or do it as part of culture – should not get your preference in shidduch over a guy who is not showing off.
This is not to deny reasons Avira and others bring why it helps community to stay strong by dressing certain way. Just to say, that someone who is erleche and yashar without dressing up is not to be looked down upon.
When someone dresses differently (differently – not provocative or rebellious) the majority acclimates to the new levush almost instantly.
N0M: If I start wearing a yellow jacket, purple pants with orange socks and a maroon Yarmulka, the majority will acclimate and appreciate my style, and perhaps follow suit?
Dear UJM,
You, of course! I’m going to dye all my clothes right now…… Well, first let me figure out what color maroon is.
Let’s play this one out. You come to Mincha one day dressed like that. Your every day close friends will ask and you will say that is your style. What choice do they have? Are they going to throw you out? Same with your family and everyone else? If your comfortable, what reaction can you get? Besides if your comfortable they have to be comfortable. I can’t be outraged that you are wearing what you think is appropriate.
There will be some who will yell at you and claim to know the exact reason why you dress this way. They will insist you were caused and are lashing out. But these people are the most insecure in our community. I know. I work with them. Nobody else wants to. And they have zero cultural impact. So, when the crowd becomes dulled to your get up, those that were outraged will come up with some reason why your choice of dress is within the typical boundaries.
Shabbos 146 has some discussion about the issue. The kids/young rabbanan give aq silly answer – why Babylonian T’ Ch (at least they acknowledge that there are some!) wear special (nice, Rashi) clothes: because they are not “bnei Torah” (I presume it means that people do not see them as such for their behavior is not special as of “bnei Torah”). Awaken R Yohanan corrects them that they are in galut and, thus, need to show to people that they are learned by externality. It seems from this that T’Ch in EY were not dressing like that and also that if everyone dresses special, then it defeats the purpose of separatding T’Ch from the rest.
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