Marrying Out!

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  • #593511

    Miriam
    Member

    Why do Jewish men and women marry out. Don’t they realize that we have lost more Jewish soul through intermarriage than we lost in the Holocaust.

    #718286

    yitayningwut
    Participant

    Because they don’t care. Why would they, if they don’t believe in the Torah?

    #718287

    aries2756
    Participant

    Sorry to say they don’t think about that. And those who marry out have very little connection to religion.

    #718288

    lack of education, assimilation of their parents, desire to shed their jewish roots…all very sad reasons on why it is happening

    #718289

    Feif Un
    Participant

    For those who actually do it, either they don’t realize it, or they don’t care.

    #718290

    Don’t forget the “Reform” and “Reconstructionist” movements telling them it is OK…Not all Jews were part of the Exodus, maybe this is the last shakedown before the Moshiach. Hashem wants to see who despite some of the low points of our history fought to remain Jewish….

    #718291

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    I disagree.

    Why should I sacrifice my life and love to replace some people the nazis killed?

    Besides, how does my marrying a non jew make my children any less mine?

    I think if we understand these people a little better, we will be closer to a solution.

    #718292

    popa_bar_abba

    No one said you have to sacrafice anything…although many Frum jews have larger families for that exact reason.

    Your children are still yours, they are just no Jewish…

    #718293

    Ken Zayn
    Member

    If religion means nothing to you then why shouldnt rachel cohen go out with john doe? It happens the whole time. Look at today’s news…Lauren Bush is engaged to David Lauren, the son of famous Jewish fashion designer Ralph Lauren, and Chelsea Clinton recently married Jewish investment banker Marc Mezvinsky. Its (unfortunately) not a big deal

    #718294

    AinOhdMilvado
    Participant

    I think the problem goes even further than the disease of “reform”, “conservative” and “reconstructionism”.

    Although we in the frum community may not realize it, tragically, there is a very large percentage of our brothers and sisters who are TOTALLY unaffiliated with, and are disconnected from, ANYTHING Jewish (EVEN the above mentioned deviant movements).

    The fact that their parents “were” Jewish means less to them than what their parents’ eye color may have been. To most of us this is incomprehensible, but having known people like this, believe me, it IS true.

    These people are not to be hated or despised, they are true tinokos she’nishb’u. They have not abandoned Yiddishkeit out of laziness, rebellion, or self-hate, but out of TOTAL ignorance of their heritage.

    The ONLY answer is outreach and kiruv.

    #718295

    Movements like Aish, NCSY, and of course Chabad have saved many Jewish Souls….Who knows the impact one has on another when they wear a kippah and an assimilated Jew takes notice….The Maccabeats Hanukkah song has had a tremendous impact as well….

    #718296

    aries2756
    Participant

    But is David Lauren jewish? No one has said anything about that? Is his mother Jewish? Just because Ralph Lauren is jewish that doesn’t mean his son is. So who says he is marrying outside his faith or that Lauren Bush is?

    #718297

    TheGoq
    Participant

    he rname is gonna be lauren lauren? for real?

    #718298

    MDG
    Participant

    There is a common conception that Jewish women are demanding. For example, if a guy takes out a girl and does not spend a lot. The conception is that the Jewish girl would be turned off – maybe even disrespectful, whereas a gentile girl would be appreciative.

    So if religion has some meaning to a young man (but not a lot), he might trade in his marginal feeling of religion for a real feeling of being appreciated.

    #718299

    yaff80
    Participant

    Someone told me an interesting true story this afternoon, that took place pre-war.

    A guy had met a non-Jewish girl and wanted to marry her. When he informed his parents of his plans, his father gave him an ultimatum, “its either me or her”.

    His father was a chossid of the Vishnitzer Rebbe, so the son went to the Rebbe, asking him to persuade his father to allow him to go ahead with the marriage.

    The Rebbe said, I cant persuade your father, as he never came to ask me. But I can talk to you about your predicament.

    The Rebbe proceeded to ask him details about this Goyteh. Do you love her? Is she Beautiful? Is she what you are looking for? Do you have similar aspirations? Is she geshikt? etc etc.

    The “bachur”s response was “yes” to all these questions.

    The Rebbe said to him “do you think she is the only one with these qualities, or do you suspect there may be others?

    “I dont know. I am sure there are others”

    “Do you think perhaps there is a Jewish girl with these qualities?” the Rebbe asked.

    “I havent looked, but there probably is” was the reply.

    The rebbe replied “To me its a no brainer. A father who is not replaceable v a girl who is. I know which one I would choose!”

    Seems the guy got the message loud n clear!

    #718300

    MDG
    Participant

    Intermarriage rates have skyrocketed since the past generation – not because Jews are marrying gentiles, but because gentiles are now marrying Jews.

    #718301

    Freedom of religion in America has a heavy price…

    #718302

    MDG-

    Is that not the same thing?!

    #718303

    MDG
    Participant

    Not exactly, I was talking about feelings, not necessarily actions.

    Before, there were plenty of Jews willing to intermarry, but we were not accepted in society to that degree. Even if one wanted to intermarry before, he could not so easily.

    Now that we are more accepted, many of those Jews that want to intermarry can do so easily.

    #718304

    Wish I could remember where it was, but recently I read an essay someone wrote about how in the previous generation, even if families were semi-observant or even not religous at all, there was a strong sense of pride in being Jewish. Many women were involved in Jewish organizations such as Hadassah, and there was also a lot of pride in Israel. However, their children haven’t carried on this trend – their Judaism means nothing to them other then some culinary experiences (matzohs in the spring, tzimmis in the fall). I think it was Heshy Fried on frumsatire.com who once pointed out that more people who attended Talmud Torah leave the fold then any other group. In fact, many BT’s come from zero background, versus “traditional”. It’s very sad what’s going on.

    #718305

    Ofcourse
    Member

    “But is David Lauren jewish? No one has said anything about that? Is his mother Jewish? Just because Ralph Lauren is jewish that doesn’t mean his son is. So who says he is marrying outside his faith or that Lauren Bush is?”

    Here’s the answer:

    #718306

    oomis
    Participant

    Goyim want to marry Jews. Jewish men are perceived as those who do not beat their wives, get shikker on a regular basis, or mess with other women. They are educationally ambitious, and generally make good fathers. Jewish women think that non-Jewish men are more exciting than their Jewish counterparts.

    #718307

    QuestionForYou
    Participant

    So Ralph Lauren’s wife is not Jewish?

    #718308

    Imaofthree
    Participant

    Sometimes OTD people have a hard time finding someone normal to marry that is also off the derech so they give up and date and marry non Jews. Hashem Yishmor!

    #718309

    That’s exactly what my mother told me when I was a youngster about why shiksas want to marry Jewish men! The saddest situation is when it’s your oldest friend’s child who is marrying out (the future spouse is having a deformed “conversion”). I can’t be any part of the non-simcha, and it’s definitely put more then a strain on our friendship.

    #718310

    dvorak
    Member

    As most posters here say, most who intermarry really don’t care. If your religion is nothing to you, what’s to stop you from marrying that nice/smart/funny/attractive person you met in college/your favorite bar/the park and fell in love with?

    #718311

    RuffRuff
    Member

    What oomis says is what I’ve heard that a relative’s co-worker said, as to why she was looking to marry a Jew. Not that she showed much Ahavas Yisroel, though.

    The first generation that strayed remembers the atmosphere in the home during their upbringing. That gives them a strong feeling of belonging to that people. In rome instances, they can impart that feeling to their children. Being that the feeling is so strong, it is tangible enough to pass down. It goes without saying, that there is a limit how long this can carry on. If I touch a towel wet from hand drying, I can’t make something else visibly wet enough.

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