December 27, 2019 12:04 am at 12:04 am #1814642klugeryidParticipant
I don’t think anything. I don’t read that junk.
I just quoted a relative who himself was off, that the books read like a ManuAl for going off.
To me it sounds like he was saying that it glorifies such a life decision
Either way I fail to see why it’s better than Sherlock Holmes or the likeDecember 27, 2019 12:40 am at 12:40 am #1814653
You don’t read that junk than you have no business calling it that. And your relative obviously never read it either because i have, and that description does not fit. That life is not glorified. Not everyone becomes frum at the ends of every book, but the emptiness in their lives is definitely stated.December 27, 2019 8:45 am at 8:45 am #1814663klugeryidParticipant
I’ve skinned some, I’ve schmoozed with boys who were reading them asking what the books are about.
There are books where the ”hero ”is constantly killing and maiming.
There are characters who are conniving crooks.
Husbands who are jerks
Wives who are mean
Children who ”had enough ”and throw it all away.
While officially the undercurrent of the book is supposed to be that the evil ones life is empty,
Ultimately the overt information has the evil one being successful for most of the book quite often.
That’s just the way a novel of intrigue is going to be built.
The hero is always on the defensive for most of the book.
That’s how you build suspense.
You create a hero you put him in trouble /danger /difficult situation/position and you work him out of it.
That means that for most of the book your reader is reading about a non role model being successful.
That subliminal message seeps in. ESPECIALLY SO being as the child is under the impression that this is a Jewish book written by someone like him. The fact that at the end it all falls apart doesn’t counteract the hundreds of pages where it was going well for the bad guy.
Of course I’m not saying the kid puts down the book and goes to rob a bank.
But neither does he put down the worst of non Jewish literature and go to ”Manhattan”
It’s a question of putting wrong ideals into his head.
I think many of the so called Jewish novels are awful. While there are plenty of kosher non Jewish ones.
Ultimately it should be the content that is the factor in the decision. Not the author.
This is similar to the ”Jewish music ” conversation.
For they are both really the sameDecember 28, 2019 9:47 pm at 9:47 pm #1814797DovidBTParticipant
I’m reading Benjamin Franklin’s autobiography. It’s actually fascinating. He talks a lot about his belief in G-d and support of religion, from the ethical perspective. He also discusses his systematic approach to improving his middos, which he calls “virtues”.December 29, 2019 12:27 am at 12:27 am #1814875👑RebYidd23Participant
There are some Jewish books with messages that are not appropriate.January 13, 2020 11:58 pm at 11:58 pm #1822536
<b>I agree completely with banjobob </b>January 14, 2020 1:41 am at 1:41 am #1822550
“That means that for most of the book your reader is reading about a non role model being successful.”
Not true. I have not sern that type of portrayal in any of those types of books. The :successful non role model is not lauded or praised for his behaviors, ethics or line of thinking despite his success.January 14, 2020 3:28 am at 3:28 am #1822561☢️ Rand0m3x 🎲Participant
I don’t think that’s a good argument. They said that success was portrayed,
not popularity (and real life tells us that successful people can often afford
to ignore others’ opinions of them).January 14, 2020 3:36 am at 3:36 am #1822567
I think you are ignoring the context. He is trying to say (without having actually read the books) that people doing bad things are portrayed in a positive light, giving credence to them and their actions. I was rebutting that they are portrayed negatively, not as heros, and the fact that their doings may bear fruit, they are not porrrayed as successful. This is actually a good lesson for all thise who think they are seeing such things in real life where we are without the benefit of narration.January 14, 2020 7:39 am at 7:39 am #1822537
Banjobob you’re completely forgetting about books like encyclopedia brown Donald Duck or the entire I survived seriesJanuary 17, 2020 1:00 am at 1:00 am #1823689
Btw the rambam says that there is a mitzvah to love and fear HASHEM but how can one do that it’s not an action a answer is to study science and appreciate Hashems create so why would anything be wrong with a book on the they of relativityJanuary 26, 2020 11:40 pm at 11:40 pm #1826247
Yeah I learned that my first day in science class
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