September 27, 2021 5:10 pm at 5:10 pm #2010401
Are we discussing the midrash about people travelling on a boat and one of them drilling a hole?
There is also I think a gemora about Shmuel (?) refusing to go on a boat with inappropriate people, so not to get in danger with the reshaim.September 27, 2021 5:17 pm at 5:17 pm #2010406
Daas “Nonsense. It’s always been the role of government to keep its citizens safe. Vaccine mandates in particular have been legal for over a century.”
Wrong to generalize. Maybe they were legal in regards to certain things like school admission and even then there were exemptions and even then these vaccines have been around, tried and tested for decades. It was never the case that all civil liberties be slowly taken away from you and you being barred from daily life for not taking a vaccine, no less a new technology and barely tested for even 1 year. You are mixing up things that aren’t the same. Even In 1905 Jacobson v Mass he was not forced to vaccinate and not shunned from society. The court simply ruled that the fine he was summonsed would stand. That’s all. So no this has never been the case in this country or perhaps the world for that matter. They are creating a new scenario in the world that has never been in history.September 27, 2021 5:18 pm at 5:18 pm #2010408
I used to beleive this pandemic was really deadly
You were right. And 650,000 deaths into it, it still is.
Government hypocrisy abounds, no question, but that doesn’t change our obligation to keep ourselves as safe as reasonably possible.September 27, 2021 5:54 pm at 5:54 pm #2010414
Well said syag. Because it was never about the virus. Also if you YouTube Event 201 mock pandemic which took place In October 2019 around a month and a half before the news of the virus, (hosted by Bill Gates foundation) you will realize this was in the works for a long time.
You can label everyone a conspiracy theorist, but don’t forget conspiracy theorists claimed that masks will be mandatory, vaccines will be mandatory, and that we will be barred from going to places without the vaccine passport and updated boosters. But they aren’t such conspiracies anymore are they. There are just too many coincidences for this to be a coincidence such as Gates telling us for years about his belief in depopulation, Fauci warning in 2017 that there WILL be a pandemic in Trumps presidency, gain of function and Faucis hand in this virus and funding of Wuhan lab, and better yet Gates went on air this year to warn of an even greater pandemic to come which will be much worse than Covid and we are not prepared for it. Sheesh you would think the guy would let things calm down before excitingly speaking of new ones but we should probably take that as a warning.
Whoever wants to vaccinate go ahead and move on. Supporting the vaccine is one thing, but supporting the taking away of people’s freedoms is a dangerous path. What happened to 2 weeks to stop the spread. Of course none of the science adds up because it’s not about the science.
Also none answered my one question, why did they feel a need to turn a virus that only affects animals into one that affects humans and then decide to unleash it on the world? Just as Cuomo was exposed for the rotten mafia goon he thinks he is, Facial will be exposed soon too. The higher they rise the harder they fall.September 27, 2021 5:55 pm at 5:55 pm #2010413
Even In 1905 Jacobson v Mass he was not forced to vaccinate
Vaccine “mandates” that we are discussing aren’t literally forcing anyone to vaccinate.
As to whether the differences you mentioned are legally applicable, I guess the courts will decide, but the weight of legal opinion seems to be on the side of allowing vaccine mandates such as employment and admission being conditional on being vaccinated.September 27, 2021 6:13 pm at 6:13 pm #2010422🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
“You were right. And 650,000 deaths into it, it still is.”
I’m afraid cutting off my sentence results in misrepresenting my point. It IS deadly, for a large percentage of people. It is NOT ebola.September 27, 2021 6:13 pm at 6:13 pm #2010424🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
Rightwritwer – thank you but you must have misunderstood. I was not, and do not, support your views. I am talking about the government taking advantage by requiring “level 50” safeguards for a “level 30” situation (my own labels for illustration). I am NOT talking about covid being a hoaxSeptember 29, 2021 9:54 pm at 9:54 pm #2010708
Syag I never said it was a hoax. The virus is very real but the scheme is real as well. And we already know that the virus was altered to affect humans and was leaked out of the lab either intentionally or unintentionally so just put 2 and 2 together which does not add up to 5.September 29, 2021 9:57 pm at 9:57 pm #2010710
daas you said its happened before though. Since when have employees checked your vaccine status as a requirement to work? Also there are many medical workers refusing to take the vax so that must mean something since they usually arent hesitant.
So as I said before vaccine requirements have been around mostly just for school, but even then there were exemptions. Never has there been a mandate for everything such as employment, going to a restaurant or gym or museum etc., with the potential for supermarkets and all basic needs, and all this without exemptions. So no this hasnt happened before and certainly not for decades as you mentioned.September 29, 2021 10:12 pm at 10:12 pm #2010712
Since when have employees checked your vaccine status as a requirement to work?
I don’t know if that’s happened or not, but it’s legal.
Also there are many medical workers refusing to take the vax
Not many doctors though, and they have a much better science background.
Never has there been a mandate for everything such as employment, going to a restaurant or gym or museum etc., with the potential for supermarkets and all basic needs, and all this without exemptions.
Never before has there been such a need for it.September 29, 2021 10:27 pm at 10:27 pm #2010720
Doctors as well and there are also many doctors who explain why they are not for the vaccine.
“Never before has there been such a need for it.”
-oh no? Smallpox,measles, Sars1, Influenza, (Bubonic Plague) Black Death,Polio, Spanish Flu, Asian Flu, H1N1 Swine Flu…September 29, 2021 11:26 pm at 11:26 pm #2010731
Doctors as well
There will always be a small minority of doctors who are against any treatment or preventative medication, but I believe it’s very small when it comes to this vaccine for adults without prior infection.September 29, 2021 11:26 pm at 11:26 pm #2010730
Smallpox,measles, Sars1, Influenza, (Bubonic Plague) Black Death,Polio, Spanish Flu, Asian Flu, H1N1 Swine Flu…
What about them? Did they create the same health crisis we have now, with as easy a solution?September 29, 2021 11:46 pm at 11:46 pm #2010737
They were way worse the mortality rates were almost 100%.September 30, 2021 7:29 am at 7:29 am #2010748charliehallParticipant
Not sure how anyone should not know about the strict vaccine mandates here any more than they would not know about the strict gun laws here.
Please if you are not vaccinated, boycott New York City. It will help our economy and our health.September 30, 2021 7:30 am at 7:30 am #2010751
re: medical workers
it seems that 94% of doctors (AMA June 2021) are vaccinated, 50% of remaining plan to.
a less clear Aug 2021 survey of 5000 nurses:
88% of nurses are “vaccinated or planning to” – I presume before the firing deadline.
59% of nurses are in favor of mandates, another 12% – only for those who face the public, 29% againstSeptember 30, 2021 7:32 am at 7:32 am #2010753
Syag> . It IS deadly, for a large percentage of people. It is NOT ebola.
And this is the source of moral confusions and dilemmas. In face of a deadlier disease, everyone would just stay home for 2 weeks and get rid of it. As it is now, the moment numbers start going down, whether due to SD or vaccines or weather or chance, population increases activity and numbers go up.
We have an analogy in halakha, where more borderline cases require more work (such as karbonos for inadvertent and not purposeful violations).September 30, 2021 9:05 am at 9:05 am #2010846
Charlie”Please if you are not vaccinated, boycott New York City. It will help our economy and our health”
-actually it definitely won’t help our economy which if you haven’t noticed is already on the verge of collapse and will probably have no impact on your health since you are vaccinated and that should protect you shouldn’t it? Aside for the fact that not everyone is a constant walking and talking virus so maybe just keep that in mind.September 30, 2021 9:46 am at 9:46 am #2010874
They were way worse the mortality rates were almost 100%.
Please be more specific. Which of those was a worldwide pandemic with an effective vaccine which was not “mandated” in some form?September 30, 2021 9:46 am at 9:46 am #2010875
and will probably have no impact on your health since you are vaccinated and that should protect you shouldn’t it?
Stop with your binary thinking. A vaccine isn’t either 100% effective or 0%.September 30, 2021 9:55 am at 9:55 am #2010884
a less clear Aug 2021 survey of 5000 nurses:
I believe that the higher the level of education among the various categories of healthcare workers, the higher the vaccination rates.September 30, 2021 11:15 am at 11:15 am #2010918
Spanish Flu and HIV, also keep in mind that there were less people in the world so you have to go based on ratio to present day not just numbers(but even then the numbers still beat Covid. Aside for the fact that we already know that the Covid numbers are extremely inflated due to labeling every hospitalized patient or death as a Covid case regardless if it was or wasnt and even the WHO admitted that.
“Stop with your binary thinking. A vaccine isn’t either 100% effective or 0%.”
-So whats your solutionSeptember 30, 2021 11:58 pm at 11:58 pm #2011184
rw > Covid numbers are extremely inflated due to labeling every hospitalized patient or death as a Covid case
look up the most reliable statistics of “excess deaths” per country – they show how many people died in 2020 v. previous years.
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