March 3, 2011 9:47 pm at 9:47 pm #595469shlishiMember
Can anyone share stories of how the poretz treated the Yidden in the alte heim, and how the Yidden overcame the nisoyon?March 3, 2011 10:26 pm at 10:26 pm #1075705WolfishMusingsParticipant
Please forgive the ignorance, but who (or what) is the “poretz?”
(Yes, I know that “poretz” means “one who breaches,” but that doesn’t really help me with the question.)March 3, 2011 10:48 pm at 10:48 pm #1075706waiter1Member
wolf: a poretz was usually a jew hater who would rent out an inn to a yid and every year the yid would have to pay back money from what he made by selling schnapps and guests at inn and if not he would be thrown into dungeon and then killed with his family but Hsshem many times would send someone to rescue the yid this happened only in the alter heimMarch 3, 2011 10:56 pm at 10:56 pm #1075707popa_bar_abbaParticipant
The poritz was the nobleman. They were the feudal landowners, the russian aristocracy. They often lived in France, since that was fashionable. They needed someone to run their estate and collect the rents, and would often hire a Jew.
This caused grief from both ends, as the landowners would be upset if the profits were not coming in, and the ???? hated them for collecting the money.
The Cossack rebellion of 1648 of was rebellion against these landowners, and was joined by the peasants. Naturally, the Jews were targeted, the landowners were largely not even there.March 3, 2011 10:56 pm at 10:56 pm #1075708✡onegoal™Participant
This isn’t with a poretz but it’s funny.
There was a sultan who called for a Jew and a Karaite to debate their religions. When they arrived at the palace they stopped at the door to remove their shoes. The Karaite removed his shoes, left them by the door and entered. The Jew removed his shoes picked them up and carried them in with him. When they entered the throne room and stood before the sultan the Jew was holding his shoes. The Karaite said to the sultan “Look at this Jew, he brings his shoes before the sultan, what disrespect!” The jew replied “There was a man in history who removed his shoes, It was Moshe Rabeinu. He removed his shoes when he went up onto Har Sinai and when he came back down they were gone because a Karaite had stolen them. I decided not to take the risk so I carried mine in.” The Karaite replied “This is nonsense, there were no Karaites back then.” With that the Jew said “Than how can you claim you were the ones the torah was given to?”
Compliment of Impact by Aryeh KaplanMarch 3, 2011 10:58 pm at 10:58 pm #1075709WolfishMusingsParticipant
Thanks for the clarification.
The WolfMarch 3, 2011 11:14 pm at 11:14 pm #1075710🍫Syag LchochmaParticipant
shkoiyach – great story.March 3, 2011 11:47 pm at 11:47 pm #1075711
I don’t know if they were usually Jew haters, but the stories are usually about the Jew haters.March 4, 2011 2:50 am at 2:50 am #1075712metrodriverMember
HaleiVi; They (The “Pritzim”, plural for “Poritz”.) were not specifically Jew-haters, but money hungry. They needed tons of money to finance their ostentatious, depraved lifestyle. And their methods of enforcing payment were brutal. They could mete out any form of punishment (For non-payment of rent) and there was no one to stop them. Some of the stories that evolved around the “P’ritzim” and their Jewish tenants and managers are true. Others are fiction. But, they’re part of the folklore.March 4, 2011 5:41 am at 5:41 am #1075713bezalelParticipant
Jews weren’t allowed to own land so the made up stories about evil land owners. Christians weren’t allowed to lend with interest so they made up stories about evil bankers.March 4, 2011 3:30 pm at 3:30 pm #1075714
As the saying goes:
In a democracy your vote counts; in a feudal system it’s the other way around.March 4, 2011 3:37 pm at 3:37 pm #1075715YW Moderator-80Member
Compliment of Impact by Aryeh Kaplan
dovid kaplanMarch 4, 2011 7:02 pm at 7:02 pm #1075716msseekerMember
No, Bezalel. Chritians killed Jews. Jews didn’t kill Christians. Learn your history.March 4, 2011 10:15 pm at 10:15 pm #1075717bezalelParticipant
This isn’t a Jews vs. Christians issue here. Its about an oppressed individual (or group of individuals) stereotyping an entire group based on the actions of a subset of that group. there were good and evil bankers just like there were good and evil land owners (you can say that about any profession).
Although I wasn’t there at the time I beleive Barnabas was killed by Jews as were others who attempted to convert Jews.March 5, 2011 6:10 pm at 6:10 pm #1075718600 Kilo BearMember
Bezalel, your theory is no better than the work of David Irving. It also smacks of the work of the “new historians” in EY.
Jews were allowed only to rent land and were at the mercy of these pritzim. As soon as a Jewish inn started to become profitable, the pritzim would raise the rent and throw the innkeeper in jail, knowing his people would raise money for pidyon shevuim no matter how much it cost.
I actually know of a case here in Ukraine where a modern-day poritz (who today are called gangsters) bought off a judge and prosecutor and did just that to a Yid who had business dealings with him and had trouble because of the crisis. And yes, the money was raised to get the Yid out of prison after only three days of remand.
The pritzim also used the Jews to do their dirty work, which is what resulted in the Chmelnicki pogroms.
Killing someone who is out to convert Jews is a mitzvah, if your name is Pinchas haKohen. Yad leAchim handles it a bit differently today.
However, the only S Barnabas that I know indeed exists is an excellent hospital and burn centre in New Jersey that should be filled with all of our soinim.
The notzri legends are just that. We don’t even know for sure if yoshke existed, let alone who killed him.March 6, 2011 12:21 am at 12:21 am #1075719shlishiMember
bezalel, now you are down to relying on legends from the new testament for stories on “saint” barnabas?May 4, 2015 12:26 am at 12:26 am #1075720JosephParticipant
I’m in the mood for some poretz stories.May 5, 2015 12:16 am at 12:16 am #1075721JosephParticipant
Do you think any pritzim read this site?May 5, 2015 12:28 am at 12:28 am #1075722👑RebYidd23Participant
noMay 5, 2015 12:35 am at 12:35 am #1075723oyyoyyoyParticipant
lemme get this straight. All sn with “joseph” in the subtitle are you? i thought a mod with a bad sense of humor just randomly put them on people. Oh, and i thought the same mod gave a new guy the name “joseph” even though it wasnt the real joseph.May 6, 2015 1:17 am at 1:17 am #1075724☢️ Rand0m3x 🎲Participant
Not all of them are necessarily Joseph, but they were thought to be.May 6, 2015 4:36 am at 4:36 am #1075725
There was one a Poritz who accused his Moshke of being Joseph. Moshke was lost. He ran to his mod, who said he can’t help because he can’t undo what another mod did. So he went to the frog, who interceded on his behalf. Then, in middle of the night —
Sorry, got to go. Maybe I’ll finish another time if you’ll go to bed nicely.
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