Question about talmud torah

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  • #600249

    mik5
    Participant

    When learning Torah, is a person obligated to say the words out loud, or can he be yotzei the mitzvah of talmud torah by reading silently? What about when a person is learning the Gemara, Shulchan Aruch, or just basic halachos? Is there a distinction between learning the actual text and reading commentary (for instance, commentary on the parsha, or a summary of halachos relating to this or that matter)?

    If there is an obligation to learn aloud, how loud must one’s voice be? And what if he is unable to learn aloud because of the environment (e.g., if one wishes to learn online at work when he has a free moment)? If a person is not aware of the obligation to learn out loud, does he still fulfill the mitzvah?

    #822412

    Toi
    Participant

    out loud. vilna gaon.

    #822413

    Torah4Me
    Participant

    I can’t answer all your questions but it is definately better to say the words out loud. Some pasken that one can not make a siyum on a masechta if one learnt it without saying the words.

    #822414

    kingdavid
    Participant

    According to many poskim, in order to have the mitzvah of ‘talmud torah’ you need to either say the words or hear it from a rebbi. If you don’t hear it then you have a zchus of thinking in learning but you are not yotzei the chiyuv of ‘talmud torah’.

    Even listening to a recording is not the same as hearing it from the mouth of a rebbi for this mitzvah.

    #822415

    sam4321
    Participant

    The Gemara(eruvin 54) talks about the importance of learning out loud and if one does not he will lose his learning.I believe the Shulchan Aruch Harav says one does not fulfill his obligation learning silently.

    #822416

    Sam2
    Participant

    One should learn so that he can hear the words. Some have an idea to say that if you are reading out of a Sefer and only reading with your eyes but not saying the words that you are only Yotzei Hirhur Talmud Torah and not Limud Talmus Torah. This opinion makes little sense as it would imply that one does not have to make a Birchas Hatorah on just reading from a Sefer or that one could learn from a Sefer without mouthing the words on Tishah B’av/during Aveilus. I also heard someone ask Rav Schachter this and he said that it is just as complete a Mitzvah if you are reading from a Sefer without saying the words out loud.

    #822417

    Obaminator
    Member

    kingdavid: So when I quietly learn from a sefer or listen to a Torah Tape, there is no mitzvah?

    #822419

    sam4321
    Participant

    Just to add the Mishna Brura(47:5,7) says one should admonish those who learn biyun who don’t say some words out loud after saying the bracha unless they said the pesukim right after.The GRA was also makpid on one not to think in Torah until he recited the bracha.(which seems that he held thinking in Torah one could be yotzei his mitzvah of talmud Torah)

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