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I’m new to the whole shidduch thing, and I’m curious if anyone else readily sends photos of themselves out. It’s not like there isn’t a picture on my profile. Is my face not enough?
It is very offensive, extremely wrong, and it should absolutely be denied.
In my personal opinion, it is completely inappropriate for shadchanim to ask for full-length pictures. I don’t know which shadchanim you’re going to… no one ever asked me for that, and I met a ton of shadchanim.
I think the idea of sending a picture at all is not tzniusdik. However, I asked a prominent Rov in Flatbush, and he told me that I should send if asked for one. Therefore, I did not have a photo on my resume, but if a shadchan asked for one, then I would send it. This never happened to me, but I would not have sent a picture if the shadchan had told me outright that s/he was going to send it to a boy. If someone had asked me for a full-length picture, I probably would’ve refused and civilly but furiously ended the conversation.
Look, everyone has their own ideas of what’s normal, but I think that full-length pictures is going very far.
I agree, full-length pictures border on extreme … and a tad creepy, too.
By not giving a picture, you filter out the creeps.
Shuli -“some of them told me to send a few full-length/body pictures.”
I see nothing wrong with it. It used to be, we would all go on blind dates. Nowadays, with the Shidduch crisis people don’t want to waste their time!
It’s despicable that this is even allowed halachically, unless POSSIBLY in the case of someone who lives VERY far away (across the country or in another country), and the financial cost to meet, would exceed the cost of the date. Then, a person should have some idea if there is any potential before going to such time, trouble, and expense, though I personally don’t hold this way.
Health, in my humble opinion, it is NEVER a waste of time for two people to meet. Even if they are not meant for each other, they may be meant for each other’s relative, friend, co-worker. And in this day and age, they need to learn how to interact more normally. If one views a date as a waste of time, rather than as a learning experience,then takeh, it IS a waste of time.
OOmis -“Health, in my humble opinion, it is NEVER a waste of time for two people to meet”
Once upon a time, people were more relaxed & they had more time. Nowadays, even young people are in a rat race!
We’re coming from different worlds, in the MO world, the boy probably already knows the girl or what she looks like.
This isn’t the case in the Yeshivashe world. We don’t want to waste time. I’m sure that this is the reason the girl also asks for a pic.!
I don’t see the problem with it. physical attraction is, like it or not, an important component of dating. incidentally, halacha is actually very clear that a guy should indeed look (not leer) at the girl to see if he’s attracted to her physically. and if he’s not, then the date will probably be a waste of time.
I don’t see the problem with it. physical attraction is, like it or not, an important component of dating. incidentally, halacha is actually very clear that a guy should indeed look (not leer) at the girl to see if he’s attracted to her physically.
Pictures are more like leering. Yes, attractiveness is important, and should be considered in the context of the date. A picture is only about the physical, though. I think it’s degrading to the kavod of a bas Yisroel.
and if he’s not, then the date will probably be a waste of time.
Probably, but not definitely? By that standard, no one should should ever go out, because probably it won’t work out. I think the kavod of a bas Yisroel is worth whatever “sacrifice” might be involved in going out without a picture, and kol shekein what the OP is talking about, which is disgusting.
DY, the Halacha is not like you (Shulchan Aruch Even HaEzer 21,3 – and note that it is even wothy to do so). I would add that it is often possible to learn about someone’s personality from the face. This is known as chochmat hapartzuf (physiognomy) and has been confirmed by scientific studies ((Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, vol 4, p 44 and British Journal of Psychology, vol 98, p 111).
DY -“A picture is only about the physical, though. I think it’s degrading to the kavod of a bas Yisroel.”
Why is it degrading? Be realistic, it’s degrading to say No, because Daddy doesn’t have enough dough in the bank!
“and if he’s not, then the date will probably be a waste of time.
Probably, but not definitely? By that standard, no one should should ever go out, because probably it won’t work out.”
What makes you rally against pics, requiring resumes is much worse!
Very well said DY.
Were the ones who asked for the pictures male or female? I would be suspect about the men asking, and not crazy even if women do. Having said that, however, boys’ mothers (yes back to them again) want skinny reeds for their sons and not everyone’s objective opinion is alike so they probably want something verifiable. In any case, politely decline and move on to a different shadchan
Avi, from their face; not from a picture of their face.
DY, the Halacha is not like you (Shulchan Aruch Even HaEzer 21,3 – and note that it is even wothy to do so).
You seem to not understand what I said.
Ubiquitin, thank you.
Flatbusher, they are asking for a picture of the girl; whether it’s the boy or his mother (or both) looking is anyone’s guess.
Health
“Why is it degrading? Be realistic, it’s degrading to say No, because Daddy doesn’t have enough dough in the bank!”
I don’t follow, If the Father’s bank account information was required that is also degrading (though not as much as a full body picture, and the tznius issue wouldnt apply)
“What makes you rally against pics, requiring resumes is much worse!”
Are you serious? All a resume is some basic information about the boy/girl where they went to school where they daven and references how is that comparable to demanding a picture, wait just her face isnt enough apperently, rather a “full-length” picture. LEt alone worse or “much worse”
Are you serious when you type these things? OR are you trying to make some sort of point?
If the mother of the boy is asking for the pic – she is not the one who has to be attracted to the girl. If the BOY is asking – that sits very poorly with me. Pictures lie. Some people photograph badly. Some photograph SO well, that meeting them in person is actually a let-down. There has to be a better process in place. People should just meet each other and then see if they are interested.
Why not just make an online shopping style website with pictures of girls, so the boy can buy whichever girl he wants based on what he sees in the picture?
RY, a girl slave/shidduch market stand would be easier.
I am happily married but I think pictures should only be given upon request. Not attached to the resume as it’s done now. This way after reading the resume and they think there is a possibility then if they want a picture they should get it. Right now the first thing they see is the picture and a decision is made based on that alone
Ubiq -“I don’t follow, If the Father’s bank account information was required that is also degrading (though not as much as a full body picture, and the tznius issue wouldnt apply)”
My point is that there is nothing degrading in asking for a full body pic. OTOH, why should people ask about bank accounts?
“Are you serious? All a resume is some basic information about the boy/girl where they went to school where they daven and references how is that comparable to demanding a picture, wait just her face isnt enough apperently, rather a “full-length” picture. LEt alone worse or “much worse”
Are you serious when you type these things? OR are you trying to make some sort of point?”
The whole point is to look for Chesronos, not just some basic information!
Reb yid that is brlliant!
I think you are on to something
and maybe prices attached indicating how much nadin they come with
Ubiq -“Reb yid that is brlliant!
I think you are on to something
and maybe prices attached indicating how much nadin they come with”
No, he’s not! What do you think these Frum online Shidduch sites offer? A lot of people don’t let them post their pics!
And as far as $ is concerned, they won’t give it even after marriage.
RY, pretty much any shidduch website does almost exactly what you suggest.
Sorry, I was under the impression that users of shidduch websites dated before getting married.
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