Sheva Brochos

A seudas mitzvah should be fleishigs.

I think Joseph’s post here (sorry Joseph!) highlights one of weaknesses of the CF and similar discussions elsewhere. In particular, people tend to post essentially made-up things.

Perhaps Joseph could have written something more thoughtful along the following lines. Although a braisa in arvei pesachim states that אין שמחה אלא בבשר ויין, that is already qualified as being only בזמן בית המקדש (ועכשיו שאין בית המקדש קיים, אין שמחה אלא ביין are the words in the continuation). Even on shabbos, which you probably would also call a seudas mitzvah the Shulchan Aruch HaRav (242,2) wrote that there’s no chiyuv to have meat if one does not like meet.

The Maharam Shik (AH 89:2) actually writes that one is actually chayav in basar at a seudas mitzvah, but it’s not clear that this is universally accepted. In fact by a bris milah, which most probably believe constitutes a seudas mitzvah, it seems that many kehilose had takanose that they davka not be fleishig, and only include fish, because of the high costs. Of course if there was a real chiyuv to have meat such takanose would have been meaningless.

Of course Joseph can offer other perspectives, but blankly stating “A seudas mitzvah should be fleishigs.” doesn’t really contribute anything to the discussion. Indeed yid18 was just asking what people would prefer. For the record, if it’s at dinner time I’d probably prefer fleishig, unless I had had many fleishig meals that week in which case I might prefer milchigs.

yid18: It depends on a few factors. Is it a Sheva Brochos Breakfast, Brunch, Lunch, Dinner? One of my children specifically asked for a milchigs sheva brochos dinner as he already had fleishigs for 4 days in a row.

Joepsh: While I understand the concept of ein simcha elah b’basar u’vayayin, I have have seen milchigs at a seudas bris, bar mitzvah, sheva brochos and heard about a chasuna where the chosson and kallah preferred milchigs.

I prefer fleishigs.

GH: Maybe women would prefer fish; men would prefer meat (ok they would like sushi). The OP though was talking about dairy which I (and my family) take to mean baked ziti, eggplant parmesan, penne ala vodka.

We also tend to forget that during the week of “sheva brochos”, anytime the chosson and kallah eat a meal with 10 men (and a panim chadoshos) they can recite sheva brochos. So if I invite 10 neighbors for a pancake/waffle/french toast breakfast we can recite sheva brochos.

I know this is an aside, but I think what GH meant was that younger people today, perhaps moreso the educated crowd, are more conscious of food choices.

Eating at a massive wedding shmorg an hour before eating a full-size wedding dinner? Serving massive plates of oil-flowing potato kugel and cholent at your shul kiddush, and then going home to eat a massive shabbos lunch whose only vegetables are the the potatoes and onions in yet another cholent? Want to give your kids candy for answering a dozen parsha questions, then potato chips at pirchei and pizza and soda at avos ubanim? All while implicitly discouraging exercise? These are fine choices (it’s a free country!), but don’t be surprised if you find high rates of diabetes, heart problems, and teeth decay that are typically associated with the poorest populations.

Joseph, the source for your health claim for frum people? And, you were trolling , not facilitating a discussion.

“rates of diabetes, heart problems, and teeth decay ”

Health professionals who service the frum population can answer this. All else, is speculation.

Wine & dine is fine.

At first I had the same reaction to Joseph, hey, did you just make that up?, but realized that I also did the exact same thing! About the tooth decay, a good friend works as a dentist in Lakewood and told me how much tooth decay he sees, and how much worse his patients’ teeth are than kids he sees in goyish communities. About the diabetes etc, I guess I don’t actually know that, but I do see relatively high numbers of grossly obese people when I visit Passaic, Lakewood, Brooklyn, Monsey than I do in other communities. But I guess we should ask someone that works as a health professional in that population who can tell us more. Anyone here?

I hear that. Of course I trust my good friend but I guess there’s no reason you should since you’d don’t even know me, let alone this friend.

And my anecdotal observations are just that – anecdotal. I guess you don’t see higher rates of obesity among chareidi communities than among other ones, so obviously I can’t disagree with that if that’s what you see.

I’m glad to have helped get you laughing, LC.

Zionist ministries are not, by any means, frum health experts. Their anti-frum bias is represented in anything they produce. Even if you accurately quote them, their opinions must be taken with, pardon the pun, a mouthful of salt.

And here’s a quote from Litzman in an article in Hamodia (MSM?) less than a year ago: “In the past, Rabbi Litzman said that among the biggest “victims” of junk food was the chareidi public. Children are often “treated” to snacks at Talmud Torahs or shuls after they participate in learning sessions, and that practice needed to stop, or at least to be adjusted in order to prompt children to eat more healthily.”