Should a bochur have a beard?

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  • #1802117

    Joeshmo
    Participant

    Should a bochur have a beard? What if he is in yeshiva and he wants to have it, but his Rebbeim tell him to take it off?
    Is shaving really permitted in any shita?

    #1802137

    lakewhut
    Participant

    Shaving, not. Cutting, yes.

    #1802139

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Why would his rebbeim instruct a yeshiva bochur to shave his beard unless, of course, he is doing it to call attention to himself? Alternatively, would he also tell him that while he is home shaving, also change his blue shirt to white?

    #1802140

    No there are no kosher shavers at all. take a look at koshershavers.com .

    #1802149

    Whatsaktome
    Participant

    Shaving is technically permitted according to many opinions, but I think everyone would agree that it’s better not to shave

    #1802178

    Depends on the age of the bochur. In my mesivta days in the mid 1970’s, the mesivta bochurim in my yeshiva were not allowed to have beards. Shaving was considered normal back them. And yes the shavers were not lift and cut.

    #1802173

    Yabia Omer
    Participant

    Why is everything with”grum” world so superficial and outwardly?

    #1802175

    lakewhut
    Participant

    Actually many would say today to shave

    #1802177

    haskafah
    Participant

    Zoomer when did you become the poske acharon.
    Reb Moshe ztzl you to have people come and show them there shavers. He was known to test them on his arm seeing how it cut the hair. There are 2 organizations that have poskim/rabbanim that check and create appliances for the frum vely. They have a list that give you the names of shavers they found to be acceptable. Paskin for your not evryone else.

    #1802179

    no shavers are asur thats it final no other opinions

    #1802209

    reform rabbi
    Participant

    A bachur should keep his facial hair however he wants. If he wants to keep it in conformity with jewish tradition – then grow it. If he wants to look 20th century – then shave it.

    If the yeshiva tries to dictate matters of personal taste such as facial hair, then you shouldn’t go to that yeshiva!

    #1802279

    Chossid
    Participant

    This is the book Hadras Ponim Zokein, if you want to know what poskim hold regarding shaving.
    https://zbermanbooks.com/%D7%94%D7%93%D7%A8%D7%AA-%D7%A4%D7%A0%D7%99-%D7%96%D7%A7%D7%9F

    Be aware if you read it you might just feel guilty shaving.

    (Even if you say it was written with an agenda. He brings the actual tzshuvaois so there’s nothing really to argue about).

    Also lately there was a video posted (if I’m not misstakin) of Harav Kaniefski telling someone to cut his tshup and grow his beard).

    #1802304

    knaidlach
    Participant

    i never understood it. there are so many shitos of gedolei yisroel that shaving is an isur min hatora. why wouldnt shomrei tora umitsva behidur keep that? why choose the shitos who are maikel when so many shitos are machmir?

    #1802329

    That’s 4 different screennames in 2 threads. Not a record yet…

    #1802398

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    There are apps which use AI to compare word usage, style, spelling an grammatical errors etc. to provide an estimated probability of several postings have been made by the same individual. You have to select one of the postings as a “baseline” and then compare comments posted by indiviuals with other screen names and you will get a readout of which of those postings have the highest probability of having been posted by your baseline poster. How accurate are they??? Well, whats the likelihood of Reb Yosef, Charlie Hall and chabadshalucha being the same person???

    #1802403

    charliehall
    Participant

    I personally think all males beyond bar mitzvah age should have beards. I last shaved in 1986.

    #1802441

    Benephraim
    Participant

    Please remember that the ื—ืคืฅ ื—ื™ื™ื was against but others in the ืžืฉืคื—ืช ื”ืจื‘ were for. The ืขื•ืœื ื”ืชื•ืจื” in Europe were ืžืชื™ืจ.So too ืจื‘ ื”ืขืจืฉ ืคืกื— permitted. As did Harav Paleyeff in ื™ืฆื—ืง ืืœื—ื ืŸ.

    #1802500

    Joseph
    Participant

    GHD: How’d you figure out that Charlie is my alter ego? Was it me posting as Charlie calling for a rule of no-shaving post-Bar Mitzvah?

    #1802546

    benignuman
    Participant

    The Shulchan Aruch permits shaving (non-razor of course). There are opinions that shaving (without a razor) is patur aval asur. There’s nothing wrong with having a beard (according the vast majority). Both shaving and not shaving are well within normal halachic practice. The bochur should do whatever he wants.

    #1802593

    Joseph
    Participant

    Benig: How can you advocate doing whatever you want after acknowledging it’s assur (avul patur)?

    #1802603

    benignuman
    Participant

    Joseph,

    I think you misunderstood what I wrote. The Shulchan Aruch (and Rama) hold that it is mutar. There are other opinions that argue and hold patur aval asur. There is nothing wrong with relying on the Shulchan Aruch and shaving.

    #1802657

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    See the Chasam Sofer O’CH 159. Thw minhag was that bachurim shaved.

    #1802658

    huju
    Participant

    Bochurs should not have beards if they need glue.

    #1802660

    Uncle Ben
    Participant

    Benig; The Shulchan Aruch permits cutting the beard with scissors “ke’ayn ta’ar”.
    The question Poskim deal with is if certain shavers go beyond that and are like an actual ta’ar.

    #1802663

    knaidlach
    Participant

    BENIGNUMA. “the bachur should do whatever he wants” ????????? we were taught to do what HASHEM wants not what WE want. even according to the shitos who are matir, its obvious that being machmir to be yotshe the shitos who are machmir is hvodas HASHEM, letting your beard grow is serving HASHEM, doing it for HASHEM, and shaving is for YOURSELF.

    #1802682

    Whatsaktome
    Participant

    Uncle ben: there are poskim which say that any shaving is prohibited including what the shulchan aruch is matir

    #1802688

    benignuman
    Participant

    Uncle Ben,

    “K’ayn ta’ar” means “like an actual ta’ar but not an actual ta’ar.” Some have argued that some modern shavers are halachically “ta’ar.” Which is why people bring shavers to a Rav to check out. The spinning blade shavers never get super close though.

    #1802687

    laughing
    Participant

    Matza ball – Hashem gave us b’chirat chofsheet. So an individual can make any decision they want. Though you can make the argument that any decision you make has been preordained.

    #1802708

    CTRebbe
    Participant

    I don’t think Joseph, Charlie Hall and chabadshalucha could be the same person. No one could have that much time on their hands to make all those comments. Unless of course he/she is paid employees of YWN who writes all day in the coffee room to give it more life and get people upset.

    Hmmmm

    #1802713

    CTLAWYER
    Participant

    My brothers and I all had full beards from the age of 16. My 12th grade rebbe told me it was inappropriate for a high school bochur in his class. Mt father Z”L came in to see the menahel. He told the menahel that the baby raced rebbe was jealous that I could raise a full beard and he couldn’t. The menahel and my father had a good laugh and the subject was never brought up again.

    #1802717

    benignuman
    Participant

    Knaidlach,

    I simply meant that he has both options available to him. He should follow his netias neshoma. Being machmir is not always avodas Hashem. Every chumrah has ramifications that need to be weighed before being taken. Additionally, taking on a chumrah without learning the sugya and having a netiya towards the shittos that are machmir is not avodas Hashem–it is amaratzus.

    #1802739

    CJF
    Participant

    I believe ever bochur should have a huge beard a shaved head (except the payos) wear leather jackets and ride Harley Davidsons. ๐Ÿ™‚

    #1802742

    YOY
    Participant

    What does that mean?

    #1802751

    i totaly agree with CJF but everyone also has a shotgun

    #1802784

    Yoel
    Participant

    Choosid,
    R’ Moshe got furious when he saw the Sefer Hadras Ponim Zaken.

    #1802804

    Matza ball โ€“ Hashem gave us bโ€™chirat chofsheet. So an individual can make any decision they want. Though you can make the argument that any decision you make has been preordained.

    No, you can’t make the argument that our choices are preordained, since we have bechirah.

    #1802832

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Dy
    Thanks for clearing that right up.
    Many ืจืืฉื•ื ื™ื say that’s a conundrum that no human mind can untangle.
    But now we are smooth sailing
    Thanks ๐Ÿ˜Š

    #1803022

    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    The Rambam questions if Hashem’s knowledge affects our free choice. He answers that it is beyond our understanding that it does not. I think Hashem knows how our mind operates and what our final decision will be without affecting our decision.

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