July 29, 2011 6:09 am at 6:09 am #598300
Everyone here says that they are under the “frum, yeshiva world, black hat”, whatever else you may call it banner.
But in reality, people here have very different standards of frumkeit and yiddishkeit. If you want a prime illustration of this, see the “do you watch movies” thread.
So maybe there should be two seperate coffee rooms, one for the people leaning more towards the super – frum/chassidish side, and one for the normal people not leaning that way.
If anyone has a better solution to this issue, please say it here. Or start your own thread with your own idea.
I think that this would be beneficial to everyone. The super frum won’t need to be “appalled” by the “shocking” leniencies of the others, and the normal will not need to be constantly bombarded with demands that they stop eating gefilte fish, or that they walk with their eyes covered in the streets led by a guide dog, and things of that nature.
(what the super frum are even doing on the internet g-d knows. Maybe “kiruv” LoL)July 29, 2011 11:39 am at 11:39 am #792221
Hard to tell which way you lean. Could it toward the “normal” side? I guess that would make the other side abnormal. Hmmm . . .July 29, 2011 12:29 pm at 12:29 pm #792222
It seems like you came here to “stir the pot.” Hopefully you will get bored of that soon…July 29, 2011 1:07 pm at 1:07 pm #792224
People that are more frum than you are usually not any less “normal” than you.
The one reason we all love the coffee room is to hear and argue and discuss all the different views on almost anything you could think of.
Splitting it up will make it much less interesting and not as entertaining.
I don’t think you have to split it up, people just have to understand that not everyone fits in the same mold as they do and its not that terrible.
And yes the super frum that are bored at work with internet should be here better than anywhere else.July 29, 2011 1:14 pm at 1:14 pm #792225
If the normal people had their own coffee room it would be popular but the super lenient/borderline frum wouldn’t have too many people to talk to in their separate room.July 29, 2011 1:40 pm at 1:40 pm #792226
The one reason we all love the coffee room is to hear and argue and discuss all the different views on almost anything you could think of.
And within many families there are members with different levels of observance. Only Hashem can judge who is more heilig. We dont see everything everyone does.July 29, 2011 1:53 pm at 1:53 pm #792227
I don’t like labels, especially the ones you used. Watching TV does not make you “normal” and not watching does not make you super frum…
One of the reasons I like coming here is for the lively debates…July 29, 2011 2:06 pm at 2:06 pm #792228
“Should the coffee room be split into two” and when I read that I thought you were gonna say one for boys and one girls! but for my opinion, I agree with ravkahane. People on the “super – frum/chassidish side” are very much “normal”.July 29, 2011 3:45 pm at 3:45 pm #792229
We can all learn from each other and there is no reason to make separations.July 29, 2011 3:48 pm at 3:48 pm #792230
I think the whole beauty of this “Coffee Room” is that people from all sorts of different backgrounds, and have different ideals about things, can come together and discuss things openly. True, some people like attacking others, but let’s not focus on that. Let’s focus on how beneficial it is that we can have a place to positively discuss our similarities and differences.July 29, 2011 4:41 pm at 4:41 pm #792231
quark2: “Should the coffee room be split into two”
when I read that I thought: coffee room for the adults, cocoa room for the children (don’t really like using the word ‘kids'[= baby goats])..July 29, 2011 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #792232
I would Neverrrr want to split it up.
the reason why i like coffeeroom is that you can talk about topics with so many DIFFERENT people and get tonss of opinions from bothhhh sides, and a lot of help. …without having someone stare at your clothing, or in real life, won’t talk to you because you are in a different worllld than them.
MY OPINIONJuly 29, 2011 8:18 pm at 8:18 pm #792233
lol always here ,
were you once a substitute teacher???? i once had one that said we can’t use the word ‘kids’ because of that!July 29, 2011 8:22 pm at 8:22 pm #792234
MiddlePath, I second that!
Quark, I worry that you might be serious…Not looking to start an arguement, but your post contains some insulting details, veering towards loshon hara. Who are you or me to define frumkeit and who is “normal” or not?July 29, 2011 9:37 pm at 9:37 pm #792235
brotherofurs~ lol, no. 🙂July 29, 2011 10:04 pm at 10:04 pm #792237
WIY, since you are from the “annoyers”, and not the “annoyees”, you think that this isn’t a serious suggestion, because you don’t see the problem, since you don’t get ticked off by any of the crazy and insane topics here. You like “oy vey” topics.
But to many, these are repulsiveJuly 29, 2011 10:04 pm at 10:04 pm #792238
Quark; first of all, why would you think that non-frum people aren’t normal? Who is it that sets the standards for what you call “normal”/ I actually understand what you intended to say, but you used a poor choice of words. One of the beauties of the CR, is, as many others have said, the fact that people of many different backgrounds and levels of frumkeit can discuss,chat and learn from and with each other. Most of us are happy with the way things are around here as they now stand.July 29, 2011 10:08 pm at 10:08 pm #792239
insulting details???? “veering” towards loshon hara?????
are we talking about the same comment? I really have absolutely no clue what you are talking about, sorry
the very phrase “veering towards lh” doesn’t even make any sense to begin with. Either it is l”h, or it is notJuly 29, 2011 10:32 pm at 10:32 pm #792240
quark: So post on a MO site if this one is too frum for you.July 29, 2011 10:33 pm at 10:33 pm #792241
quark: I’m sorry you lead a sad life, but being less frum wont make you happier.July 29, 2011 10:47 pm at 10:47 pm #792242
I agree – no splitting up necessary. If we can all share and listen to each others views and opinions without any major arguments, it can make for a very interesting conversation.
Our goal should be Achdus and Ahavas Yisroel – NOT splitting us up.July 29, 2011 10:59 pm at 10:59 pm #792243
So I guess you are an unfriendly quark.July 29, 2011 11:00 pm at 11:00 pm #792244
one for the people leaning more towards the super – frum/chassidish side, and one for the normal people not leaning that way.
Aha. You think super-frum/chassidish aren’t normal.
As do many of the comments of the chassidish/super frum who are trying to impose their twisted world view onto everyone else.
Aha. You think super-frum/chassidish are twisted.
Give it up. You are NOT doing a mitzvah, and you are not doing G-ds will. G-d wants us to lead happy, normal lives. Be normal
Aha. You think super-frum/chassidish are unhappy.
Oy vey.July 29, 2011 11:33 pm at 11:33 pm #792245
ok ok, why is almost everyone here nitpicking on something that has nothing to do with the topic? If you don’t like the way i catergorized the two groups, label it however you want. Call the super frum “normal”, and the normal something else. It doesn’t matter to me, for the purposes of this suggestion.
But the point is that there are two groups on this site, and making a second parralel coffee room would be of great benefit to everyone, IMHO.July 29, 2011 11:41 pm at 11:41 pm #792246
quark2, Stop trying to drey a kup here. People here want to serve Hashem to the best of their ability. No, that doesn’t mean they are Satmar or Chasidish or “super frum”, it just means they are Ovdei Hashem be it Litvak, Sefardic, or Chasidic.
And if you find it “repulsive” that someone will not go to movies and expresses why movies are not in line with the Torah, then you are in the wrong place quark.July 29, 2011 11:53 pm at 11:53 pm #792248
Chein i didn’t say that expressing an opinion about movies is repulsive. I said that i find certain kinds of topics to be repulsive.July 29, 2011 11:59 pm at 11:59 pm #792249
Listen im sorry if i insulted anyone, because that really wasn’t the point here.
I just usually tend to be very outspoken about my views, and i was trying to define the two groups in a way that was clear and understandable.
That is the way i see you, from my point of viewJuly 31, 2011 1:16 am at 1:16 am #792250
Joseph/non-JosephJuly 31, 2011 1:38 am at 1:38 am #792251
I really don’t understand how all of these people who seem so frum by the opinions that they express, have internet access, that according to them is assur gamur. This mystefies me.
Some people need internet for parnassah, in which case, with proper filtering, most rabbonim will be matir.
Since most “twisted”, “abnormal”, “unhappy” (IOW, very frum) people don’t have internet, their views are actually very underrepresented, even on a site called “Yeshiva World”.
If you don’t like this site, no one is stopping you from starting your own.July 31, 2011 2:30 am at 2:30 am #792253
Why should we split the site? This is a way for people who would never dream of speaking to each other otherwise to broaden their worldview a bit and get to know other Jews.July 31, 2011 2:30 am at 2:30 am #792254
You need some Yiras Shamayim.
“Ve-atah Yisroel mah Hashem Elokechah shoel mei-imach ki im le-yirah es Hashem Elokechah…” (Devarim 10:12)July 31, 2011 2:37 am at 2:37 am #792255
And you, Joe need some of the rest of that pasuk: lehaloch b’drachav. I’d particularly recommend ?? ??? ??? ?? ??? ???? ??? 🙂July 31, 2011 2:42 am at 2:42 am #792256
quark, y does it bother u if other ppl r more religeous than u? u obviously believe in live and let live, so if certain topics bother u then dont read them. and dont comment on how annoying they r either. some ppl acctually enjoy having different views on different issues.
btw, in order to serve Hashem out of love u must fear Him first. look it up…July 31, 2011 3:39 am at 3:39 am #792257
Ok, my thoughts…… this site is called Yeshiva World News…. that in itself tells me that it leans towards the yeshivish crowd. That said, I am glad that the YWN doesn’t ask our religious affiliation before allowing us to join. If one wants a strictly modern crowd, then they shouldn’t look in a yeshivish room.July 31, 2011 3:53 am at 3:53 am #792258
shlishi do you know of any MO sites? If you do, please tell me.
Simple. Just look for any Orthodox site that bashes frum people. That’s MO and that’s for you. Goodbye.July 31, 2011 4:03 am at 4:03 am #792259
Looks like you’ve been heavily outvoted. But hey, if you’re that “bothered” and “repulsived” by us abnormal super-frummies, fell free to start your own site.
“As do many of the comments of the chassidish/super frum who are trying to impose their twisted world view onto everyone else. Give it up. You are NOT doing a mitzvah, and you are not doing G-ds will. G-d wants us to lead happy, normal lives. Be normal”
Look who’s “imposing their twisted world view onto everyone else” now.July 31, 2011 4:03 am at 4:03 am #792260
msseeker: Because orthodox and frum are two different things. I see.July 31, 2011 4:16 am at 4:16 am #792261
yes i am heavily outvoted, because some people are afraid to support this suggestion, for fear that they will be “bashed” by other people for not being frum enough or something. If everyone would feel free to speak their minds, this suggestion would probably have a lot more support.July 31, 2011 4:20 am at 4:20 am #792262
Because orthodox and frum are two different things. I see.
Many Torah observant Jews do not prefer the term “orthodox”. As Rav Gifter ZT”L is quoted as saying, “I am not an orthodox Jew, I am a Torah Jew”. Most “modern orthodox” do not have a problem with it, so the terms are not interchangeable.July 31, 2011 4:23 am at 4:23 am #792264
yes i am heavily outvoted, because some people are afraid to support this suggestion, for fear that they will be “bashed” by other people for not being frum enough or something. If everyone would feel free to speak their minds, this suggestion would probably have a lot more support.
On the other hand, it just possibly could be since it is an anonymous site, most of us do feel free to speak our minds. It’s just possible that you are outvoted because we are the normal ones.July 31, 2011 4:29 am at 4:29 am #792265
I thought this was going to be a joseph/non joseph thread 🙁July 31, 2011 4:30 am at 4:30 am #792266
“the use of “frumkeit” to explain certain ideas or shittos, that are not a part of yiddeshkeit. This would include any so-called “chumra” that actually has no basis in halacha.”
plz explain which “ideas or shittos” u r reffering to.
thanx!July 31, 2011 4:34 am at 4:34 am #792267
“”As do many of the comments of the chassidish/super frum who are trying to impose their twisted world view onto everyone else. Give it up. You are NOT doing a mitzvah, and you are not doing G-ds will. G-d wants us to lead happy, normal lives. Be normal”
Look who’s “imposing their twisted world view onto everyone else” now.”
So you are telling me that the idea of “be normal”, which, if you for some reason feel needs support, i heard from the Rosh Yeshiva of a large yeshiva, who has a very large following among the most frum people that you would ever meet, who has both a strong chassidish backround, and a strong yeshiva backround (was chavrusas with many Gdolim in Eretz Yisroel etc.). And he says this idea of “be normal” to his talmidim many times. And you feel that this is imposing on you something not kosher?
Do you think that hashem wants us to live a crazy not normal life? Do you think that he would punish us all, old and young, who have never done wrong, alike, with such a harsh thing?
Sechel says not like you, and if for some strange reason you cannot use your own sechel that G-d gave you, Gdolim say not like you.
There are also mekoros for this in halacha, if that’s what you need to see sense, in the halachos of not wearing clothing inside out, or talmid chacham sheyish lo revav al bigdo chayav misa, and othersJuly 31, 2011 4:42 am at 4:42 am #792268
We interupt this conversation to bring you a brief meassage from Wikipedia:
“In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion. The noun troll may refer to the provocative message itself, as in: “That was an excellent troll you posted”.”July 31, 2011 4:51 am at 4:51 am #792269
“msseeker: Because orthodox and frum are two different things. I see.”
Hmmm. With half of MO teens texting on Shabbos… and 60% of MO boys sleeping around in college… plus every kula you can think of… I’d be hard pressed to disagree with your observation.July 31, 2011 5:00 am at 5:00 am #792270
quark, it’s nice that you believe your point and Shitta. However, you are most definitely angry at whoever doesn’t agree with you. What’s the difference what your message is, the fact remains that you are acting out the behavior you profess to despise.July 31, 2011 5:11 am at 5:11 am #792271
“Too many chumros. Be normal. Be happy. Use your sechel. Don’t be crazy…”
To me – that sounds EXACTLY like the second one from the seder. “What is this whole burden/problem/inconvenience to you.
Still have teeth left?July 31, 2011 5:13 am at 5:13 am #792272
I’m surprised you didn’t understand my post, as I usually try to make my message clear, but I will try to be more specific.
By insulting, I meant that you didn’t phrase your interesting suggestion appropriately since you used phrases like “one for the normal people not leaning that way” and “what the super frum are even doing on the internet g-d knows” and “super frum won’t need to be “appalled” by the “shocking” leniencies of the others.” This use of language minimizes the appeal of your suggestion.
“the very phrase “veering towards lh” doesn’t even make any sense to begin with. Either it is l”h, or it is not”
What I meant is that your tone and controversial statements incite the thread response to be one of a lot of loshon hara.
Hope that explains it.July 31, 2011 6:37 am at 6:37 am #792273
yes halevi, because there is only one coffee room for two distinct groups, such things are bound to happenJuly 31, 2011 6:43 am at 6:43 am #792274
yes halevi, because there is only one coffee room for two distinct groups, such things are bound to happen
So you’re saying that having only one coffee room legitimizes hypocrisy??
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