Should There Be An Indication For Gender Under Peoples Names?
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- This topic has 53 replies, 33 voices, and was last updated 12 years, 4 months ago by deiyezooger.
November 4, 2010 8:06 pm at 8:06 pm #592907
Argue for or against it. I personally think it helps to have some indication so you know who you are talking to and it can effect what you say or how you say it to some extent.November 4, 2010 8:12 pm at 8:12 pm #711951Ben TorahParticipant
Or who not to talk to.
There have been suggestions previously to have separate CR’s; one for each gender only.November 4, 2010 8:21 pm at 8:21 pm #711952SJSinNYCMember
For so we can make shidduchim. Also, those who don’t talk to the opposite gender can avoid it.
Against because sometimes people make funny mistakes 🙂November 4, 2010 8:22 pm at 8:22 pm #711953bezalelParticipant
What I want to answer will probably not get past moderation so I’ll only post half of it.
I hate it when people use the word “Gender” incorrectly.November 4, 2010 8:26 pm at 8:26 pm #711954Pashuteh YidMember
Bezalel, what’s good for the goose is good for the gender.November 4, 2010 8:36 pm at 8:36 pm #711955gavra_at_workParticipant
Or have your gender as part of your name, such as myself, BPTatty and Ben TorahNovember 4, 2010 8:36 pm at 8:36 pm #711956
No. Its unenforceable anyway.
How would I know someone is a female any more than I know someone is a “pashuta yid” a “ben torah” or even “well informed” (ok some of this users statements contradict the claim to be informed but I digress).
You can’t have your cake and eat it to. If you want to join an anonymous forum then you have to understand that you can’t assume anything, take everything with a huge grain of salt and even then, be very skeptical of everything you read. There are risks to anonymous forums and this is one of them.November 4, 2010 8:37 pm at 8:37 pm #711957Ben TorahParticipant
Bezalel – it is a more modest form of speech, despite any technical limitations a linguist may note.November 4, 2010 8:41 pm at 8:41 pm #711958
Did I use it incorrectly? Please explain.November 4, 2010 8:59 pm at 8:59 pm #711959bptParticipant
“is good for the gender”
I’m with apushatayid. On line is a loosely regulated place, and its buyer beware. The CR does a good job of imposing boundaries, but in the end, its really up to the memebers to behave as we should in speaking.November 4, 2010 9:06 pm at 9:06 pm #711960ronrsrMember
are we going to take the poster’s word for it, or shall we require a chromosome test, like the Olympics?November 4, 2010 9:07 pm at 9:07 pm #711961
Thanks I needed that 😉November 4, 2010 10:38 pm at 10:38 pm #711962aries2756Participant
WIF, did you mean on this blog or in general? Sometimes one needs to answer correspondence and we don’t know how to address the letter because these days the names are mixed up among the genders.November 4, 2010 11:35 pm at 11:35 pm #711963FerdParticipant
Lets just take for example Ben Torah. Now, suppose I tell you he’s really a girl, or here is a wild one: How about he’s really Joseph, and using another screen name?
My point is, it’s a pathetic argument.November 5, 2010 12:23 am at 12:23 am #711965vnishmartemmeodMember
While in general I strongly believe that hilchos yichud should apply to online as well…
But in the case of CR – if there is NO indication who’s what, and the conversation stays pareve enough, I prefer it that way.
I think in the past couple of weeks I have been active here it has been working quite well, nobody stepping over the line… (probably having a moderator “in the face” helps that way too…)November 5, 2010 3:16 am at 3:16 am #711966EnderParticipant
When you post a comment in a public forum its by definition not yichud. But you are right that people should be careful.November 5, 2010 3:37 am at 3:37 am #711967bh18Participant
i don’t know if the mods will let this in but it’s too good to leave out. as I’ve said in other posts, i have a child with a medical condition. we go to different doctors and specialists and i filled out enough forms for the environmental/tree protectors to come after me. anyway, on one form, after filling out his name, date of birth and such, they had written gender: male…female…undecided. yes, i checked off undecided! the nurse and doctor needed a minute to ‘chap’!!November 5, 2010 3:45 am at 3:45 am #711968popa_bar_abbaParticipant
When you post a comment, it is not yichud for the same reason that it is not achilas matza, or marror.November 5, 2010 4:38 am at 4:38 am #711969wanderingchanaParticipant
“undecided”?????November 5, 2010 6:35 am at 6:35 am #711970amichaiParticipant
let’s say you do write the gender underneath the names. does that mean you will not write to certain people now? this is a chat room. take it for what it is.November 5, 2010 8:15 am at 8:15 am #711971MoqMember
My husband had the same suggestion the other day…November 5, 2010 9:58 am at 9:58 am #711972yeshivaguy1Participant
It just means that you will know where they are coming from. If a girl posts on a topic that she knows nothing about you know to take it with a grain of salt (eg. shmiras enayim for men). Same thing vice versa.November 5, 2010 10:39 am at 10:39 am #711973vnishmartemmeodMember
Actually – my point was just that. While I think private emails or chats are a big no-no (not everyone does!), but a public room like this, that has a positive an neutral tone to it, I think is just fine. Wouldn’t like it any other way 🙂November 5, 2010 11:09 am at 11:09 am #711974wanderingchanaParticipant
You can ask the mods to put in under your name if you want 🙂November 5, 2010 2:56 pm at 2:56 pm #711975HaLeiViParticipant
You can view it like a public bulletin board; everyone is posting to the public even if it is about a different sign, that could have been written by someone from the other side of the Mechitza.
There are, however, two other issues. There must be a level of appropriateness. Although you don’t know the other person, so there is no real Hirhur involved, it is still inappropriate. It is a style and behavior issue. The other point is that there is a level of Al Tarbe. Chatting over the Mechitza is a whole different conversation, and anyone keen enough can spot it.
As many have said, when boys and girls are talking it is a whole different thing going on. Many studies have shown how the behavior of each one changes in the presence of the other. If you follow the threads that turned trans-Mechitzadic and personal, you’ll notice how it spirals into a game and being cute and some me-and-you talk. That is still not technically Hirhur, but it falls into some other categories.
Because of this approach, I do respond to posts written by anyone, because I’m writing to everyone. (The person him/herself usually doesn’t end up agreeing anyhow, so what would be the point of writing if it were only for that poster?) However, I’d refrain from kidding around and even addressing someone that has an obvious other-gender screen name. I just can’t find myself saying, “Hey, Sister…”. Address the point, not the person.November 5, 2010 4:23 pm at 4:23 pm #711976HaLeiViParticipant
I think that having a gender identification would make things worse. It would make conversations much more advert. What you don’t know doesn’t hurt.November 5, 2010 4:55 pm at 4:55 pm #711977
It is also good form, not to create rules you cant (and wont) enforce.November 5, 2010 5:23 pm at 5:23 pm #711978so rightMember
I still maintain the proper approach is (to the best ability) have separate sites for each gender. Many sites are geared to a specific gender. And even say ONLY for them.
In fact matchmaking websites (Jewish and non Jewish) limit it to singles ONLY — even though technically one could lie. But still it will self enforce no obvious opposite gender conversations.November 5, 2010 5:37 pm at 5:37 pm #711979
So right. The best approach is not to be online altogether 🙂November 5, 2010 5:49 pm at 5:49 pm #711980☕ DaasYochid ☕Participant
The word gender has more than one meaning.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=active&rlz=1T4ACAW_enUS391US391&defl=en&q=define:gender&sa=X&ei=FkPUTNiELsP68AaY56SxDA&ved=0CBcQkAENovember 6, 2010 5:08 pm at 5:08 pm #711981twistedParticipant
I would wager that the more attentive among us can figure this out from context, especially the goose end of the goose/gender divide with the BY sense.November 7, 2010 4:56 pm at 4:56 pm #711982whatrutalkingabtMember
I was sure you were a man…. : )November 7, 2010 8:36 pm at 8:36 pm #711983MoqMember
I am act actually going to worry that you are serious; I am not a professor at Stern; I’m just a hard working (sometimes) tongue in cheek guyNovember 8, 2010 1:26 am at 1:26 am #711984
There is not any more heter for chatting with girls online, then there is in real life. The same issurim are applicable.November 8, 2010 3:28 am at 3:28 am #711985
“There is not any more heter for chatting with girls online, then there is in real life. The same issurim are applicable.”
The difference is, online you
In a forum like this you have no clue if anyone is who they say they are and either way you have no clue what they look like. Theres no issur here. If you knew who the person behind teh screen name is that would be a different story.November 8, 2010 5:59 pm at 5:59 pm #711986
WIY- do you live in BP? I was in BP yesterday and I met a bunch of guys and all I kept thinking that I have no doubt that one of them was a poster here who I “spoke” to a million times but would never know about! One guy even said to me that I look so familiar and I was thinking “maybe you know me from the coffee room but otherwise I never saw you in my life!”November 8, 2010 6:28 pm at 6:28 pm #711988sof davar hakol nishmaMember
if your so worried about it don’t post. What i would do is keep the user name neutral and don’t give away what you are in any thread. If you do and someone catches it, its not the end of the world. just be careful. I do see what some people are talking about that that same dynamics that goes on when a boy and girl speak face to face happens in a similar sense on line.November 8, 2010 6:38 pm at 6:38 pm #711989
You talk to boys? That’s a big no no.
You didn’t meet me besides, I’m not one that gets into conversations with girls I don’t know or have no need to speak to.November 8, 2010 7:27 pm at 7:27 pm #711990blinkyParticipant
You talk to boys?
Calm down- she never said she talks to boys, she said the boy spoke to her- thats a big difference.
Coke- i stayed in my house the whole sunday i was scared you’ll sniff me out:)November 8, 2010 7:33 pm at 7:33 pm #711991
WIY- I DO NOT talk to boys ever ever ever….I happened to have been at a “concert” for some special children yesterday where Avraham Fried came and sang for them and I was there along with a bunch of “chassidishe” guys who also came to sing and dance (and just hang out). Just asking if you are one of those guys….or anyone else that is here was at that party….November 8, 2010 8:24 pm at 8:24 pm #711992
blinky- thanks for sticking up for me! For all you know, WIY, a guy asked me something and I turned red because I was so embarrassed that a guy spoke to me….LOLNovember 8, 2010 8:30 pm at 8:30 pm #711993
Hi coke –
I saw you there.November 8, 2010 8:54 pm at 8:54 pm #711994
Im not Chassidish or “Chassidish.” Nor was I zoche to be at this concert.November 8, 2010 9:11 pm at 9:11 pm #711996ramateshkolianMember
just like kids need fairytales to escape the realities of life, adults need to escape sometimes too..to the CR! Vhameivin yavin….November 8, 2010 9:12 pm at 9:12 pm #711997
blinky- i tried to sniff out as many of you as I could while I was there….didn’t get very far!November 8, 2010 9:13 pm at 9:13 pm #711998adorableParticipant
wow coke….I have no words….you sound like you want us to saw you are so cool so that is what I am going to say! LOL But I think it is pretty cool that you met helpful….for all i know you met me too!November 24, 2010 2:33 pm at 2:33 pm #712000eclipseMember
if i already gave too many details about myself away can i change my username?November 24, 2010 2:45 pm at 2:45 pm #712001
Start a new one.November 24, 2010 2:47 pm at 2:47 pm #712002WolfishMusingsParticipant
Male Wolf 🙂November 24, 2010 7:35 pm at 7:35 pm #712003
Its ok, nothing you say will be held against you. Who am I fooling? Lol.
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