October 28, 2012 7:35 pm at 7:35 pm #605539
Is it proper to say Mishnayos for a non-religious Jew who (R”L) committed suicide? Thank you.October 28, 2012 8:20 pm at 8:20 pm #901786zahavasdadParticipant
I think most hold today the suicide is caused by mental illness and its probably ok to say mishayos and bury in a regular part of the cemetaryOctober 28, 2012 9:01 pm at 9:01 pm #901787dhl144Member
I dont have an answer to your question yehudahTzvi but it is nice to hear that you want to do that and I was touched that you would want to do that for another Jew…. Hashem should give u the strength to continue to serve Him properly and continue to have such a giving heart to klal yisrael. All the best to you.October 28, 2012 10:22 pm at 10:22 pm #901788WolfishMusingsParticipant
It is never* wrong to learn Mishnayos, regardless of the reason.
*Barring Tisha B’Av or during mourning.October 28, 2012 11:33 pm at 11:33 pm #901789abcd2Participant
Most current poskim rule that suicide is due to mental illness (as Zahavasdad said) and not a truly conscious act of the ill person trying to control their destiny.
Learning Mishnayos Liuley Nishmas is considered a tremendous merit regardless if someone was frum or not. A tinok Shenishbar would have an especially tremendous Zechus by Torah study being done in their memory as they were not properly exposed to it in their lifetime.
Sorry about your loss and only Simchas in Klal YisraelOctober 29, 2012 12:11 am at 12:11 am #901790aurora77Participant
I am so sorry for your loss and am sending prayers for healing your way.October 29, 2012 12:32 am at 12:32 am #901791oomisParticipant
This is so sad. Yasher koach to you for the sensitivity you are showing.October 29, 2012 12:47 am at 12:47 am #901792
Thank you for your kind responses. This was not a family member, rather an old boss (who didn’t particularly care for me). I was very saddened because he was very young and suffered greatly from depression this past year.October 29, 2012 12:56 am at 12:56 am #901793
Just learned the first chapter of Yoma. May his Neshama have an Aliyah,October 29, 2012 4:19 am at 4:19 am #901794YW Moderator-42Moderator
What does your Rav say? Did they give him a Jewish burial?October 29, 2012 7:05 am at 7:05 am #901795
He is not buried yet. He will be buried on the East coast pending Sandy. I have not asked my Rav as he did not know this person or how he lived. Apparently he was so consumed by depression that he just couldn’t bear life anymore. Again, i was not close to the man. In fact, he fired me years ago. Bu I know for a fact that he has no religious relatives and no one to learn in his merit.October 29, 2012 8:57 am at 8:57 am #901796The Best BubbyParticipant
Yehudah Tzvi ben Elisheva, may your everlasting kindness for a meis mitzvah, bring you a very speedy refuah shelamah and an abundance of HAGEFEN always for you and yours!!! Omein Kein Yehe Razon!October 29, 2012 9:20 am at 9:20 am #9017972scentsParticipant
This is so wonderful of you.
Loss of life is terrible thing, even without the suicide factor. It shows a lot that you are going out of your way fo make sure that this person gets a tikun.October 29, 2012 11:23 am at 11:23 am #901798PuhLeaseParticipant
I can’t tell you how nice it is that you are doing this. I recognize that there are those that would tell you that you are doing wrong, but considering that you were fired by this man, you are doing a wonderful thing for learning for his neshomah.
There should be more yidden like you in this world. In the merit of what YOU are doing, may we see more joy in this world.October 29, 2012 2:22 pm at 2:22 pm #901799dhl144Member
I said it before but I gotta tell u again YT I’m really getting a great chizuk from what ur doing.Keep it up!October 29, 2012 7:10 pm at 7:10 pm #901800
Thanks again for the kind words. It is very little effort with hopefully huge benefits for his Neshomah.October 30, 2012 3:07 am at 3:07 am #901801King Bob XVMember
Just FYI, it is possible that even someone who is completely in his right mind can be suffering from such a severe depression that the only reason he doesn’t attempt suicide is because doing so would lose him his ??? in ???? ??? as I know personally from my experience in the past.
???? ???? ?????October 30, 2012 5:02 am at 5:02 am #901802
It is a very sad situation. This man seemingly had everything: Family, wealth, success, friends, etc. Apparently, he shut himself off from the world a few weeks ago and his medications did not work or kick in yet. He (R”L) left a wife, kids and two parents.
As I said before, he was not at all a religious man. That is why I feel it important to learn on his behalf. My best friend growing up also committed suicide when he was in his teens. No one in his family is religious so I make a point of saying Yizkor for him as well.
Depression is clearly a very serious illness. The mere fact that someone would commit suicide or attempt to end their life is testament enough that they are ill. I am especially saddened for their families. My friend’s mom never recovered from her son’s death twenty-five years ago and has been living in a daily hell since then.
Thanks for listening and the kind words. I pray Hashem has Rachmanus on us all and that there is no one else who would be in such despair. There is always help. And hope.October 30, 2012 5:05 am at 5:05 am #901803
King Bob XV: Baruch Hashem that you did not end your life even if it was driven by fear! Thank G-d we have that fear and the deep knowledge that Hashem exists and that we all have a purpose!October 30, 2012 8:02 pm at 8:02 pm #901804147Participant
because doing so would lose him his ??? in ???? ??? as I know personally from my experience in the past. Could you King Bob XV please elaborate on what you imply by personal experience? Do you know exactly the workings about Olom haBo? & the 6 questions & judgement upstairs? If you have such personal experience of the workings up there, you are the most sought after speaker & mentor in this world, and my Synagogue would certainly like to invite you to preach us, possibly even on R’H &/or Y’K.October 31, 2012 12:27 am at 12:27 am #901805
147: Your response was rather rude and insensitive. King Bob XV never claimed or implied that he had “the workings about Olom haBo? & the 6 questions & judgement upstairs.” He is clearly speaking of the FEAR of losing his chelek in Olam Haba was his personal experience which kept him from killing himself. He never claimed to be an expert on anything.
“If you have such personal experience of the workings up there, you are the most sought after speaker & mentor in this world, and my Synagogue would certainly like to invite you to preach us, possibly even on R’H &/or Y’K”
Seriously, 147? Come on.October 31, 2012 2:51 am at 2:51 am #901806aurora77Participant
Hello King Bob XV,
I am also so glad that you did not take that desperate step, and my prayers are with you that you have been able to find help, understanding, compassion, and healing in treating your depression.October 31, 2012 11:17 pm at 11:17 pm #901807danielaParticipant
Perhaps you can also have someone talk to the family and insist he is brought to kvura as soon as possible. Do you know if the family is trying to, or even if they are willing, to give him a jewish burial? Even if your Rabbi did not personally know him, he will help; you are willing to ask the CR, and no one here knew the man; you no doubt can ask your rabbi the same question. It is a complicated issue.
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