Switching sides

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  • #1885768
    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    Why do democrats (voters not politicians) think that democrats who “were” pro segregation and kkk and racism believe that one day everyone woke up and switched sides whereas the democrats aren’t racist and republicans are

    #1885906
    Someone in Monsey
    Participant

    Delusion fueled by ignorance.

    #1885943
    jackk
    Participant

    Coffee Addict,

    You can do 2 minutes of research on the internet and learn the history of how, why and when this occurred.
    The facts are straight forward. See wikipedia.

    Is your trolling question intimating that currently republicans are not racist or that the democrats currently are?

    Regardless of the what people (voters and politicians) personally think in terms of racism. for decades it has been off-limits for a politician to be openly racist.
    This all changed when Trump decided to make openly racist statements (many of them false) and subsequently legislate racist policies.

    “total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country’s representatives can figure out what is going on.”.
    ” Hey, I watched when the World Trade Center came tumbling down. And I watched in Jersey City, New Jersey, where thousands and thousands of people were cheering as that building was coming down. Thousands of people were cheering.”

    #1885964
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    “total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country’s representatives can figure out what is going on.”.

    Jackk – so cute! You call it truth cuz he actually said it but it’s still a lie when out of context.

    Here’s another “racist” story like that one:
    4 black people and one arab are on the street and the arab pulls a gun on someone. The cops arrest the arab and people like you retell the story like this, “cops single out muslim bystander in racist arrest!”

    #1885974
    som1
    Participant

    ” Hey, I watched when the World Trade Center came tumbling down. And I watched in Jersey City, New Jersey, where thousands and thousands of people were cheering as that building was coming down. Thousands of people were cheering.”
    TO REINFORCE THE POINT
    my friend was in college and they were watching the 9/11 live and he was crying when seeing the people jump off the building and the lib professor started yelling at him how he cant cry because its offensive to the muslim students there, he then complained to the principal who sided with the professor and then started saying anti semitic things. he then left the college and tried suing but nothing came out of it

    #1885976
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    Som1- i believe some could have that attitude,
    but i have trouble believing it was expressed over that. And i don’t think we knew at that time that it was muslims. Don’t mean it didn’t happen, but even jerks would let someone cry…

    #1885985
    som1
    Participant

    syag the leftist professor was saying that its offensive to muslims to cry because its joyce for them that the twin towers are collapsing (not because the muslims did the attack( they didn’t know that yet) )

    #1885987
    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    “You can do 2 minutes of research on the internet and learn the history of how, why and when this occurred.
    The facts are straight forward. See wikipedia.“

    Telling me to look at Wikipedia is the same as me telling you that Trump is an oheiv yisrael and my source is Joe (or YWN)

    Anyone can post anything on Wikipedia

    “ Regardless of the what people (voters and politicians) personally think in terms of racism. for decades it has been off-limits for a politician to be openly racist.
    This all changed when Trump decided to make openly racist statements (many of them false) and subsequently legislate racist policies.

    “total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country’s representatives can figure out what is going on.”.
    ” Hey, I watched when the World Trade Center came tumbling down. And I watched in Jersey City, New Jersey, where thousands and thousands of people were cheering as that building was coming down. Thousands of people were cheering.””

    And Obama said “if I had a son it would be Trayvon” and stuck himself into a case before it was decided

    Additionally I remember videos of Arabs cheering when the twin towers fell, so what it wasn’t in New Jersey rather it was in Gaza

    #1885979
    som1
    Participant

    “total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country’s representatives can figure out what is going on.”

    jack completely taking him out of context!! he’s talking about from specific countries!!! and those countries on the travel ban list are all from obama’s bombing list countries (so obama is more racist than trump cuz bombing is worse than banning entry to the USA)

    #1886097
    1
    Participant

    Well they still think that black people cant think for themselves

    #1886110
    charliehall
    Participant

    In fact, most racist Democrats DID either switch to the Republican Party because of Civil Rights, and Richard Nixon, who in the 1950s had had a very strong civil rights record, not only encouraged it but made it central to the Republican Party. This is so well known that only someone disconnected to reality could deny it. The Republican Party would nominate three opponents of the Civil Rights Act for President, and two of them won: Barry Goldwater, Ronald Reagan, and George H. W. Bush.

    What is NOT as well known is that there was ALWAYS a strong racist contingent within the Republican Party starting shortly after the Civil War. Chester Arthur signed a law banning Chinese immigration to the US. William McKinley called for the “Christianization” of the Philippines; he was so ignorant of history that he didn’t realize that there had been multiple cathedrals in the Philippines before Jamestown was settled. Theodore Roosevelt’s attitude towards American Indians was that they were almost subhuman. William Howard Taft and Herbert Hoover tried to expel black people from the Republican Party in southern states — a major reason why black people started voting Democratic. Calvin Coolidge openly sought KKK support in 1924 and signed the racist immigration law that would doom millions of Jews to death in the Shoah; two Republican KKK members were elected Governors that year, in Indiana and Colorado.

    Things did get better in 1936, as the Landon/Knox campaign made the first national outreach for black people since the 1870s, and in 1940 the Republicans nominated former Democrat Wendell Willkie who was a true believing passionate supporter of civil rights. Dewey, Eisenhower, and Nixon (in 1960) were also supporters of civil rights, but then the party went in the wrong direction while the Democrats as a national party were expelling their racists.

    #1886112
    charliehall
    Participant

    The Muslims who were seen on television cheering the towers coming down were not in the US. They were in Jerusalem.

    #1886120
    besalel
    Participant

    Jackk: Islam is not a race. Islam is a religion and not a race.

    You may want to point to those statements and call trump a bigot (I don’t think he is one) but those statements are not evidence of racism.

    In fact, I never heard trump say a racist thing and accusations that he is a racist are simply not supported by any evidence.

    #1886121
    ubiquitin
    Participant

    “Why do democrats (voters not politicians) think that democrats who “were” pro segregation and kkk and racism believe that one day everyone woke up and switched sides whereas the democrats aren’t racist and republicans are”

    Its just that they know history.

    It is clear that a change occurred. The “deep south” ( Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina, Mississippi, and Louisiana) voted solidly democrat from reconstruction until 1964 .( you can go to 270towin dot com for some nice maps that visually really show this well) The sole exception was 1948 when Strom Thurmond won the south (which only helps prove what motivates their vote)
    In 1964 LBJ a democrat lost the south for almost the first time in almost 100 years.

    So what changed ? Did the south suddenly become less racist? or did the Democratic party .
    Well what happened in 1964 that cost LBJ the south .

    the civil rights act
    As he was alleged to have said “We have lost the South for a generation,” ? This was true (though he probably never said it)

    #1886122
    akuperma
    Participant

    If you are trying to find a consistent approach to the two parties, over time, you could argue that the Democrats were and are into identity politics (even if before the 1960s they largely rejected Blacks in order to pander to southern white who were still grumpy about the Civil War), but that the Democrats have always been for pandering to whomever they define as “the people”, going back to Jefferson and Jackson. “Jim Crow” was a Democratic invention (good pandering to southerners), though the laws against Jewish and Asian immigrants had bi-partisan support. The “woke” Democrats are still supporting “pandering” to those whom they feel are worthy (with a strong caveat, that means discriminating against those they don’t approve us).

    The Republicans (and the Whigs and the Federalists) were always into support “good government” and “business”, appealing to like-minded voters on non-ethnic grounds, and rejecting identity politics.

    #1886216
    midwesterner
    Participant

    A fair chunk of it is about money. When people figured out the Dems could be guilted into giving them money to assuage their conscience, they went all in. The welfare state.

    #1886302
    interjection
    Participant

    “When people figured out the Dems could be guilted into giving them money”

    I think you mean that the Dems could be guilted into giving them other people’s money. Yours and mine.

    #1886355
    jackk
    Participant

    Coffee Addict,
    – “Telling me to look at Wikipedia is the same as me telling you that Trump is an oheiv yisrael and my source is Joe (or YWN)

    Anyone can post anything on Wikipedia..

    My point was why would you ask YWN when you the answer is clear and well known and can be found in any library? I see that a few other posters already decided to spell out the history lesson just in case your firewall blocks anything but YWN.

    – And Obama said “if I had a son it would be Trayvon” and stuck himself into a case before it was decided.

    You are right . Obama was wrong for saying it.

    – “Additionally I remember videos of Arabs cheering when the twin towers fell, so what it wasn’t in New Jersey rather it was in Gaza.”

    Because you , Trump and the rest of the Republican party do not understand the difference between Americans who practice Islam while living in Jersey City and the Palestinians who live in Gaza is the exact reason Trump is a racist.

    Syag and Som1,

    What I said was not taken out of context. It was very clear what he meant . All the white christians at his rally understood him exactly the same way.

    – “he’s talking about from specific countries!!! and those countries on the travel ban list are all from obama’s bombing list countries”.

    How someone can think that Trump was saying that “I am just going to continue the Obama ban on countries that are already banned” is beyond me.

    #1886455
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    No, it was taken out of context. Pathetically so.
    But talking fact to anti trumpers is even more frustrating because they can’t even hear you and their arguments make them sound like their iq’s dropped 30 points. There’s no rationality. Obama bombed, not banned. You have a country deliberately planting cells for terrorism in the US and you are complaining they trump wanted them vetted first. Are you also one of those people who insists thst breathing air filled with covid19 germs is your right and government shouldn’t prevent that either? Wake me when you guys grow up

    #1886472
    yichusdik
    Participant

    Has anyone who makes the “Lincoln was a Republican, and thus the republicans today are somehow more tolerant, less racist and better people than the democrats” argument actually learned about his politics?
    Did you know he corresponded and was on friendly terms with Karl Marx? That he championed the rights of labor and workers over businesses? Does this sound republican to you?

    Like Marx, he believed, and I quote “things ought to belong to those whose labor has produced them” – the means of production and consequent wealth, in Marxist terms.

    His inaugural address didn’t talk about tax cuts, or closed borders, or trade wars. It talked about labor and capital. “Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.”

    In other words, Lincoln was unambiguously a socialist. Does today’s republican party lay claim to that?

    It is sad indeed for America that the Democratic party is fighting a civil war between moderates and radical progressives, and the moderates aren’t winning, while the republican party, which would ordinarily get my vote, has destroyed its credibility through its enthusiastic embrace of populist demagoguery, insensible policy on trade, taxation, gun rights and health care, while playing defense for a confused and incoherent foreign policy which alienates friends, empowers enemies, and has simply weakened America.

    Just because the man who freed the slaves was a republican in the 1860s, doesnt mean that the republicans of today share anything more with him than a name.

    #1886748
    jackk
    Participant

    Syag,

    “DONALD J. TRUMP STATEMENT ON PREVENTING MUSLIM IMMIGRATION”.
    These words are not taken from the NY Times. They are a direct quote from Trump’s campaign website. This was his goal and his raison d’etre.

    The theory that what Trump meant was only 7 majority Muslim COUNTRIES, who were all potentially planting cells of terrorism in this country and Trump is going to save us from them by banning every single citizen from those countries, THEN HE FAILED MISERABLY. The USA had a terrorist attack from a Saudi Arabian in Dec 2019 on US soil. That is a fact. If Obama was president, fox news would have used that fact every day for months how Obama is soft on terrorism.He did not ban Saudi Arabia who was the one country who we know had already sent us a terrorist cell in 2001.They should have been first on the list.

    Osama bin Laden type terrorists are not walking into the country and doing things legally as they plan to commit terrorist attacks. Also, we have not had an Osama Bin Laden type terrorist attack in 16 years. There was no reasonable reason for Trump to make his travel ban. EXCEPT FOR RACISM AGAINST MUSLIMS.

    We have a very good intelligence and immigration system that vets the people coming in. There was no need to deny every single person from those countries. In fact, it has never been done before except by JFK against Cuba.

    By the way, the low IQ people did not vote for the person who promised to build a wall with Mexico ( NO WHERE NEAR COMPLETED) and that Mexico would pay for it (NOT ONE PESO). (BECAUSE HE COULDN’T FOOL US. BESIDE ALL OF HIS OTHER LIES, LIES AND MORE LIES.)

    Obama’s bombing certain countries has nothing to do with Trumps Muslim travel ban.

    In one area Trump has been very effective with his travel ban. He has effectively banned Americans from being able to travel. Since the US does not have the Covid19 pandemic under control with over 4 million having caught it and over 143,000 Americans having died from it, Americans are restricted in their travel to Canada, Israel and Europe. Congratulations. That is the effect of the Trump travel ban.

    Do you understand the difference between American Muslims and Palestinians ?

    #1891597

    accusations that [Trump] is a racist are simply not supported by any evidence

    Oh, come on. Argue a conclusion one way or another, but no supporting evidence?
    Google (language warning)

    we don’t prepare for bad language, we avoid it

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