teachers tying the children's shoelaces.

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    i think it is unfair for teachers to have spend tying shoelaces, especially when kids come in after recess with their laces wet and muddy. parents shouldn’t send their kinds with laces if they don’t know how to do them themselves.


    You seem quite fixated on shoes. There are now three threads about shoes and you’ve started two of them and commented on the other, whats up with that?



    ohr chodesh

    Its every teachers responsibility to tie kids shoelaces. If its too difficult for her, she should be fired.


    It’s very simple.

    If you cannot or are unwilling to do the job and ALL IT ENTAILS, find yourself a different profession!!!


    I don’t think there’s a rule about it. Let’s call it a matter of safety and hygiene.

    Assuming a child could slip and fall on wet, muddy untied shoelaces, if they come untied regularly, you can bring this to the attention of the parents to let them know that for future purchases, Velcro might be a better option.

    You could also ask parents to double knot laces. However, some kids might get shoes on sale (fewer choices) or hand me downs where the choices are more limited. I don’t blame you for being irritated about it, but I think it would be overstepping your bounds to presume the right to tell parents how to dress their kids.


    i think it is unfair for teachers to have spend tying shoelaces, especially when kids come in after recess with their laces wet and muddy. parents shouldn’t send their kinds with laces if they don’t know how to do them themselves.

    With all due respect, get over it. If that’s your biggest complaint as a teacher, you’re doing pretty well.

    The Wolf


    Teacher is right. Kids should go barefoot in the classroom. Why should the teacher have to tie their shoes. In fact, in the younger grades they should go without pants and skirts so the teachers dont have to help them take them off and put them on before or after they use the bathroom. In fact, if parents kept their kids home from school the teachers wouldnt have to deal with any of the kids’ problems and they will have plenty of time to teach.


    Are you in the Velcro business?


    Goq: the OP may be Imelda Marcos.


    If the dean of my school didn’t see it below him to tie the shoe lace of a kindergarten-er, why would it be below the dignity of a kindergarten teacher to retie a shoe lace?

    (when I was in kindergarten, my shoe lace was untied and asked an adult to tie my shoe. I went home and told my mother ‘the man with the white beard {ie the dean} tied my shoe for me’. 10 years later he still remembered and mentioned it at my 8th grade grad)


    Hello lucky employed teacher

    If you have a problem tying the shoes of kindergarteners, you should try teaching middle school or high school. Seriously, what would you do with a kid who got a bloody nose during the Regents, or threw up on your desk because she could not stay home while mom was at work, or needed her shoes tied because she was too pregnant to tie them herself. (I am not making this up.) I was under the impression that compassion was the first ingredient in making up a teacher… maybe I am wrong.

    And, if you don’t want to tie the kids’ shoes, you can try sending a note home asking all the parents to buy their kids new shoes that are either slip-ons or have velcro closures. That ought to go over well in the current economy. Alternatively, I bet there are a dozen unemployed kindergarten teachers out there willing and able to take your job.

    Personally, as a currently unemployed secondary teacher, I would take a job that required me to tie my kids shoes over unemployment any day…


    And, it would really set a great example for your students, and everyone else, if you took a moment (less time than it takes to tie one student’s shoe laces) to clean up your English usage before posting.

    You wrote:

    There are several things that are clearly wrong with this sentence.

    1. It needs to begin with a capital letter

    3. It is customary to make it clear what is being spent, I believe you meant time in this case

    Had you taken the time to proofread, a skill at least as important as shoe tying, some would say more important for a teacher, you might have written something like:

    While I would still disagree with your premise, at least it would have been cogently and correctly presented.

    Please know that my critique of your writing is not meant to be anything other than a slightly tongue-in-cheek object lesson.

    Sorry folks, I didn’t meant to go on so long…


    Goq: the OP may be Imelda Marcos

    Now thats funny! i think only posters over 40 will get the joke but its very funny.


    I don’t think Imelda Marcos Collects Shabbos shoes.


    “parents shouldn’t send their kinds with laces if they don’t know how to do them themselves.”

    I agree, it is important for all parents to know how to tie their laces. I also agree that it is quite unfair for parents who can not tie their own laces to have those who are not their kind do it for them.


    I would like to make a number of points,

    a) I teach fifth grade, I do not spend my time tying laces, started this thread on behalf of someone else, who is very compassinate, and spends a lot of the day helping children with various tasks

    b) I do not think that it so unreasonable to think before you buy your children shoes that the teacher will probably end up tying the laces many, many more times than you.

    c) I find it wrong that many children in the third or fourth grades still do not know how to their laces.

    d) remember that the teacher is tying the same child’s laces again and again. this is not going to encourage her to like your child.

    e) I personally prefer teaching slightly older children, I do not know if I would have the patience for younger ones.

    f) sorry no fancy name, but i am used to typing on autocorrect.

    g) I am a little upset and offended by some of the sarcasm. i also think that it is unreasonable to have names like “only normal guy around”, and i am interested in knowing the moderators red lines.

    h) this conversation has come up numerous times in the staff room, it is not a new one.


    I don’t like to parse other people comments, but the train ride out to cedar knolls this morning is a long one and I’m bored looking out the window. So to pass the time, I’d like to address your points.

    a) There is no greater copout than saying, don’t shoot the messenger, I am just repeating how my friend feels.

    b) nor do I believe it is so unreasonable for a parent to believe that their child will keep their shoes on in school or that a good double bow will remain tied all day. Nor is it unreasonable to assume that if the teacher requests children to remove their shoes, that teacher will help them put them back on. Nor is it unreasonable to assume that in the event a childs laces come untied, teacher will gladly help child redo their laces. Nor is it unreasonable to assume that if the teacher finds something about a child so terribly frustrating, they will address said something with the parents of the child instead of allowing frustration to build up inside of them, and who knows, take it out one day on said child.

    c) I find it irresponsible for someone who claims to be such a caring teacher to use such a broad paintbrush when clearly it is not the case.

    d) if teacher has an issue repeatedly tying

    A childs laces, they should address it with the child or their parents. Any teacher that comes to dislike a student over something so silly as shoelaces, should seriously think about a different profession.

    e) at least you are honest with yourself. That is a lot more than can be said about many people.

    f) I truly hope you don’t teach the way you type, on autocorrect, or autopilot. If you do, I can see how something as trivial as untied shoelaces can get you all worked up.

    g) sometimes the only way to respond to outrageously ridiculous is with sarcasm. Ridiculous statements and assertions do not deserve serious or well thought out responses. I know that I am writing a lot faster than I am thinking right now.

    As to the names people use, why does it offend you if someone goes by the name “I’m the best” or “number one poster”. I guess if you come unglued at the thought of tying shoes, this might bother you too.

    h) neither is the conversation that often comes up in the parents room. You know, the one about those teachers who are in it for their own egos and not those they are teaching. One example are those teachers who do their childrens art projects for them, lest, chas vshalom, a parsha project goes home with coloring outside the line, or a purple sky and pink trees..

    Wishing you and your students a most successful year of teaching and learning.


    Sorry whiteberry, but face it, there is a big difference between best poster and only normal guy.


    one more point, however smalll the point of this thread is, it’s the only thread i’ve seen with practical applications. so osmetimes a small achievement is better than just talking all day about nothing


    Ybrooklynteacher – you realize the Coffee Room is an international web forum for frum Jews of all shapes and colors? Your rant would probably be more effective if you published it in your school newsletter. Your post is completely irrelevant to the vast majority of people on the CR.

    Even those of us in the CR who have small kids that wear shoe laces on their shoes and attend kindergarten, probably don’t go to your friend’s school. And even if the do, they probably aren’t in his/her classroom. And even if they are, the people in the CR who read it are not going to go buy new shoes for their kids because of your post. You aren’t even asking for advice, where people might actually have shaychus. You’re just blowing off steam for somebody else’s problem, and you’re doing it in the most irrelevant of places. So how could you expect anything other than cynicism???


    Goldersgreener. Tzitzis, tznius, kashrus, and Torah learning are not of “practical application”, but kids’ shoelaces are? Ah hah…


    I understand everybodies sentiments about teachers doing their jobs, but schools do make rules regarding dress to make their lives easier. nowadays if you send your kids to school with rubber boots (remember those?) she’ll stay with them all day. So parents adapt and get different boots.

    Practically speaking, there used to be spiral type laces that just need to be twisted and don’t come undone so easily. They’re probably still around. Check at your shoe repair and distribute to students if needed.

    And kids are home more than you think, so mothers get enough “practice” tying shoelaces. If she’s frustrated enough she’ll probably get shoes with straps for the tot’s next pair. But that’ll be for the next school year…

    I mostly baffled by your statement that fifth graders can’t tie their laces. If that’s true they probably always had velcro… Seriously, get the first grade or pre-1-a teacher to teach tying laces if this is a skill many kids are lacking.


    Sorry, ybrooklyn teacher, no offence meant. (But while you are at it, check Goldersgreener’s posts here and in “a thought experiment” and you may understand my name.)


    My neice couldn’t do up her shoelaces. The teacher taught her how and problem was solved. Be proactive!

    I agree with Curiosity, if it really upset u, u would be doing s/thing about it, other than just ranting in the CR

    🍫Syag Lchochma

    ybrooklynteacher – I am an OT and my job sometimes includes teaching children on my caseload to tie their shoes. I must say you are correct, there are many older children who cannot tie their shoes. It is difficult for some children to do and we recommend velcro for those who have a lot of trouble. After size 3 or so it is difficult to find velcro so these kids are now stuck with laces whether they can do it or not. The elastic spiral laces are a good eitza, but not for older kids.

    Having said that, I am certainly the venting type (not proud to say) but I feel sad that teachers would consider this something to vent about. I ran a pre-school for 4 years (60 kids) and tied many laces. If one of my teachers would have told me that tying shoes too often annoyed her or affected her feelings toward the child I probably wouldn’t have hired them back.


    My child attends a nyc school he is currently being evaluated because he has some small delays however he is 6 and in first grade n being a little slower he cannot yet tie his laces so everyday that I pick him up his laces are hanging all over the place n I felt bad like I wish I could stay everyday with him to tie his sneakers but I said to myself y cant the teacher tie his sneaker he’s going to fall one day .so I informed the principal that I had this safety concern n she said that’s a job for u , so I said ok so if he cannot tie they just leave the children like that walking around with untied laces ? And her reply was oh teach him over the week .I mean its a 3 second job to prevent him from getting hurt iv tried to teach him and im still teaching him unfortunatly he cannot get it yet but im just in disbelief that she would respond with a kind of oh well if he falls he falls . Its unbelievable sad I think.


    While it is the responsibility of the teacher to tie shoes if necessary, it’s still the kind of skill parents should at least try to teach their kids at least by the time they start pre1A.

    BUT. I still want to take the opportunity to vent that after two summers of being a counselor for two and three year olds, I am fed up with Converse. And Lelli Kellies. Look, moms, you might have time to put your little angel into her shoes every morning and take them off at night, but I don’t have time to do it if the other sixteen kids are jumping off the walls waiting for me to take THEIRS off to go swimming. You KNOW I have more campers than just you cutie pie, though you may not fully want to realize it. I’m already changing sixteen kids with diapers and Pull-Ups and Gucci bathing suits that aren’t allowed to get dirty (TRUE STORY). I have NO problem whatsoever with laces, though I think that seichel over cuteness should really be used when it comes to toddler shoes. But if I need to use a shoehorn to get your kid’s shoes on, it’s time to do like the poorer but definitely smarter mom does- send your kids in crocs.

    /endrant. Though I’m not doing it again this year- I just want to raise awareness for the benefit of my fellow preschool counselors.

    🐵 ⌨ Gamanit

    I taught a sixth grader last year who did not know how to tie her own laces. Every time I had to tie it for her, I tried teaching her how to tie them herself. It took many times until she got it. Parents- if the pair of sneakers you liked are laced, and your kid doesn’t know how to tie laces you can take the laces out and put in rubber instead. We did it to my sisters crocs sneakers and it worked wonderfully all summer. She was three years old and was able to put them on and take them off herself.


    I think the idea of straps instead of laces is good which I will do . However I do believe that it would be nice if the teacher would have taken the time to tie his sneakers to prevent him from falling . So I was just wondering if they had a responsibility to do so . Also if the child can tie at least inform the child if they see it .

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