October 29, 2017 4:48 pm at 4:48 pm #1391396
Does anyone have a source for the Heter for robocallers and telemarketers to call our homes? Why isin’t it ginavas daas especially since they often mask their actual numbers.October 29, 2017 5:06 pm at 5:06 pm #1391416
Which clear cut issur in Shulchan Aruch do they violate?October 29, 2017 5:45 pm at 5:45 pm #1391421
ginavas daas, bittul zman….October 29, 2017 6:01 pm at 6:01 pm #1391422iacisrmmaParticipant
There is no issur that I know of since robocalls for charitable organizations are exempt from “The Do Not Call” list. However, I too am annoyed by these calls and I hope that the organizations end this practice. One method might be that if you receive a robocall and a mailing from the same organization you can send back the envelope with a note stating “I received a robocall from your organization. I do not donate to organizations that resort to robocalls”.October 29, 2017 6:33 pm at 6:33 pm #1391436Takes2-2tangoParticipant
Depending on the type of telemarketer you can sue them for each violation assuming u are on a do not call list. Call the FCC and ask them or look on line.October 29, 2017 6:33 pm at 6:33 pm #1391440
Switch to VoIP and block numbers that robocall.October 29, 2017 8:45 pm at 8:45 pm #1391505zahavasdadParticipant
Charities are generally exempt from do not call listsOctober 30, 2017 3:32 pm at 3:32 pm #1391934
How is it gneivas da’as?October 30, 2017 3:35 pm at 3:35 pm #1391940
… and how is a tzedaka bittul zman?October 31, 2017 11:54 pm at 11:54 pm #1392738yehudayonaParticipant
It’s not only tzedakas that call. A couple of years ago, I was getting robocalls from a frum furniture store. The worst part was that they tied up the line even when I hung up on them, which is not only illegal, it’s also dangerous. There’s a simple solution to the robocall problem: if you don’t recognize the caller ID, don’t answer. If it’s important the caller will leave a message,November 1, 2017 7:25 am at 7:25 am #1392795
SO you’re saying that they’re actually stealing your telephone lines ability to function properly, that’s for you to call out and people you want to call, to call in! That’s like harassment and trespassing.November 1, 2017 7:25 am at 7:25 am #1392796
IS THERE an issur to trespass or harass???November 1, 2017 7:30 am at 7:30 am #1392799
Genevas daas- because often they mask their number and have you think it’s someone else so that you pick up.
Bittul zman (and or gezel shena)- self apparent, phone ringing wakes you up and you don’t want to be woken up even if “the gates of shamayim are closing” (to quote one of the telemarketers). Bittul zman for the same reason.November 1, 2017 9:05 am at 9:05 am #1392836
I don’t see how masking their number is g’neivas da’as.
If you see that a number is blocked, why would you make any assumptions about who is calling (other than assuming it’s not someone that you know)?
You know once upon a time there was no such thing as caller ID.November 1, 2017 10:23 am at 10:23 am #1392926
If you see that a number is blocked, why would you make any assumptions about who is calling
They have a private person’s name come up.November 1, 2017 11:14 am at 11:14 am #1392943
“They have a private person’s name come up.”
I’ve never seen Jewish/tzedakas do that. Spoofed Caller ID is generally done by many shady secular telemarketers and bill collectors.November 1, 2017 11:25 am at 11:25 am #1392947
They have a private person’s name come up
1) What Joseph said
2) Who cares what number shows up? If it’s not a number that you recognize, what difference does it make whether it’s their number or someone else’s number? Unless you’re saying that they find people that you know and use their numbers, but I doubt they do that.November 1, 2017 11:40 am at 11:40 am #1392957
The newest trick from the secular telemarketers is to spoof a local number in your exchange. So if your number is 718-376-2250, they might spoof 718-376-2945. This confuses many people into thinking it’s a local caller.
Again, I’ve only seen this with secular organizations.November 1, 2017 2:33 pm at 2:33 pm #1393751
What Joseph said
He’s wrong. I’ve gotten it from telemarketers collecting for mosdos.
what difference does it make whether it’s their number or someone else’s number?
If I think it might be my child’s friend, etc., I would answer. If I would know it’s a telemarketer, I wouldn’t.
The newest trick from the secular telemarketers is to spoof a local number in your exchange.
This I have only seen by secular telemarketers.November 1, 2017 2:53 pm at 2:53 pm #1393764
“They have a private person’s name come up.”
“He’s wrong. I’ve gotten it from telemarketers collecting for mosdos.”
The “private person’s name” that the mosdos fundraisers are displaying on your caller ID is in all likelihood the caller’s actual home phone number that he’s calling you from (on behalf of the mosod.) As such it makes sense that you’d see a private person’s name. And that is above board.November 1, 2017 3:12 pm at 3:12 pm #1393917
The “private person’s name” that the mosdos fundraisers are displaying on your caller ID is in all likelihood the caller’s actual home phone number that he’s calling you from
Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn’t.
And that is above board.
Maybe if it’s a volunteer. Not if it’s a professional telemarketer.
That’s not to say it’s g’neivas daas, which is a technical halachic term, and I’m not qualified to determine that.
It’s just a bit shady, in my opinion.November 1, 2017 3:35 pm at 3:35 pm #1393924Avram in MDParticipant
Telemarketers or scammers spoofed my wife’s number, and she got a call back from a stranger wondering why she had called them… But she never had.November 1, 2017 3:37 pm at 3:37 pm #1393932
But she never had.
So she claims.November 1, 2017 4:00 pm at 4:00 pm #1393936
It seems that almost everyone agrees that unwanted telemarketing is not yashrus!November 1, 2017 4:00 pm at 4:00 pm #1393940
Avram, I’ve read horror stories from people who telemarketing crooks spoofed their number and they got dozens or hundreds of angry callers calling them back; people he obviously never called. Eventually they sometimes change their number, with no other alternative.November 2, 2017 7:39 am at 7:39 am #1394169apushatayidParticipant
There is no mitzva to answer the phone. Telemarketer is banking on your curiosity. Worse, when you answer, your number is tagged in their database as a number with a human that answers and you will be called again. Best thing to do is pick up phone but do not say a word, they use voice recognition software to flag live respondent, this is why there is a delay After you pick up and human gets on line. After a few times of “dead air”, your number is flagged as one not to call back for a while.
EditedNovember 2, 2017 7:42 am at 7:42 am #1394150tonyquartParticipant
I think the best and safest way for us to deal with them is by ignoring calls from number we don’t recognize. If you sure the caller is telemarketer or debt collector, and your number has been on the DNC list, then just report the number and let the government do the rest. I just read a nice article that might be useful for us at (sorry no links) Hope it helps.November 5, 2017 8:10 pm at 8:10 pm #1396376Lilmod UlelamaidParticipant
The first time that I took a job as a telemarketer, I asked a sheilah and was told that it was muttar, and I’m almost 100% certain that it was not for a tzedaka organization. It was for a Frum organization, but it was a business, not a tzedaka.
The only time I had a yashrus issue with a telemarketing job was the one time I worked for a goyish place, and I felt like they were deliberately taking advantage of people, and possibly being dishonest as well, although it was hard to tell if there was any clear- cut dishonesty going on. That time, I asked a sheilah and was told to quit.November 5, 2017 8:10 pm at 8:10 pm #1396379Lilmod UlelamaidParticipant
Telemarketers or scammers spoofed my wife’s number, and she got a call back from a stranger wondering why she had called them… But she never had.”
That’s really interesting, because I recently called back a “missed call” from my phone, and reached an answering machine with a message saying that they hadn’t called me, and that a scammer had spoofed their number and they were getting hundreds of calls from people who thought they had called them.
I thought it was probably a lie, because it sounded so strange, but I guess it wasn’t.
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