April 15, 2021 8:50 am at 8:50 am #1964980lakewhutParticipant
These are the eight levels of controls to transform a nation through socialism into communism.
1. Healthcare – control healthcare and you control the people.
2. Poverty – Increase the poverty level as high as possible, poor people are easier to control and will not fight back if you provide everything for them to live.
3. Debt – Increase the debt level to an unsustainable level. That way you are able to increase taxes and this will produce more poverty.
4. Gun control – Remove the ability to defend themselves from government. That way you are able to create a police state.
5. Welfare – Take control of every aspect (food, housing, income) of their lives because that will make them fully dependent on the government.
6. Education – Take control of what people read and listen to and take control or what children learn in school.
7. Religion – Remove belief in God from the government and schools because the people need to believe in only the government knowing what is best for the people.
8. Class warfare – Divide the people into the wealthy and the poor. Eliminate the middle class.
You democrat are destroying the world.April 15, 2021 11:02 am at 11:02 am #1965051
At least give credit to Saul Alinsky for your plagiarism.
The democrats are not doing any of these steps.
I argue that republicans are responsible for all of them.April 15, 2021 11:03 am at 11:03 am #1965057
Maybe the Democrats care for people as the Torah does. rather than tne Republicans sink or swim mentality playbook?April 15, 2021 11:19 am at 11:19 am #1965060
The holy Torah makes sure that everyone can swim by requiring the father to teach his child and not like tne Relublicans who could not care less rather tban providing job trainiing and helping with tbeir other needs. The Republicans are destroying the world as the dor hamabul where robbery, ben adam lechavaro, sealed their fate. When people cannot afford their basic needs, it leads to robbery.April 15, 2021 11:20 am at 11:20 am #1965064
I need to apologize to Saul Alinsky. Reuter’s fact checker’s say that the claim that this is from Saul Alinsky is False: Saul Alinsky did not draft an eight-step plan for world conquest, or the creation of a “social state”. These quotes attributed to him on social media are false.April 15, 2021 11:20 am at 11:20 am #1965074
Well saidApril 15, 2021 12:39 pm at 12:39 pm #1965083
Care for people? Like providing abortions for African Americans instead of teaching them the right way
Or maybe you mean like the Taiwanese who China has been persecuting (and the nba doesn’t want to step on China right?)
Or maybe they care for the people that couldn’t go to shul (and if that was “caring” then they didn’t care about the rioters getting the virus)
They for sure didn’t care about the store owners who’s businesses got looted
Do they really care about the kids being brought in by drug cartels to be left in who knows where away from their family? (I’m not going to be more graphic)
The Democrats only care about THEMSELVES!
But hey believe what you want, it’s a free country (which will probably change soon but for now it is)April 15, 2021 12:41 pm at 12:41 pm #1965087DovidBTParticipant
The democrats are not doing any of these steps.
I argue that republicans are responsible for all of them.
That’s another tactic used by socialists/communists/totalitarians: the Big Lie. Keep repeating a lie over and over again, and people will start to believe it, especially if dissenting ideas are suppressed.April 15, 2021 12:41 pm at 12:41 pm #1965088
>The democrats are not doing any of these steps.
I argue that republicans are responsible for all of them.<
Democrats are not doing gun control?
Republicans are responsible for Healthcare?
>rather than the Republicans sink or swim<
Life is sink or swim. Telling anybody otherwise is setting them up for failure.
>like the Republicans who could not care less rather than providing job training and helping with their other needs<
Republicans provide the jobs.April 15, 2021 12:50 pm at 12:50 pm #1965103TGIShabbosParticipant
Reb Eliezer, does the “holy Torah” encourage LGBTQ rights, abortions, climate change, supporting refunding the Palestinians, opening up borders? I think you are just angry because you lost this argument. Right, so I should vote D and not R because I want job training and help with my other needs…. okay…..April 15, 2021 1:14 pm at 1:14 pm #1965119
MadeAlyah, you are not in the US and don’t know what is going on. What is the use when the Republicans provide jobs if the prospective applicants don’t have the skills to apply? It is the biggest level of tzadaka to train one in job skills.April 15, 2021 2:57 pm at 2:57 pm #1965124
We don’t have to follow their lenientcies and what is wrong not the destroy the environment Hashem has provided us? Borders are not being opened up just the immigrants, being one of them, not dealt with cruely. Encourage adoptions, as I did, will cause less abortions and psycological rehabilitatuon for lgbtq behavior. Funding the palestinians is a means of making peace.April 15, 2021 2:58 pm at 2:58 pm #1965125
” the Big Lie. Keep repeating a lie over and over again, and people will start to believe it” .
Where have a heard that before ? I am trying to remember . Oh Right! The one that was said from November 7 2020 until January 6 2021 that led to an insurrection against the capitol and policemen getting killed.
The Republicans are the champions of the big lie.
(For syag’s sake , I am not mentioning his name. )April 15, 2021 2:59 pm at 2:59 pm #1965127
“Care for people? Like providing abortions for African Americans instead of teaching them the right way.” You need to learn more about the Planned Parenthood organization. They do much more than abortions.
The stimulus checks recently all came from Democrats. Not a single republican.
Biden has been laser focused on vaccine distribution.
Most Americans can differentiate between BLM and the Democratic party. Also, the difference between the drug cartels.
Does the Holy Torah encourage people to worship Avoda Zara ? Murder by Police ? Not taking care of Geirim ?April 15, 2021 2:59 pm at 2:59 pm #1965128ubiquitinParticipant
so what step are we up to?April 15, 2021 2:59 pm at 2:59 pm #1965134
>MadeAlyah, you are not in the US and don’t know what is going on.<
Okay, then why don’t you tell what’s going on. How are Republicans diminishing job skills? By keeping schools open?
>What is the use when the Republicans provide jobs if the prospective applicants don’t have the skills to apply?<
Many jobs don’t need skill training.
Many of the trained don’t get a job.April 15, 2021 2:59 pm at 2:59 pm #1965136
Life is a sink a swim but the holy Torah recognizes the requirement to help people when they are down, so the helpers will helped when they are down. We realize that our wealth comes from the help of Hashem and we are distrihuters of the money provided to us.April 15, 2021 3:00 pm at 3:00 pm #1965141
“It is the biggest level of tzadaka to train one in job skills.“
Hashem is the biggest מטיב and the reason he created this world is so that we don’t have נעמה דכסופא (handouts, sorry don’t know how it’s spelled)April 15, 2021 4:17 pm at 4:17 pm #1965158
>Not taking care of Geirim<
>but the holy Torah recognizes the requirement to help people when they are down, so the helpers will helped when they are down. <
Can we please stop using the Torah in a clearly incompatible way? This habit is frustrating to work with and degrades the whole conversation. Thank you.April 15, 2021 4:17 pm at 4:17 pm #1965157QuayboardwarriorParticipant
So what your saying is Kohanim and Leviim getting terumos and maasros was not a privilege but rather quite the opposite? Because they seem like a handout of sorts.April 15, 2021 4:49 pm at 4:49 pm #1965167
However the Torah doesn’t base מעשר off of income it was a flat tax which republicans agree to and תרומה of 1/40-1/60 isn’t based on wealth either but rather how much the בעל הבית wants to give
I’m not saying the תורה is democrat or republican rather a mix of bothApril 15, 2021 4:53 pm at 4:53 pm #1965174MenoParticipant
Life is a sink a swim but the holy Torah recognizes the requirement to help people when they are down, so the helpers will helped when they are down. We realize that our wealth comes from the help of Hashem and we are distrihuters of the money provided to us.
Nu, so vote republican and take the extra money from your tax cuts and give it to tzedakah.April 15, 2021 5:54 pm at 5:54 pm #1965184
I am retired on Social Security and did not get any extra money from tax cuts which just put us into a greater deficit and not growing the economy by providing more jobs. I took advantage of the CETA, Comprehensive Employment and Training Act, program through Project Cope from the Agudah eliminated by Reagan. The COVID relief $1400 was from the Democrats compared to $600 from the Republicans.April 15, 2021 6:09 pm at 6:09 pm #1965195
Reb Eliezer @laskern I honestly don’t understand you.
After fleeing communist Hungary for capitalist America, why would you support broader Government involvement in your finances?April 15, 2021 6:10 pm at 6:10 pm #1965190QuayboardwarriorParticipant
How Terumo or Maaser is calculated is irrelevant. Either way, by your understanding of נעמה דכסופא, the Kohen or Levy would be better off recieving nothing.April 15, 2021 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #1965250
To be fair I’m not sure what to say about an עני I would need to think why an עני isn’t נעמה דכסופא but I don’t think the guy wasn’t working, I think he doesn’t have land to work for some reason
In your case if he has land and decided not to work it would he be entitled to מעשר עני in someone else’s land
Unemployment (at least recently) has been a reason not to work (why should a person work and get less money instead of collecting unemployment)
לפי עניאת דעתיApril 15, 2021 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #1965248
QBW, trumos and maasros given to kohanim and leviim are entirely irrelevant here. And if want to compare maaser ani, to what should be given, to the government, to help the poor, I would think going by percentage makes plenty sense.
Your entire argument, trying to compare the way of the Torah, where we help those who need help, to Democrat handouts, is completely faulty. It assumes the republican party don’t want to help those who need help. False, the difference between republicans/democrats, is the extras, which in some cases incentivizes people to stay home, and not work. Programs that while looking good, certainly passing the eye test, are illogical, from the fairness point of view.
-i’d love to learn about what planned parenthood does besides murdering hundreds of thousands of babies a year.
-And your comments regarding the stimulus coming from only dems, not republicans is missing the x factor. Like, what else was in the “Stimulus” bill? Things that have nothing to do with getting money into the hands of americans, thats what.
-right now Biden doesn’t know a needle from an arm. The distribution has nothing to do with biden, was going to happen regardless.
-“Does the Holy Torah encourage people to worship Avoda Zara ? Not sure what your trying to say.
-“Murder by Police ?” Uh, no, but to conflate murder by police, with justifiable self-defense, is rather misleading.
-“Not taking care of Geirim ?” Again, not sure what your trying to say.
-You say you think republicans are resposible for the eight levels of control. Really?? Hows that? Can we actually debate this, because I think this is very important!April 15, 2021 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #1965246
The Kohen and Levi with treumos and maasros are getting paid for the work in the Beis Hanikdash, so it is not bread of shame. They are even getting it when no Beis Hamikdash to make sure they will always get it as people will not see the difference. They were free from work to teach people the Torah where ths Levi supports the Kohen.April 15, 2021 8:17 pm at 8:17 pm #1965243
Let’s ask the question further
Why does Hashem make stillborns isn’t that נעמה דכסופא?
To answer both I think the answer is that there’s no נעמה דכסופא where the person isn’t able to get it himself, the כהן & לוי can’t own land and just like the stillborn isn’t able to do mitzvosApril 15, 2021 8:22 pm at 8:22 pm #1965262April 15, 2021 8:41 pm at 8:41 pm #1965269
Ren e, I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again, today’s republicans are much closer to democrats of the past, and today’s democrats have gone off the cliff. Your reply is therefore irrelevant.April 15, 2021 9:32 pm at 9:32 pm #1965276
The ACA (Obama Care) was instituted recently, what have the Republicans done for the poor?April 15, 2021 10:12 pm at 10:12 pm #1965290
“The ACA (Obama Care) was instituted recently, what have the Republicans done for the poor?”
One three letter word
J O B S jobs!April 15, 2021 10:57 pm at 10:57 pm #1965293Amil ZolaParticipant
It’s been my experience over the years that folks that credit Alinsky with a laundry list of changes 1) have never read Alinsky 2) don’t even bother to fact check.
In the same vein, folks that think that all PPA does is perform abortions, don’t bother to investigate their claims either.April 15, 2021 11:29 pm at 11:29 pm #1965304emes nisht shekerParticipant
“These are the eight levels of controls to transform a nation through socialism into communism.”
Wow! Where did you get this list from? Can you provide real-world examples of societies that adopted communism showing that these eight levels of control were how it was done.
Truly fascinating stuff. I would be much more curious why someone would post this nonsense in the first place (e.g. I would guess someone susceptible to propaganda of this sort would get worked up over something like this and feel a need to share it with everyone) than wasting time actually analyzing this pointless list.April 15, 2021 11:31 pm at 11:31 pm #1965305
Reb E, reduced taxes, created jobs…
AZ, I don’t really care who created the list, the point is that what lakewut said about them are true. The way democrats tax, yes, even the middle class, and increase government spending, to put as many people as they can on welfare, is disgusting. The democrats control nearly the entire education system, they can, and do indoctrinate the students with whatever social-justice, anti american, anti capitalist propaganda they want. All the while working to eliminate any opposing view.April 16, 2021 2:02 pm at 2:02 pm #1965388HealthParticipant
RE -“The ACA (Obama Care) was instituted recently, what have the Republicans done for the poor?”
What has the DemonCrats done for the Jews?
Don’t worry – I’m gonna post it!
This will prove – your obsession with the DemonCrats is like Avodah Zora!
“How America’s rejection of Jews fleeing Nazi Germany haunts our refugee policy today:
The St. Louis: the ship the US turned away:
On May 13, 1939, 935 people — almost all of them German Jews — set sail from Hamburg, Germany on a ship called the St. Louis. The St. Louis was headed for Cuba, but for most of the Jews aboard, the ultimate destination was the United States. Most of the passengers had applied for US visas, and were planning to move from Cuba to the US once a visa became available for them.
In early June, negotiations stalled and the St. Louis was ordered to leave Cuban waters. It turned toward Miami instead.
US officials had already announced that the ship would not be allowed to land. And when the St. Louis got within a few miles of Miami’s harbor, the Coast Guard started tailing the boat to underline the point.
The US could have agreed to allow the passengers of the St. Louis to land and wait in America for their visas to be processed. President Franklin D. Roosevelt, who a few years later would use an executive order to round up tens of thousands of Japanese Americans and put them in concentration camps, could have ordered that 900 German Jews be allowed to stay. He did not do so. FDR’s defenders (like his presidential library) stress that he never issued a “specific or official order to turn them away.” But he didn’t have to. His government was doing that for him.
254 of the passengers on the St. Louis died in the Holocaust.”
“Congress rejected a bill to take 20,000 Jewish refugee children”:
“The bill’s supporters simply couldn’t marshal the support to counterbalance those arguments. And again, President Roosevelt declined to take a stand — and let restrictionist opposition carry the day. First Lady Eleanor Roosevelt supported the bill, and FDR gave her permission to advocate for it as a private citizen. But she didn’t. And FDR himself refused to take a stance on the bill. When a member of Congress wrote asking what his position was, his secretary filed the inquiry as “File: No action FDR.”
When the Wagner-Rogers bill was taken up by the full Senate Judiciary Committee, committee chair Richard Russell — a Southern Democrat from Georgia who would later, during the civil rights era, become the Senate’s most powerful segregationist — amended it so that the 20,000 Jewish refugee children would count against the German immigrant quota for the year. This totally defeated the purpose of the bill, and the restrictionists knew it. It passed out of committee on June 30, but no one was interested in pushing it into law anymore, and no further action on it was ever taken.”
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