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Facts: There is a video going around which shows several American soldiers urinating on the bodies of dead Taliban fighters. The establishment is going ape about this. Google for more details.
I don’t know why you are going ape. When you tell 18 year olds that it is ok to kill these people, and send them into battle so that these taliban are trying to kill them as well, it should be expected that they will not respect the taliban.
I think it is completely normal. And no big deal.
agreed
No its not ok or normal and Im glad they are going ape over these soldiers who acted like apes. Theres something called respect and dignity. You dont disgrace a dead body. You killed them because they are the enemy. You won. They are dead and its supposed to be over at that point. Now bury the remains or dispose of them in a respectable manner.
I cant believe you guys think that its ok…as Jews it should bother you and if not as Jews then as human beings.
I agree with WIY. A body, even a dead one is still Tzelem Elokim so show some respect. Another far fetched thought I have is maybe since death is “mechaper” then they have been absolved of their sins.
Maybe they held like the Shitto of Tzelem Elokim being free will, thereby dissipating upon death. Perhaps they even didn’t hold of the Shtikkel of Misa Mechaperes, since they figured that even Harugei Beis din don’t get buried in a regular cemetary.
These Marines should be Court-Marshalled. Not for urinating on the bodies of the dreche Talibanim who would have happily beheaded and mutilated their bodies had the situation been reversed, no, they should be charged with criminal stupidity for video-ing the maaseh and posting it on Youtube. Man, what WERE you thinking?
Health: And what was the point of mentioning that? Are you condemning such an action?
US Troops Urinate on Dead Taliban?
And???
BTGuy, I hope you agree that it’s disgusting. (Also, it’s Loeg Larash, since the dead people can’t.)
Hi HaLeiVi,
All I can say is that I see members of the Taliban as being a rodef.
I would not drive into their camps and ask directions. I would not walk into their camps and ask if I can use the rest room. Needless to say, I dont have to explain why.
Personally, I would not urinate on a dead Taliban, but the fact these soldiers did so, I am honestly not feeling any sense of disgust.
If you have the time to explain, what is Loeg Larash, and would it apply to a vicious enemy?
Desecrating the corpses of one’s enemies is sickening. The Iraqi Al-Qaeda did that to Americans in Fallujah in 2004. I don’t think anyone thought that was passably OK. That said, I would offer a few observations:
1. In the past, things like this, or worse, hacking them up and displaying them, was done, as the French say, “pour encourager les autres”, to have a hashpo’oh on others, i.e. to instill fear. As this was not used in that way, and as a Taliban will be more scared by an M1 Abrams tank or an F-16, it serves no practical purpose as well as being sickening.
2. At other times in history, such desecration had a religious undertone (e.g. Aztecs desecrating the corpses of Cortez’s soldiers during the battle for Tenochtitlan in 1521) and were part of an avodah zara ritual. Also sickening, but not what these soldiers were doing.
3. What I can not agree with is the cynical description of this action as “inhuman” by President Karzai of Afghanistan. Beheading aid workers and journalists is inhuman. throwing acid in the face of women who go to school is inhuman. Stoning women to death who were the VICTIMS of an oson is inhuman. This? This is wrong, very wrong, but altogether too human of these young desensitized soldiers to have done.
MODs could we have a more tznius topic, please.
Yes, you may start a more tznius topic. How about “US troops don’t urinate on taliban bodies,” since presumably some of them didn’t.
Mods,
Can you please remove Health’s comment above? It is truly disgusting.
After KIryat Yam Suf Hashem forbid the celebrating by the Angels of the dead Egyptians and we dont say tachanun because of it.
If Hashem could have digity for the Egytians, we can have digity for the Taliban
Yichusdik, excellent comment. I would only argue that Muslims fear humiliation way more than death. They are completely obsessed with the symbolic.
We blow 100 Shofar Blasts to remember the 101 cries of the mother of Sisera.
The Mods comment was very funny regarding US troops who did not urinate on the Taliban.
I dont think any of us would do that. And PBA made a good point that we should not rejoice in our enemies demise, as we are reminded at the Pesach Seder.
But the fact that some of the marines did this, I just want to say that soldiers in the field, in order to take a life as a profession, can understandably be overtaken with a sense of victory. Killing an enemy is not an office job.
Also, remember that the Taliban are an enemy where it would be better for a soldier to be shot dead by them rather than be captured alive.
Seeing that many people here seem passionately offended by what the marines did, would you suggest bringing the marines up on charges?
I would not be in favor of that. Can I assume from some of the posts that some of you would?
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