What Happened With Ezras Nashim In Boro Park On Monday Night?

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  • #1499208

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Health
    What’s with you and ”other sn’s”?
    I only have one. sorry.
    It’s anonymous
    Why would I need another one?

    truncated

    #1499213

    klugeryid
    Participant

    BTW
    How do I access that post? I am clueless to these things.
    (yes health I can’t figure out how to access that post but you think I have two names.
    I only managed to scroll through all your posts on this thread cause I tapped on your name and ywn had it all set up.)
    And once we are on the topic
    You said quite plainly that you discussed it ”in this topic AND…
    חז’ל tell us מלתא דעבידא לאגליי לא משקרת אינשי
    edited!

    #1499234

    Health
    Participant

    kj – “Call it what you want it’s still ossur”

    And being on the internet is even more Osser!
    So why are you?!?
    Stop with your hypocrisy!

    #1499235

    Health
    Participant

    ky – “How do I access that post? I am clueless to these things.”

    Here it is – I did you a favor. I didn’t copy the whole post – that you will have to go to see it.

    “Ahron -“NY Hatzoloh responds to over 70,000 calls a year and is equipped to treat all kinds of medical emergencies. They are governed by state protocols as are all NY ems systems.”
    That’s nice! A lot of people like to play Russian Roulette. How many of those 70 grand are real emergencies?
    I admit they do save lives. Nowadays they train laymen to use AED’s, it doesn’t mean they are medical professionals when they regain a pulse, etc…”

    #1499238

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Wow!!!
    That’s the smoking gun???
    That’s your issue with Hatzola?
    There is no issue mentioned there. Just someone (perhaps it’s you. Perhaps someone else) maligning Hatzola in a different setting.
    Boy did I waste my time with you.
    edited, again. 

    #1499239

    mentsch1
    Participant

    My tenure on a shul board taught me that klal Yisroel can be divided into two groups.
    Those that can be counted on to roll up their sleeves and help out.
    Those that sit on the sidelines and tell all the helpers what they are doing wrong.

    #1499251

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    By now, its almost universally understood that EN and Hatzalah are two great organizations and each does certain things well. However, they are NOT the same and may never be. For any serious life threatening emergency, call Hatzalah/911 asap…..EN is a good alternative for non-life threatening matters where both the quality of care and reducing stress for the woman in need would be enhanced by having a woman first responder where time may not be as critical and ability to communicate issues with another woman are important to the care provided. Over time, EN may evolve to provide equivalent first-responder capability but is generally not at that point today and its not anti-feminist to acknowledge that reality.

    #1500124

    Health
    Participant

    ky -“There is no issue mentioned there.”

    Of course Not!
    Facts are irrevelant to guys like you!
    Who do you think you are?!?
    Why would I mention them on a public forum?
    Now start helping your mother or your wife for Pesach.

    #1500139

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Facts are irrevelant to guys like you!
    What does ” irrevelant” mean?

    Who do you think you are?!?
    Just someone trying to figure out why you would publicly bash Hatzola

    Why would I mention them on a public forum?
    Firstly, who cares why. You said the facts were spelled out there.
    Secondly because it would be common decency to back up your hyperbolic animosity with some sort of facts.

    Now start helping your mother or your wife for Pesach
    Thanks for the sage advice.
    That’s the first sensible thing I have seen from you.

    #1500155

    Health
    Participant

    KY – I just figured it out! You’re Feivel, Mod 80, Ubiq, etc.

    #1500161

    Joseph
    Participant

    Health: I’m feeling left out. Ain’t he me too??

    #1500166

    klugeryid
    Participant

    And Rebyid23
    And poppa bar abba
    And ”the wolf ”
    And health
    And dancingmom
    And shopping613
    And the rest of the moderators
    And Chabadshelucha

    There. I’ve outed myself with all my alternate screen names
    Now answer the simple question
    ”what is your beef against Hatzola? ”

    My personal thoughts are that you were turned down because they don’t take women.

    #1500168

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Sorry Josef
    There is only one of you!!!

    #1500772

    apushatayid
    Participant

    Only a fool will judge an organization made up of thousands of members based on interaction with a handful.

    #1500985

    Little Froggie
    Participant

    I’m also feeling left out…..

    Remember the time he swore that I’m Joseph…. (centuries ago… many screen names ago…)

    #1500995

    Little Froggie
    Participant

    “Those people are terrible.”
    “Oh”
    “What do you mean OH?!? They’re so terrible!”
    “Oh my! What did they do?”
    “I already mentioned it on another thread.”
    “You did?!? Could you be more specific?”
    “No. You’re gonna have to look it up yourself”
    “OK. I’ll repeat it, just once more. I dislike them. They’re terrible.
    “And that’s because…”
    “Do you think I’ll write that on a public forum?!?”

    #1501106

    ConcernedMember
    Participant

    I can’t believe this is still going on.

    It’s really a simple solution.

    There are those who like Ezras Nashim and those who don’t like them. Similarly there are those who like Hatzolah and those who don’t like them. That has been the fact since Day 1 and will never change.

    Those who are a part of, or are supporters of, these organizations will remain so regardless of what people post on the internet. And similarly those who hate those organizations will continue to do so regardless of what people post on the internet.

    So… why even bother with this stupidity?

    Health, we all know your deal. You need to start recognizing that Hatzolah has been around for 50 years and isn’t going to up and disappear because you don’t like them. You’ve been shouting into the wind for years. It must be pretty exhausting by now. You don’t like Hatzolah, we know. Don’t call, don’t donate, don’t sing their praises. But does it ever end with you? Move on. You’ll be a lot “health”ier.

    #1501125

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    This thread is amusing. Having participated in almost every aspect of pre-hospital care, public, private, and volunteer, I can safely say the rate of incompetence amongst all agencies is pretty constant despite Health’s assertions that Hatzolah is some sort of “idiot magnet” for incompetent personnel. IMHO, “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”

    #1501149

    Health
    Participant

    APY – “Only a fool will judge an organization made up of thousands of members based on interaction with a handful”

    So would you say the same thing about the Missionaries that go around? I mean maybe X-ianty is right – because most people in the US practice it? This is just an illustration about your Genius Statement!

    #1501152

    Health
    Participant

    CM -“isn’t going to up and disappear because you don’t like them.”

    It has nothing to do with me right now. But I’m letting people know that sometimes when something doesn’t feel right – it isn’t! Don’t keep it to yourself, just because it isn’t PC!!!

    #1501153

    Health
    Participant

    CAD – “Having participated in almost every aspect of pre-hospital care, public, private, and volunteer, I can safely say the rate of incompetence amongst all agencies is pretty constant”

    This I agree with. But other agencies have options that deal with incompetence. They have supervisors and lawsuits. Try suing H & keeping your kids into Frum schools!

    #1501173

    yitzchokm
    Participant

    Health, what would be grounds for a lawsuit?

    #1501176

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    Health
    “Try suing H & keeping your kids into Frum schools!”

    why not sue then in scret supreme court, so nobody can find out about it?

    #1501281

    klugeryid
    Participant

    So would you say the same thing about the Missionaries that go around? I mean maybe X-ianty is right – because most people in the US practice it?
    Confusion conflation and straw man all in one. That’s impressive.
    The answer is simply
    yes.
    I would say exactly the same thing about the missionaries.
    I don’t judge the religion by the crazies.
    I judge by the entirety of the religion. And theirs doesn’t make it to first base. On merit! Not based on a few nuts.
    Sort of like how I would not judge the logic and reasoning skills of Jews based on one lady with a screen name of health

    #1501316

    apushatayid
    Participant

    “So would you say the same thing about the Missionaries that go around?

    Yes, I would. some are “better” than others. I wouldn’t rate “missionaries” as a group based on the handful of interactions Iv’e had with a missionary.

    “I mean maybe X-ianty is right – because most people in the US practice it?

    For someone who was not familiar with any religion, that would be a fair statement. However, we know that just because most people believe something it doesnt make it true. Most people in NYC, for example, call 911 in an emergency, not 230-1000, doesnt make them right either.

    ” This is just an illustration about your Genius Statement!”

    Actually, this reflects your foolishness. Your statement about missionaries has nothing to do with your 2nd statement about the majority of people and how they worship. I dont believe you are a foolish person, but in your disdain for hatzala you are grasping at the silliest of “arguments” to try and “prove” your point.

    If c’v you are ever faced with a medical emergency, dont call them. It is very simple.

    #1501330

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    “But other agencies have options that deal with incompetence”

    So does Hatzolah. From remediation classes , to practice under observation, to restriction of privileges, to suspension, to termination. Its all there, much like every other BLS/ALS organization. Does it catch everyone? No, but neither does the 911 system’s QA/QI. Incompetence falls through the cracks sometimes, in EVERY organization.

    #1501361

    Health
    Participant

    Ubiq -“why not sue then in scret supreme court, so nobody can find out about it?”

    From this comment it’s obvious that you never found out about my discrimination lawsuit. I thought
    that you were going to ask real lawyers. Or for 2 million – I’d give it to you!
    HAPPY SEARCHING!

    #1501369

    Health
    Participant

    ky -“I don’t judge the religion by the crazies.
    I judge by the entirety of the religion. And theirs doesn’t make it to first base. On merit! Not based on a few nuts.”

    The only other way to know about their religion is if you practiced it. DID YOU?!?

    #1501375

    Health
    Participant

    APY -“Most people in NYC, for example, call 911 in an emergency, not 230-1000, doesnt make them right either.”

    And most Frum Yidden, call Hatzola in an emergency, Not 911, doesn’t make them right either!

    #1501390

    Health
    Participant

    CAD -“to practice under observation, to restriction of privileges, to suspension, to termination.”

    LOL!!! You must be a Hatzola guy. The only case of termination that I heard is when an EMT on Hatzola was working with H Medics & and they let the guy die! This EMT went to a Godol for a Din Torah. And the Medics & the leadership were opposing him – so they they threw the guy off!
    And btw, it wasn’t me – like I posted many times – I never joined them!

    #1501785

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    “only case of termination that I heard….”

    And therein lies the problem. You believe that if YOU didn’t hear of it….it must not have happened, or was some sort of cover up. Well, I am personally aware of ramifications to members who were found clinically (or morally) lacking. I think this is simply just a case of “not enough information” on your part. As you’ve said….you were never a member.

    #1501819

    klugeryid
    Participant

    The only other way to know about their religion is if you practiced it. DID YOU?!?
    Did you ever think before you post?
    Let me list for you some alternative ways
    I studied their religion
    I have a neighbor who practises that religion and we argue religion all the time
    Same as above but with a coworker
    I heard shiurim from my Rebbe on the topic

    And perhaps I did practise it. So what? Maybe I am a ger tzedek and you were just מבטל מצוות עשה של ואהבתם את הגר
    Maybe I am a בעל תשובה and you were just עובר ולא תונו איש את אמיתו

    ”And most Frum Yidden, call Hatzola in an emergency, Not 911, doesn’t make them right either!”

    Doesn’t that sort of disprove your point?
    Are you now going to respond to yourself with some nasty gibberish?

    #1501850

    Health
    Participant

    CAD – “.it must not have happened,”

    That’s your False assumption.

    “or was some sort of cover up”

    This I believe! Just like I posted in my previous post to you!
    Why didn’t they throw the Medics out, instead of the EMT?!?

    #1501847

    Health
    Participant

    ky – “Doesn’t that sort of disprove your point?”

    How??? Most people are clueless – when it comes to the practice of medicine!
    Unless you will claim that anyone who practices medicine (Eg. Doctors) in the Frum Community must be competent.
    There is No such thing as incompetence!

    #1501878

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    CAD – “.it must not have happened,”

    That’s your False assumption.

    There is no false assumption, you’ve staked a claim about an issue that you admit you have no information about other than some case you’ve “heard” about. You aren’t in Hatzolah, and never were (your admission) You are not part of their QA/QI process. You are not in a management position there. You are not on every call. And Hatzolah doesn’t report to you. Yet you feel confident that if YOU didn’t hear about a disciplinary action, there was none. This is very silly. Do you hear of FDNY’s disciplinary proceedings? Are you in the loop of say……Midwood’s terminations? Are you somehow in the know about NYU’s ALS remediation list? How about OLOM’s? Sinai? RPS? Presby? Anyone? I’m going to go out on a limb here and posit that the answer is no. That doesn’t mean its not happening, does it? What Hatzolah offers is at the very least, on par with any EMS system.

    #1501897

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Interesting how you had no response to the main thrust of my post

    #1502105

    Health
    Participant

    ky -“Interesting how you had no response to the main thrust of my post”

    Ok – here goes:

    “I studied their religion”

    WHY – It’s Avodah Zora?!?

    “I have a neighbor who practises that religion and we argue religion all the time
    Same as above but with a coworker”

    Why waste your time discussing Avodah Zora?!?

    #1502107

    Health
    Participant

    CAD -“What Hatzolah offers is at the very least, on par with any EMS system.”

    That’s where I disagree! In the case I just mentioned, the Goyim would get rid of them & maybe other consequenses. And I know of other cases where your group caused death – first hand knowledge!

    #1502264

    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    Other EMS can’t cause death–they don’t show up until that’s impossible!

    #1502315

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    “That’s where I disagree! In the case I just mentioned, the Goyim would get rid of them & maybe other consequenses.”

    And how would you know this? Are you a QA/QI manager? Do you run an EMS agency? You are welcome to disagree with facts and statistics, but it certainly doesn’t paint you in a rational light

    “And I know of other cases where your group….”
    My “group”? And what group would that be? Jews? Bodybuilders? Vegetarians? Ah….yes I am being facetious…you mean Hatzolah members, but I am not one.

    “caused death – first hand knowledge”

    Well if you witnessed mal, mis, or nonfeasence , then you have a moral and ethical imperative to report that. Otherwise you are complicit. But I’m going to go out on a limb and surmise that you don’t have any real information to share as you probably didn’t witness anything, or if you did, didn’t understand the nature of what was being done. Though you will certainly answer me that “I have more medical knowledge than you, and etc etc etc…..” which is unlikely.

    #1502405

    Health
    Participant

    CAD -“And how would you know this?”

    Any problem with any EMS Call becomes News. It’s Not hidden!

    “You are welcome to disagree with facts and statistics, but it certainly doesn’t paint you in a rational light”

    What doesn’t paint me in a rational light?

    “you mean Hatzolah members, but I am not one.”

    So why are you defending them? Unless you’re a Wannabe & gonna show them this YWN topic.

    “then you have a moral and ethical imperative to report that.”

    Who says I didn’t?!?

    “Otherwise you are complicit.”

    What??? You obviously don’t know American Law.

    “if you did, didn’t understand the nature of what was being done.”

    LOL. With this line you surely belong in the Chevra!
    You’re right – only they know medicine & I don’t.
    You’re getting funnier by the minute!

    #1502400

    Health
    Participant

    Yidd23 -“Other EMS can’t cause death–they don’t show up until that’s impossible”

    Stop with your lies & sarcasm. Tell them to your wife, if you have one.

    #1502424

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    Any problem with any EMS Call becomes News. It’s Not hidden!
    A) Wrong. Proof you are not someone in the loop.

    What doesn’t paint me in a rational light?
    A) bizarrely claiming to know FOR CERTAIN” that Hatzolah has no internal procedures for tracking care, when it CLEARLY does and pretty much HAS to as a condition of being an ALS provider. But you wouldn’t know that as you are generally ignorant of at least pre-hospital medicine.

    So why are you defending them? Unless you’re a Wannabe & gonna show them this YWN topic.
    A) because I like exposing ignorance and bias when I see it, and YOU are clearly biased.

    Who says I didn’t?!?
    A) well, you seem to only have a bit of knowledge about some case you’ve “heard” about…And when called to the carpet about anything else, you suddenly recall “first hand knowledge” of other cases where they caused the death of a patient. Well, now that’s just suspicious. And probably not the truth.

    What??? You obviously don’t know American Law.

    A) I do, and it was meant ethically. As in the subject directly leading to that sentence. Reading comprehension….try it.

    LOL. With this line you surely belong in the Chevra!
    You’re right – only they know medicine & I don’t.

    A) given previous conversations we’ve had, you likely don’t understand critical care or emergency medicine, even if you think you do because you’ve taken ACLS a few times.

    You’re getting funnier by the minute!

    Thank you, I certainly try. I also expect that browbeating and insults will soon follow on this thread. As is your MO. Now, given the wealth of information you do NOT posess, I feel this is a mismatched battle as you are unarmed. And so I bid you adieu……

    #1502439

    Health
    Participant

    CAD -“even if you think you do because you’ve taken ACLS a few times.”

    Stop with your lying – what do you know about EMS? You’re an eye doc?!?

    Are you Mod 80 along with Kluger yid, Ubiq, Feivel, etc.?
    And I thought only Joseph played these games!
    I guess it’s BORING in the Nursing Home.

    #1502435

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Health
    Quote
    ”Ok – here goes:

    “I studied their religion”

    WHY – It’s Avodah Zora?!?

    “I have a neighbor who practises that religion and we argue religion all the time
    Same as above but with a coworker”

    Why waste your time discussing Avodah Zora?!?” (end quote)

    You may or not have a good question there. However try to strain your brain for a moment and remember what the aforementioned lines were written in response to.
    Can’t recall?
    OK
    Let me help you by cutting and pasting your words that I was responding to.
    (quote)
    The ##only ##other way to know about their religion is if you practiced it. DID YOU?!?
    Hash tags were now inserted by me
    Capital letters are yours.
    All clear??
    Great let’s proceed
    You staked a claim that there was no way to have knowledge of their religion except if I practised it.
    I provided you with multiple alternatives. Only one of which is necessary to accomplish the stated aim.
    You had no response and I called you on it.
    So you respond with a question as to WHY I would do some of those alternatives?????
    Who cares!!
    They are ways to be aware of the details of a different religion without practising that religion.
    Contrary to your stated claim.
    Man up and say
    ”I was wrong ”
    It won’t hurt as much as you think

    #1502463

    Ctrl Alt Del
    Participant

    what do you know about EMS? You’re an eye doc?!?

    I would love to be an ophthalmologist, they’re well paid. But as predicted in my earlier comment, you have strayed from direct, on topic answers, and have devolved into reflexive defensive mocking and insults. Which really leaves us at the conclusion that: you have some personal bias against Hatzolah that colors your outlook. And having that bias is ok, as long as you’re intellectually honest with yourself and own up to it and not try to clothe it with an air of respectability and authority.

    #1502563

    Health
    Participant

    Ky-“Man up and say
    ”I was wrong ”
    It won’t hurt as much as you think”

    I just proved that I was right when I posted -“The only other way to know about their religion is if you practiced it.”
    So – Man up and say
    ”I was wrong ”.
    It won’t hurt as much as you think!

    #1502571

    Health
    Participant

    CAD -“Which really leaves us at the conclusion that: you have some personal bias against Hatzolah that colors your outlook. And having that bias is ok, as long as you’re intellectually honest with yourself and own up to it and not try to clothe it with an air of respectability and authority.”

    As a Frum Yid it bothers me to say nothing about their medical care! So of course I have bias.

    “Now, given the wealth of information you do NOT posess, I feel this is a mismatched battle as you are unarmed.”

    Now why in the world would you make such a comment?
    I was a paramedic. And I have 2 other degrees in medicine.
    So I’ll repeat – “So why are you defending them?”
    Now what degrees to you possess?!?
    And try to be honest, if you are capable!

    #1502586

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    Health
    “Now what degrees to you possess?!?”

    This EXACT question has been posed to you dozens of times.
    It’s cute that you demand honesty of others when you keep repeating this obviously bogus claim (aside from many other lies you’ve been caught in including in this thread that demonstrates it isn’t just me who sees through you)
    Without elaborating at all

    #1502598

    klugeryid
    Participant

    Health
    Ky-“Man up and say
    ”I was wrong ”
    It won’t hurt as much as you think”

    I just proved that I was right when I posted -“The only other way to know about their religion is if you practiced it.”
    So – Man up and say
    ”I was wrong ”.
    It won’t hurt as much as you think!

    How exactly does that prove you are correct???
    Do you know the definition of the word prove??

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