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philosopher, re: “That will cause a crisis in a different way. “
What crisis are you referring to?
To all those who never went on a Shidduch date and “met on their own”, that’s not easy either. From what I hear, the singles functions, these days, attract loads of girls and very few guys, so the girls all feel like fifth legs, except for the prettiest ones who get surrounded by the few guys and the rest of the girls go home disappointed.
Are there any other ways to meet that Im not aware of?
lesschumras, whether right or wrong, the parents fear isn’t to the extent of “what they’ll do”, it is who they might choose to associate with, that might displease the parents and “ruin” reputations and chances of a good Shidduch, by their daughters simply speaking to the wrong people.
Although, with so many years of the Shidduch crisis having left us with many many disgruntled older single girls around putting a damper on the home atmosphere, I think now many parents of girls almost wish their daughters could meet boys on their own.
cholentkugelkishke, conversations with Chinuch professionals in the YU/Sterns Torah U Mada group, can enlighten. There is a shift to the right, mostly.
cholentkugelkishke, allow me to go off on a tangent, but would you also say it’s u n f a i r to say that there’s a higher incidence of crime and obesity among African Americans, despite what studies show, because all ethnic groups have a percentage of obese and criminal individuals?
While I’m sure Mechanchim are to blame in some cases, I think it’s more of a disenchantment felt by children due to issues at home.
Please correct me if Im wrong, but from my observation, the ratio of OTD kids, defined by me as children choosing to be much less observant than their parents, is much higher among those to the right of the YU/Sterns Derech. I think it’s higher among Yeshivish/Litvish/Agudah/Heimish/Chassidish families and lower among those to the left religiously.
In my opinion it’s due to the lifestyle of not focusing on anything but Torah until there arises a serious need for Parnassa, causing many difficult to deal with issues and a skewed value system, where parents are forced to follow the “you gotta do what you gotta do” lifestyle to survive financially, which children are witness to, and Rabbonim in those spheres turn a blind eye to.
In the end, by and large, the homes where the Nachas Ruach is greater, are those homes where there was reality thinking, financial preparedness and responsibility on part of both partners, early on, which is contrary to the teachings of many of our right wing schools.
SJSinNYC, The black mark on their record is a deterrent but not enough of a deterrent obviously. If people thought more carefully before making their decision, because the consequenses of breaking a Shidduch were greater than the black mark, we’d have less heartache.
Also, with the Shidduch crisis the way it is, I’ve heard of really good and desirable girls getting engaged to guys who broke more than one engagement, so the black mark doesnt affect the guys half as much as it affects the girls.
IMHO if there were some consequences applied (monetary and/or the inability to date for a year, the other side keeps all gifts) to those who break engagements, there might be less broken, also people would think more carefully before entering into a Shidduch when there are consequences in place for those who break it.
hereorthere, I know of one such Rebbetzin who caters to older single girls. She gives Shiurim regularly and takes them on trips. While that has its value, what the girls really need are husbands, in order to live the lives they want and live up to the expectations in our society. Thats offering someone a bandaid, when they really need surgery.
Another point I think is worth mentioning, upon observation of the same girls who are right out of high school and seminary, and then again 5 years later, if they’re still single, very often their Tznius has deteriorated greatly.
Bec. of hardship in finding Shidduchim, their single status causes them great unhappiness and dissatisfaction and often a downturn in their level of Bitachon, combined with being unmarried and in the secular world, causing a decline in their Tznius.
Those who visit Kollel communities and see the mode of dress on the street and at Simchos, and who speak to Shadchanim and hear what a greater percentage of learners are stipulating in potential girls, find that what should be, isnt what is.
The sad but true joke is that when Tznius rallies are held, those who are the “4 inch below the knee” crowd come, while the ones who could use improvement, dont bother coming.