Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
starwolf: nice try attempting to distort my post. assuming this sites readers dont have the i.q. of cabbage, nobody fell for it. I criticized you for asserting that physical safety justifies taking a spiritual risk, thats for a Gadol to decide. you’ve simply repeated that dubious contention a second time, it hasn’t become any more intelligent.
joseph: i read the entire drasha, it was brilliant. you have a tremendous talent for explaining in an eloquent and orderly fashion, the shita’s of the Gedolim. chazak ve’ematz
Pashuta Yid: Believe me, your point wasnt worth amplifying. everyone knew that it was possible to bribe the nazis ym’s, it had already been done successfully in Slovakia. Most importantly, the zionists didnt hesitate to bribe the nazis at the end of the war, when it served their own purposes.
starwolf: YU preceded MO by a long time. Rabbi Moshe Shatzskes was hardly MO.
just-a-guy: i cant change history to suit your preferences. would you like me to photoshop a yarmulka on their heads.
starwolf: “the spiritual dangers most definitely did not exceed the physical benefit. Those people died in horrible circumstances.” i couldn’t have asked for a better summary of your weltenshaung. how can you possibly weigh a spiritual tradegy against a physical
one.
“There was no way to predict how they would have lived their lives had they emigrated.” why was the trend set by the first wave of zionist initiated immigration not an accurate prediction?
feif un and starwolf: those philanthropists whose aid Rav Aaron Kotler and other Roshei Yeshivos enlisted in starting their mosdos were hardly MO. (which arguably didn’t exist at the time) they were conservative, reform, traditional, or just plain frei. if you really want to align yourselves with them, go right ahead. once we’re on the subject, perhaps you could explain why you seem feel that you have no obligations yourselves to support Torah mosdos and feel that you deserve eternal gratitude for every cent you contribute?
as far as “The Holocaust in History” is concerned, i don’t have it on hand, and therefore can’t reference page numbers, but there is no shortage of damning material in his sections on the zionistic leaders of the judenraat, the response of world zionist leaders etc.
truthsharer: it’s well known that Rav Elchonon Wasserman could have saved himself by remaining in america, but chose to return to be together with his talmidim. However i have never seen or heard anywhere that he could have saved his yeshiva as well, please back that up.
starwolf: are you living in a vacuum? if you’ll reread my previous posts you’ll see that i already listed several books. you ask what the chareidi world has accomplished? nothing much, aside from rebuilding Torah from the ashes (despite the hindrances of your ilk). i know that thats probably meaningless to you, but its only fair to judge a society by their own ideals.
starwolf: can you quote anything relevant to back up your statements (books, articles, research papers)? Just spare us any more MO pride drivel.
Ha ha ha, just kidding. Actually youre attempts to rewrite history are so pathetic its embarrassing. Another great book that might remove some of your ignorance is “The Holocaust In History” by Prof. Michael R. Mauruss.
You’re probably right. Sorry, my mistake.
starwolf: It’s understandable that you need to protect the zionists from attack at all costs, the alternative is to change your entire worldview. Zionist complicity in the Holocaust is considered an irrefutable fact by all historians, only the extent of it is debated. I’m sure you have read perfidy, but check out also “kivshei ha’ashanim ma’ashimim” in hebrew by Rabbi Moshe Shoenfeld z”l.
For people who consider themselves intellectuals some comments here are pretty vapid. The Chareidim have a reasonable Shita that the Zionist government does not have a legitimate right to function. This Shita was formulated by Gedolim and is partly based upon the fact that the founders of the medinah were complicit in the Holocaust, and also coerced thousands of sefardic children to abandon judaism. Some posters on this site attempt to malign anyone involved with the Eidah as hot-headed zealots. Lets remember that Dayan Weiss, the current head of the Eidah was very highly regarded in England only a few short years ago. Inane, dithering comments about how the Zionist founded a beautiful society, made the dessert bloom etc. are completely besides the point and fail to convey anything meaningful.