Are Women Really Jewish?

Has nobody realized pba was joking

Just like u never joke

Pattur Aval Assur +1

Yevamos 63a:

?”? ????? ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ???

??:

???? ??? ????? ?? ??? ???? ?? ???? ???? ???

So apparently, unmarried men and men who don’t own land, are really women. Hence they are not Jewish. But how could they not be Jewish?

They wear tzitzis, wear tefilin, wear yarlmukes, learn, daven, eat in the sukkah, and do all of the mitzvos.

They count for a minyan, they can be motzi Jews in mitzvos, they can read from the torah, they can be a witness, can be a judge, etc.

They even have a bris, which is the sign of our covenant with Hashem!

In short, they fulfill all the criteria mentioned by Popa in his first post. Now if they are not Jewish despite fulfilling all the criteria for Jewishness, then clearly we have the wrong criteria. Which means Popa’s whole proof that women aren’t Jewish is not a proof. Which means that presumably women are Jewish. But if women are in fact Jewish then that means that unmarried men (who as established above, are really women) are Jewish. Well if they’re Jewish then there is no reason not to accept Popa’s criteria, in which case women really aren’t Jewish. And then the circle starts again.

PAA

:??????? ??

One Rashi refers to ????? ????????? and ????? ???????. That says that they’re Jewish.

Another Rashi says “???? ???? ??”

That one solves at complicates your Rosh Chodesh idea, and might solve your syllogism.

Also, your proof from yevamos is lav davka– He is not a man, but that doesnt automatically make him a child. Maybe he isnt a man because his bones melted?

Or he(it?) is an androgonynous and is now married to him(it?)self

secretagentyid:

Do you mean 35b? There he says ???? ???????? and ?????. Though I don’t know of a Rashi that says ???? ???? ??.

Either way, you’re bringing a Rashi against explicit pesukim, an explicit Pirkei D’rabbi Eliezer, an explicit Gemara, and an explicit Rosh.

Regarding the proof from Yevamos, I was assuming that if he’s not a man then he is a woman. He wouldn’t be a child just because he’s not married. And his bones would only melt if he’s past 20.

Patur – in ref. to your answer to my post that Jewish women aren’t Jewish because the whole nation bowed to the eigel, even though we know that the women did not, in the same vein I ask you if Shevet Laivi is also not Jewish, even though we know that they also did not bow to the eigel.

I’m glad someone finally came to the obvious conclusion. Of course women aren’t Jewish! But who ever said you have to be Jewish to make a good cholent?

Is cholent ???? ?? ???? ??????

Usually I find myself battling the people who say that women are more spiritual so I’m happy to find that this post upset me as much as that silly notion. It’s a throwback to the way people talked 50 years ago in the days of male chauvinism. Today usually you hear female chauvinism.

Here’s what Rabbi Miller had to say about it:

As we know, men are commanded to perform mitzvos asei she’haz’man grama, time-bound mitzvos. Women, on the other hand, are not required to perform these mitzvos. What is the reason for this difference? The answer is that women have other important obligations to tend to, which exempt her from these commandments. A woman must know that she is a briah shel chessed, she has been created for the purpose of performing chessed. Being a wife and mother is a very significant role, and it requires her to be selfless and totally dedicated to performing chessed! It takes a woman’s entire effort to succeed in being an efficient mother and wife. Investing her abilities in raising children is very time consuming but is a tremendous zechus for her! (Rabbi Avigdor Miller Speaks, pp. 271-3)

Only a lioness can give birth to a tigon yet a lioness is not a tigon.

When popa says shelo asani goy and then shelo asani isha, is it a bracha l’vatala?

You never really said that you actually say it…

Shelo Asani Isha

In fact, though, I stole your joke:

http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/shelo-asani-isha#post-302605

Words have the meaning we give to them

As a society, yes, but when you start using words in an abnormal manner, meaning in a way which most people don’ generally use them, you get the reaction this thread engendered. (pun intended).

I think “do you get an aveirah” is another thread you should read with your class.