Why are all the elementary schools starting so so late? Bitul zman?
Moderators Note: Most people returned from the Catskills today (Sunday 8/30/09), and most yeshivos are starting next Tuesday (9/08/09). This leaves children with week and a half of nothing to do.
To keep the parents busy for two weeks.
Huh? In some cities they're starting a week earlier than usual.
In some states, by law the public schools won't start till after labor day (could be lobbying by the tourism industry) so maybe schools who use public school teachers for their general studies are having trouble getting them to agree to come earlier? Maybe that's what's happening by you?
Believe it or not, I asked a teacher and she said the Rosh Yeshiva in her school wanted to start this week, but a few parents complained it was too soon and to wait to start school till next week??!! Meanwhile, the children have less time to prepare for the Chagim.
Thank you to all the dear parents who complained and got their wish. Now would you be so kind and take my kids for this week so I don't go insane!!
mazal, send 'em all over.
Are you sure you want em?? I may just take you up on it!!
Maybe every year there is a big increase in complaints about schools and teacheers. Everyone thinks they would do a much better job. If the schools give an extra two weeks off maybe the parents will start realizing a tiny drop of what a teacher does for them and their children and then they will perhaps (not for sure) appreciate them.
total insanity!
not to mention it's just 3 weeks to rosh hashana.
there is no valid answer for this madness
The summer vacation is way too long to begin with. The excuse of no bussing from NYC is not good enough.
Chassidish yeshivas all start this week.
Let's not forget to mention the hundreds of mothers who need to start jobs now to try and help pay the bills to make it through the costly yomim tovim. How can they start work with kids at home all day?!
I don't like to point fingers, but someone womewhere is very incompetent.
Camp should have started later, ended later, or yeshiva should have started earlier. end of story!!
if i take my kids to florida, they all scream bitul torah why is this different?
Lets get practical here... instead of complaining list all great ideas you have to keep your kids busy over the next week plus.
What projects, games, small trips, or activities do you have planned for your kids? It seems like we all knew this was coming so where are the high school girls looking to make some extra money with a day camp for the next week???
mazal, yup. We're waiting with open arms, we're so bored. ;)
Starting later reduces some costs for schools. Makes it easier to balance budgets.
I dont get it. When I was in elementary school in NYC, we constantly started the day after Labor Day. Labor Day comes out between 9/1 and 9/7 as it does this year. Thus, when I was in Yeshiva K'tana we would start on the 8th. The reason for this could have to do with the Public Schools which also start then and the Yeshivas wouldn't have Limuday Chol teachers till then.
I have a question back, why do you look at your kid's school as your own personal babysitting service???
Maybe spend some time with your kids and get to know them a bit in a way you haven't till now. You may actually learn something about them you didn't know?!
to mark levin
when i go to florida for a week, that's excactly what i would like to do, but it's not allowed. why the double standard?
A whole week with nothing to do?
Maybe we could just let them be kids for a week - no schedules, no demands, no anxiety.
Let them figure out what to do for themselves. There are toys, and books, and other kids to play with. I grew up when and where only rich kids went to camp. The rest of us played games, read books, planted tings in the yard (you can plant in containers in the city, too), made stuff out of plasticine. You know, developed our imaginations, learned to structure our own time. OK, so we bugged our parents a little bit once in a while, but we figured out for ourselves how to keep busy and interested.
Bad enough we keep them in school for such ridiculous hours during the school year, then send them off to some regimented camp.
Can't we just let them be kids once in a while?
Is it so terrible that parents actually have to take care of their kids for a week??
I'm sorry- Mazal, you make me angry. Any extra time I can spend with my kid- I love.
I know you were joking but its still sad...
Actually, Luv2hack, I have a relative in the hospital, so I have to depend on one of my older children, to care for 3 kids under the age of 7, so I can visit this relative. Otherwise, I don't mind when my kids are home. I do say things in jest. I just have to keep a sense of humour sometimes. This week would have been great to do something with my children,but I can't. Don't make me feel bad about it.
luv2hack,
Your words hurt every loving parent that has to make convoluted, variegated childcare arrangements for their children because their job (through which they pay tuition) does not allow extra "off days".
Some children do NOT appreciate being sent to a variety of neighbors and relatives, (only one day per hosting family, so as not to be an undue burden), and Moms everywhere are heartsick and overburdened by needing to make these difficult arrangements, entailing endless phone calls and subdued children, on top of working difficult jobs to pay for tuition when school does start.
So, luvtohack, please try to "hack" in a way that doesn't hurt others. Your sweet, idyllic life in which you share loving quality time with your children on school off days sounds lovely. Not all of us have your luxury.
actually, I work 8 hour days everyday so I DO know what its like and I would die to be able to complain about having to take care of my kids for an extra week... that's the point I was trying to make. and mazal - I'm sorry. I knew you didn't mean it and I'm sorry ur in that situaion it just makes me upset when my friends complain abt taking care of their kids when I would do anything to take care of him for a whole week...
Did anyone here bother asking the children what they would prefer? Are they not entitled to an opinion, its THEM we are discussing?!
Lets be realistic. Its not like this is a surprise to anyone. We had an entire summer to make plans for this week.
Keep in mind that Chol Hamoed Succos is an entire week of "weekdays" will we blame the yeshivos for not opening up then?
luv2hack,
No one can understand another's personal pain. Let's try to be kind to everyone, because no one has a monopoly on pain, and your pain does not mitigate the problems of unhappy children who are shuffled to and fro because of excessive off-days.
Please re-read- some of us do not GET to "spend a week" with the children, because our employers do not allow us to do so. The complaint isn't about spending "quality time" planting seeds in the backyard, it is about the difficulty of placing children in an assortment of places when all they want is to be home.
May Hashem bentch you with your desires, and may this year be one of Simcha for you and all of Klal Yisrael.
in monsey ,most day camps ended aug 21 and school starts sept 9th and 10th ...that is rediculous !!! how are working parents supposed to pay tuition when they are forced to stay home for the kids!!! ...i bet all the people who are not complaning are a bunch of women who dont work , but what about the homes that needs the wife to work to survive , how are they supposed to deal with kids being home for 2 weeks!?!??!i love being home with my kids, spending time with my kids, but this is just too much time off!
The parents that brought their families home from the Catskills yesterday Sunday 08/30/09 have to realize that not everyone has returned from the Catskills yet & therefore it would not be fair for the children of the families that are still there if yeshiva would start this week. Remember the only reason why so many familes came home yesterday instead of this upcoming Sunday is because owners of Bungalow colonies do not want to keep the colony open so late when Labor Day is very late as is the case this year. As far as starting Yeshiva earlier because of Rosh Hashana the Yeshiva's will be doing that next Year when they will start at the end of August if Moshiach is not here when Rosh Hashana will be two days after Labor Day.
In New York, at least, the yeshivas are serviced by teh same bus as the public schools, so there would be no bus service for msot elementary schools--and then the parents would complain about having to shlep them to school. What is truly sad is that kids are not taught at an early age how to occupy themsevles, either with reading or a hobby. But of course they are kept so busy during the school year, they have no time for extracurricular activities. My kids were never bored, BH.
Well, for mothers that work during the day (for whatever there cheshbon is) these last few weeks of summer are quite difficult to arrange. I have 3 young children, one of whom is home with a babysitter that I share with a neighbor. The 2 school aged children spent there summer as follows: Their schools ended on different days of the week of June 15th, then they went to a Pre-Camp camp for 1 week. Then they each went to a backyard camp for July and a different one for August. (We had a few short vacations in the middle when I was able to take off a few days.) Those camps ended August 20th. My daughter's elementary school starts Thursday, Sept 10th, my son has orientation for his kindergarten the following day, but doesn't start a full day untile Monday,Sept 14th. So for me, it is nearly 3 weeks to fill up since the camps ended (no, not everyone goes to the country!). the last week of August, both of the went to Post-Cmap Camps (in different neighborhoods), my son's camp continues through this week but my daughter's did not. Today she is home with the babysitter, but we will take it day by day. (don't even ask how we managed all the carpooling!)
While I love spending time with my kids, and if I could , would quit my job on a dime and stay home to do just that, it is not an option for me at this time. So for us working moms, I would much rather have my children in a structored school setting then home with the babysitter (which is not always an option as I share the babysitter with a neighbor who also has 3 kids - we cannot both leave all our kids as that would be having onr babysitter watch 6 children! Thus the need for all these Pre and Post Camp options. I grew up out of town where schools started the last week of August - uusually the 29th or 30th and ended slightly before the NY schools, therfore spacing out the breaks more evenly between the end of June and the end of August!
Maybe the day camps also can run a bit longer?
All yeshivos should have started by this coming wed.
The yeshivas can use the extra week w/o students to prepare, considering the Rabbaim & Moros have only returned (assuming they were gone) just now.
oh please!! on the parent's expense???
to mi keamcha yisroel
Having all Yeshivos started by this coming Wednesday is not a fair option as there are probably a few Bungalow Colonies that will still be open until Sunday & starting School would be unfair to the few families that will be in the country until than. It's not bitul zeman as Elementary Yeshivos starts a day or two after Labor Day every year unless there is a year like next in 2010 when Rosh Hashana will be two days after Labor Day & I am almost positive that the Yeshivos will be starting at the end of August next year if Moshiach is not here yet.
so these people can come down from the country a couple days early.
mi keamcha yisroel:
If you have an issue, you can move your business elsewhere. The yeshiva wants to teach, not babysit. If they decided that a week to prepare will help them teach for the entire year, so be it.
It is a little late to complain about this... we all knew this was coming...
gavra, I disagree, this should be addressed to all the yeshiva administrations
have a great day, i'll be back maybe later
your'e right. but i'm lazy
why doesnt anybody here think of the people who actually NEED the vacation: the kids. they just finished camp ( which CAN BE tiring and you need time to change modes)and will be starting school. Give them a break!as for the parents who sit there complaining about taking care of their kids, consider those women who do not have kids.Im not saying i dont understand just be a little more tactful about it. last but not least: why dont you think about all those kids reading this. they probably feel GREAT about themselves.
exuse me. All camps were already finished by aug. 24 monday. So the yeshivos should start tomorrow or wed.
"why doesnt anybody here think of the people who actually NEED the vacation: the kids. they just finished camp (which CAN BE tiring and you need time to change modes)and will be starting school."
Oh. my. goodness. So the couple thousand each parent spent on camp was really just...a prerequisite to a vacation. I'm speechless.
O.K. all of you complainers....Bein Hazmanim is coming up soon and I will be 'enjoying'
five BIG boys at home...all doing there own thing ,at their own pace,at their own time... at this time my kitchen is taken over...and just about never gets clean- unless two of them get ambitious at the same time -which happens sometimes...
so mentally I prepare-and then I look forward to the cleaning help I will get right after Rosh chodesh Cheshvan...
Rabbi Yaakov Bender Shlita, Rosh HaYeshiva of Yeshiva Darchei Torah in Far Rockaway realized this problem and realized there is no need for kids to just be sitting home for a week and a half doing nothing so He is therefore starting yeshiva on Wednesday.
to luv2hack,
I spent some time thinking about my reply to you, and realized that it was highly insensitive.
Although my original post was regarding the problems placing frustrated children in many and various places, and not the "boredom" of the off days, I wrote that "no one has a monopoly on pain", and "your pain does not mitigate the pain of others", and that was uncalled for.
No one can measure pain, and no one should be commenting on another individual's pain in this way. As I happen to be going through my own very difficult "pain" at the moment (no, the the placement issue), I am touchy and easily riled. That does not give me the right to hurt someone else.
I will try to be much more careful in the future. Please be Mochel me.
The following was just posted on the YWN Homepage:
Another Outraged Parent Questions Why Brooklyn Yeshivas Have Not Started
September 2, 2009
YWN has been getting dozens of letters from parents outraged at why Yeshivas have not yet started in Brooklyn.
The following is the latest letter received: (Please see note at bottom)
Someone has to do an explanation as to why the Brooklyn yeshivos, of Tashbar (Tinokos Shel Beis Rabban) have not started Yeshiva yet and wont until after Labor day. They have been off since Mid to late June which would make the time off for both Students and Rabbeim close to three months when next week comes around.
I understand that Rabbeim work very hard all year and don’t get paid enough for the amount of time they put in both during and off hours, but what are the children supposed to do at home, game boys? PSP and even worse? What are the parents supposed to do when Jobs call and the kids are at home? Pay more and more money to baby sitters? Are these sitters and cleaning help the people that our children should be with on a daily basis for 3 weeks from when camp let out till when Yeshivos start?
How then can we pay tuition’s?
What ever happened to Ain Mivatlin Talmud Torah Shel Tinokos Shel Beis Rabban Afilu L’binyan Beis Hamikdosh?
I am thoroughly perplexed as to who made these decisions as to when yeshivos should start and i hope there are good answers to where are all the tefilos, and pure Torah of our most precious resource, our Tashbar.
We need all the zchusim we can get in these days of Yimei rachamim and Ratzon.
A gut gebenched Yahr.
(Name withheld upon request)
EDITORS NOTE: Most people returned from the Catskills on Sunday 8/30/09, and most yeshivas are first starting classes next Tuesday (9/08/09). This leaves children with a full week and a half of nothing to do.
All anyone complaining had to do is look at the calendar to see how to plan for the time. DO IT NOW! Look at the Luach for Next September- When do you wnat the Yeshiva's so start? With Rosh Chodesh ELul- In the Beginning of August? Notice that Rosh Hashanah is the Shabbos after Labor Day.
Look ahead-Plan ahead-Think ahead- Speak to your Yeshiva's Hanhallah now about next year!
What should the children be doing?
Here is a list for all of you EDITED that have the children, but can't think of what to do to entertain them.
Read a book.
Do an art project
bake cookies
make bread or challah
watch a video
play a game inside or outdoors
go to the mall
go to the zoo
go to a park
learn
teach your child to do something new (sewing does not have to be for girls only)
color
make edible play dough
clean a room with your child
go through your child's clothing with them to determine what they need
spend time talking with them and see what is going on with them lives
read something to or with your child (no matter how old they are)
teach your child to do the laundry
Interesting thought here... New York is ONE state out of fifty. Jews live in a lot of other places that do NOT have the Catskills, and frankly, many people did not have the financial ability to send their children to camp, the Catskills, bungalows, or anywhere else this year, and are probably still paying off tuition from last year or years past. I do not know about any of the people outside of "holy" New York, but I kept my children home an entire summer. My wife and I could not afford camp. Right now, we cannot afford more than the bare minimum of groceries, so camp is a luxury. The concept that your children need to be entertained every second of every day by someone else is absurd! If you have them, you should be able to take care of them!
fay lamed - I think the yeshivas should start after the yomim tovim next year, and the parents should plan ahead, as you say.
Why can't all yeshivos follow the same schedule as my boy's yeshiva.... START WITHIN A DAY OR TWO OF ROSH CHODESH ELUL!!! no matter when Labor Day falls out. (Actually I thought that was what they all did until I read this topic). The English studies start on Sept. 8th. So until the 8th they come home an hour or two early and there is no transportation but hey.... there's no bitul Torah either.
The Queen of Persia-
I've been hoping you had hatzlocha finding a yeshiva that fit your son since last year's discussion.
How did your son's yeshiva situation work out?
send your children to Satmar NO bitul zman NO vacation NO chanuka vacation Reb Yoel set up the yeshiva that they finish yeshiva thursday and they go to camp on sunday they come home thursday and they start yeshiva monday so satmar is the way
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