October 18, 2009 5:51 pm at 5:51 pm #590603
I was in town recently and i noticed boys, yeshiva bochurim and grown men, wearing colored shirts. Blue and grey is one thing but i noticed pink and purple too! Shouldn’t that be assur? Isnt that Assur since those colors are really womens…therfore classifying these clothing as beged Isha? Maybe just because Im an old timer but iv’e never seen this before and am slightly confused.
because this is a highly sensitive issue involving men, perhaps we should limit this thread to men only.October 18, 2009 5:53 pm at 5:53 pm #669243havesomeseichelMember
It must be assur for men to wear purple or pink shirts as it can come to mixed dancing.October 18, 2009 5:58 pm at 5:58 pm #669244cholentkugelkishkeMember
When I was a Bochur, not so many years ago, it was quite accepted. The high school Bochurim all did, as did many Bais Medrash Bochurim. Slowly – the Yeshivishe oilam moved to only white. Now, I see a lot of elementary school boys only wering white shirts. What’s p’shat??October 18, 2009 6:01 pm at 6:01 pm #669245
that is a good point. i never thought of thatOctober 18, 2009 6:23 pm at 6:23 pm #669246israelbochurMember
no … something else is assur b/c it may come to mixed dancing (is this allowed???)
as for beged isha … as far as i am aware, that applies to the type of beged, not color
i could be mistaken though
also, why should women not be allowed a voice in this thread … if we were discussing men’s sleeve lengths i would understand, but we are not, so let the games begin i sayOctober 18, 2009 6:49 pm at 6:49 pm #669247
Does this mean black, blue and grey are mens colors and assur for women to wear? Is white gender neuteral?October 18, 2009 7:07 pm at 7:07 pm #669248Feif UnParticipant
Can boys wear red shirts? Doesn’t the chareidi world say that women can’t wear red, so that must mean it’s ok for boys, because it’s definitely not beged isha, right?October 18, 2009 8:08 pm at 8:08 pm #669249haifagirlParticipant
A friend of mine is extremely involved with a yeshiva that does not require the bochurim to wear white shirts. A friend of hers with a daughter asked about a particular bochur. She asked if he wears only white shirts. My friend replied that she wouldn’t answer the question as it wasn’t relevant. The woman asked her, “but if he doesn’t wear white shirts, how do I know he’s frum?”
I guess learning in a yeshiva is not good enough.October 18, 2009 8:31 pm at 8:31 pm #669250tzippiMember
1) Is this for real?
1a) Is it mutar for men in white shirts to surf the net?
2) It’s become accepted (not mandatory, B”H) for bar mitzvah boys, who might be in 6th grade, and up to wear white shirts. Any younger is sadistic, for the boy, mother, society.October 18, 2009 8:44 pm at 8:44 pm #669251lesschumrasParticipant
Please tell me this is a joke.October 18, 2009 8:47 pm at 8:47 pm #669252JaxMember
lesschumras: the CR is a very serious place!October 18, 2009 8:48 pm at 8:48 pm #669253
My collection of Hawaiian shirts is at risk here.October 18, 2009 9:01 pm at 9:01 pm #669254HIEParticipant
i only know of one mesivta where the bochurim aren’t required to wear white shirts.October 18, 2009 9:42 pm at 9:42 pm #669255
I know of at least half a dozen mesivtas that dont require bachurim to only wear white shirts.October 18, 2009 9:44 pm at 9:44 pm #669256havesomeseichelMember
Men can wear colored shirts just like women can wear colors besides black. Like, what is that about? men can only be a penguin and women need to look like they are always going to a funeral?October 18, 2009 9:47 pm at 9:47 pm #669257
“I guess learning in a yeshiva is not good enough.”
Of course it isnt. Whats important is…..
. The name of the yeshiva
. The color of his shirt
. That he stopped going to sleepaway camp and started in “learning camp” no later than 9 years old.October 18, 2009 10:18 pm at 10:18 pm #669258truthsharerMember
It is a very good thing color film was not readily available in Europe.October 18, 2009 10:33 pm at 10:33 pm #669259
lesschumras- u nvr knwOctober 18, 2009 11:14 pm at 11:14 pm #669260
hmmmm i hav what to think about although still slightly confusedOctober 18, 2009 11:34 pm at 11:34 pm #669261
lol ill take a shrt ronrsrOctober 18, 2009 11:50 pm at 11:50 pm #669262mybatMember
Jphone, lol!!!October 18, 2009 11:55 pm at 11:55 pm #669263
I don’t have any spare shirts, but I do have lots of very colorful silk ties from an old business venture in the basement.October 19, 2009 12:35 am at 12:35 am #669264mybatMember
Great ronsr, imagine all the yeshiva bochurs with your ties!:)October 19, 2009 12:52 am at 12:52 am #669265Josh31Participant
This new requirement that men wear only white shirts all the time is another “frum” innovation with which I can not keep up with.
Over the past 25 years I have been protesting both left wing and right wing innovations.October 19, 2009 1:00 am at 1:00 am #669266
it can only be an improvement. By the way, they are all designer label ties, so you should read that thread before agreeing to receive any ties.October 19, 2009 1:20 am at 1:20 am #669267pookieMember
common, is this what we are worried about! soon we’ll be complaining about the color of people’s ties women have thier styles and things they wear and we wear whatever color shirt we wantOctober 19, 2009 2:36 am at 2:36 am #669268JotharMember
In Slabodka they adopted “conservative elegance” as the dress mode. This meant wearing whatever nice shirts and colored suits businessmen would wear. As the yeshivish element became entranced with Chassidus, suits became black and shirts became white. While a few yeshivos resist, this is the reality now. So there is no “one-size-fits-all” answer with colored shirts. Depends on your circle.October 19, 2009 2:45 am at 2:45 am #669269October 19, 2009 2:49 am at 2:49 am #669270sammygolMember
Jothar, you hit the nail on the head. It is only because some people felt less frum than the Chasidim that they started to be black and white. I hope this won’t go on to shaved heads, for both genders, but the problem is a little deeper. It was when the learning level in Litvish yeshivos went somewhat down that they started comparing themselves to the Chasidim, because if you know that you aren’t that “frum and choshuv”, you attempt to at least look like you are. Having a self-deposited chip on the shoulder will only drag one further down, never up.October 19, 2009 3:39 am at 3:39 am #669271
If white shirts were copied from chassidim, why didnt we adopt the right over left button pattern to? Come to think of it, thats how womens shirts button.
Im beginning to thing a nice turtle neck is the way to go.white of course.October 19, 2009 3:40 am at 3:40 am #669272JotharMember
Sammygol, I heard this from my rabbeim, so I can’t take credit for it. They pointed it out that it’s a way to feel frum without undertaking serious change (middos etc).October 19, 2009 3:49 am at 3:49 am #669273
tell me were it is written in the torah what color are clothing is supposed to be, all i know is that red for a women is not the best because it atractes men, but pink or purple shirts atracting women is ridiculous.but i do agree that men should wear quieter colors not to draw atention of themselves!October 19, 2009 3:57 am at 3:57 am #669275cantoresqMember
I’ve heard it on good authority that G-d does not pay attention to the tefilois of those who defile His name by wearing colored shirts.October 19, 2009 4:01 am at 4:01 am #669276KtzoysMember
Tamazaball: But its what daas torah has decided as the right derech for bnei torah todayOctober 19, 2009 4:18 am at 4:18 am #669277
ktzoys. i agree but not every jew is made to be a bnei torah these days, so what about everyone else out there?October 19, 2009 4:28 am at 4:28 am #669278JosephParticipant
Maybe the non Bnei Torah can become Bnei Torah. 🙂October 19, 2009 4:33 am at 4:33 am #669279cherrybimParticipant
I have a nice photo of Rav Moshe TZ’L wearing a striped shirt. And Rav Ruderman wore a grey kapata and hat in warmer weather.October 19, 2009 4:39 am at 4:39 am #669280
men wearing colored shirts is no good. It can only lead to mixed dancing.October 19, 2009 4:42 am at 4:42 am #669281
joseph.maybe? and maybe the moshiach will come if every jew in the world keeps to shabboses in a row.:)October 19, 2009 4:49 am at 4:49 am #669282KtzoysMember
Joseph: we’re on the same page!October 19, 2009 5:03 am at 5:03 am #669283YW Moderator-42Moderator
I have that same photo, I actually heard that Rav Moshe ZTL’s children (R’ Reuven and R’ Dovid) used to wear PINK shirtsOctober 19, 2009 7:42 am at 7:42 am #669284onlyemesMember
Unfortunately , this thread is not a joke. It is however, a sad testament to the shallowness of thinking (sic) of certain people in the yeshiva world.October 19, 2009 10:18 am at 10:18 am #669285
im a bit confused w/ the mixd dancing bit? connection??October 19, 2009 11:08 am at 11:08 am #669286komaMember
“Where is the color of clothes written in the Torah?”
‘ksones bad kodesh yilbash” Vayikra 16:4, referred to in Talmud as ‘bigdei lavan’
Misna Negaim:11:3 “skins and clothes of colors are not subject to tuma of ngaim”
Orach Hayyim tav kuf nun tes/het: Mechaber and Mahril sham. Summarized: for a bris mila on TB the mohel the sandak and the father can wear shabbos clothes, JUST NOT THE WHITE ONES.
And to tamazball, I am a big tough looking guy, and I look great and feel pretty in a quiet pink shirt. Some folks should come to EY and enjoy the sartorial variety among the non black/white wearers.October 19, 2009 12:41 pm at 12:41 pm #669287
hey koma.how abt a pic?
…and 4 the record i myself wear colored shrts and i think they add a lot of individualism…mayb it depends HOW u wear themOctober 19, 2009 1:25 pm at 1:25 pm #669288cantoresqMember
The thing is this. When freshly laundered and pressed, white shirts looke great and make a great impression. But too many yeshiva leit don’t take the effort to achieve the effect. In which case the white shirt look. . .frumpyOctober 19, 2009 1:51 pm at 1:51 pm #669289tzippiMember
To KTzoys: I’d welcome you but see the taaruvos thread.
Who are the gedolim who have mandated this, and what exactly have they said, i.e. what are the age parameters, etc.?October 19, 2009 1:55 pm at 1:55 pm #669290cherrybimParticipant
“frumpy”, as in wrinkled and stained and one end coming up over the waste and the other end sticker out of the zipper?October 19, 2009 1:58 pm at 1:58 pm #669291truthsharerMember
One other reason I have seen floating around is that black and white were the cheapest to produce, so poor people wore black and white.October 19, 2009 2:06 pm at 2:06 pm #669292komaMember
Hey hud! this is a holy board, not chas v shalom —-book. And my pretty is for me and my spouse, some, ahem, tzinut and anonymity please. Indvidualism is an interesting topic, maybe a thread of its own. Like many ideas in Hashkofo, there are signs pointing in opposite directions. My reading of the tides sees the yeshiva world moving against individualism…
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