March 22, 2009 11:51 pm at 11:51 pm #874631proud tattyMember
i probably would moish. Took me a bit to be honest about it.
Mod, good luck once you are wearing those shoes.
What do the rest of you say?March 22, 2009 11:54 pm at 11:54 pm #874632
thats part of the nisayon of being wealthy 🙂March 22, 2009 11:56 pm at 11:56 pm #874633
i have no idea if i had grown up with that, or made it gradually (& would be used to it).
but if i just won the lottery, i think (i hope) i would keep it, save it, till i came across something i felt was worth it. or use little bits for little things for people. money doesn’t usually burn a hole in my pocket. i would hope that a bigger amount would not change me that much.March 22, 2009 11:57 pm at 11:57 pm #874634
moish, that’s a tough question. Definitely one of the greater challenges in life, for those who have oodles of money, is how to use it properly. Obviously it is a very high madreiga of avodas hashem for someone who has 10 million to burn to buy a simple house and give the rest to the needy/build public institutions. That doesn’t mean that someone who buys a 10 million house is wrong, necessarily, but it is a big test. Wealth is very challenging.
As far as not buying things because of Moshiach, I never understood the argument. If Moshiach comes tomorrow I will follow him and leave my brand new mansion behind, with no regrets. Material possessions are for the present life, and life after Moshiach comes is different. Why would buying things make me not want Moshiach? My money won’t be good after he comes, either (you can’t take it with you).
I think it comes down to using your money for your own gratification vs using it for mitzvos. If you want to enjoy the few days between your purchase and Moshiach, that in itself is not a lack of emunah.March 23, 2009 12:08 am at 12:08 am #874635YW Moderator-39Member
Moish, why do you say that Rabbis don’t have that test. The gemarra talks about the wealth that Rebbe possessed. There is also a chazal somewhere (might be in pirkei avos) that says that one has no excuses for not learning torah. if you claim poverty, Hillel will come and say he was poorer, If you claim affluence, Rebbe will come out and say he was richer. and if you claim the yetzer hara was too strong, Yosef will come to tell you his was stronger and he beat it.
There were Jews who did not want to leave Egypt during the 1st geula. They perished in the plague of choshech. There will be many similarities between that geula and the coming geula. I know many people who would rather stay wherever they are rather than join moshiach in bais shlishi, I hope they do teshuva before another “makas choshech” hits.
If you think I am being extreme, listen to Rabbi Krohn, he has said numerous times that after a shiur on Moshiach, people will come up to him and ask “Is it true we ALL need to go to Israel after Moshiach comes”March 23, 2009 12:09 am at 12:09 am #874636
AOB, where’s the bitachon?? why in the world would you save money? don’t you believe that hashem will give you whatever you need? (like that mon!)
squeak, i never said a $10 million house. i would never spend that on a house. but two million? maybe. and i’m still a good guy for giving eight to tzedaka, right?
and don’t tell me you’re one of those guys who builds a billion dollar house and says “it’s for guests. to host rabbis from israel.” give me a break! they built it for themselves and justified their own need by doing a little hachnasas orchim.March 23, 2009 12:12 am at 12:12 am #874637proud tattyMember
and don’t tell me you’re one of those guys who builds a billion dollar house and says “it’s for guests. to host rabbis from israel.” give me a break! they built it for themselves and justified their own need by doing a little hachnasas orchim.
Well said.March 23, 2009 12:13 am at 12:13 am #874638
39, i meant rabbis and kollel people in this generation who don’t have too much cash to blow.
by the way, when ezra was taking the jews back to build the second bais hamikdosh they didn’t all come. if they would have it would have been the final geula. so i guess i believe the same thing will happen.
and i know that when rebbe was dying he held up his ten hands and said he never got hano’ah from olam hazeh. not talking about that.March 23, 2009 12:16 am at 12:16 am #874640
moish, 10 million, 2 million, what’s the difference? The point is that there is a line to draw and it is very hard to know where to draw it. I have my own challenges, but I am grateful that is not one of them.March 23, 2009 12:17 am at 12:17 am #874641
moish01: i meant i would keep it for a few days, weeks, whatever, till i decided what to do with it, and i wouldn’t just spend it on the first thing i thought of (i don’t think).March 23, 2009 12:25 am at 12:25 am #874642
squeak, you don’t think the guy who spends only two is an awesome guy? look at the self control he has!March 23, 2009 12:27 am at 12:27 am #874643
you could say that, or you could say what does he need 2 million house for? But it’s not for ME to say one way or the other.March 23, 2009 12:33 am at 12:33 am #874644
well, i don’t know. i never had money to spare and a family to provide for.March 23, 2009 1:36 am at 1:36 am #874646tzippiMember
About rich people in poor people’s houses: there’s a famous story of someone who went collecting and found a rich man eating his lunch of black bread and herring. He gave the rich man what for, told him that when a poor man comes and says he hasn’t eaten in a few days, you give him some crusts. But if you would eat the way a rich man should, on fine meats, then when that poor man comes you will give him a decent meal.
Let’s fargin the rich. For their own sakes, they should live below their means a bit, maybe a house that’s more pashut on the outside, buying something just below what they could afford, etc. But hey, that’s still way above my paygrade.March 23, 2009 2:03 am at 2:03 am #874647
ames, i’m as poor as they get. all i have is bar mitzva money in the bank.
plus my dad whenever i need him.March 23, 2009 2:12 am at 2:12 am #874649
oh, poor ames. then why did you offer to shop for me? were you hoping to turn to my dad too??March 23, 2009 5:03 am at 5:03 am #874650
thanks, but no thanks! i’m perfectly alright without your chessed.March 23, 2009 10:11 pm at 10:11 pm #874652
on a bit of a different note it bothers me when I see a post that was updated very quickly like 30 seconds and I see it 20 minutes later and I think, what did I accomplish in those 20 minutes? nothing… :/March 24, 2009 7:41 am at 7:41 am #874653
ames: wow nice goin there!!! i’m still waitin for someone to tell us how many perakim of tehillim they say in between slow updating time!!! you know like the Chofetz Chaim used to know the distance between 2 cities, from how many perakim of tehillim he said while traveling!!!March 24, 2009 6:56 pm at 6:56 pm #874654YW Moderator-39Member
How does the line go?
Tell a man that there are billions of stars in the sky and the universe would take billion of light years to travel and he’ll believe you.
Tell him the bench has wet paint and he’ll need to touch it to make sure.March 24, 2009 7:10 pm at 7:10 pm #874655
ames- your last 3 deep thoughts had me nodding… nodding… nodding. Thanks for making us stop and thinkMarch 24, 2009 7:35 pm at 7:35 pm #874656
ames, when you consider that Deep Thought did not utter a sound for 7.5 million years, you should realize that lack of responses indicate you are being taken seriously.March 24, 2009 7:41 pm at 7:41 pm #874657
deep, very deep… excellentMarch 24, 2009 7:44 pm at 7:44 pm #874658
squeak, you know how many times i had to read that sentence to make sense of it? i lost count, actually.March 24, 2009 8:10 pm at 8:10 pm #874660
huh ames?March 24, 2009 8:20 pm at 8:20 pm #874662
is that the next deep thought? should’ve saved it for tomorrow 😉March 24, 2009 10:26 pm at 10:26 pm #874663
am I allowed to add another deep thought? or is it restricted to 1 per day? 🙂March 24, 2009 10:42 pm at 10:42 pm #874664
since when do you ask the rules for anything?March 24, 2009 10:45 pm at 10:45 pm #874665
😛 I resent that comment, I’m a very good queen 🙂March 24, 2009 10:49 pm at 10:49 pm #874667
just wondering (this is a question i have now for a while) who or what exactly are you the queen of??March 24, 2009 10:50 pm at 10:50 pm #874668aussieboyParticipant
kapusta: people in high positions never follow the laws the put in place.March 24, 2009 10:52 pm at 10:52 pm #874669
to follow in your line of thinking, since when do you wait to make a comment ? 😉 I’m the CR queen but I guess that became official before your time 🙂March 24, 2009 11:11 pm at 11:11 pm #874670
thats why I’m a GOOD queen, in fact I’m probably the best you’ll find around here… (sure hope you wont head over to the land of our good noitallmr) 🙂March 25, 2009 2:40 am at 2:40 am #874675JewessMember
Love this thread.
I thought a thought, but the thought I thought wasn’t the thought I thought I thought.March 25, 2009 3:07 am at 3:07 am #874676
that gave me a headache 😉March 25, 2009 3:22 am at 3:22 am #874677aussieboyParticipant
Jewess: haha 🙂
My deep thought is: Does a deep thought need to be thougt long or does it just need to be a very deep thought, by bieng full of meaning?March 25, 2009 3:32 am at 3:32 am #874678
if you can think it through that quickly, feel free, but usually the deeper it is the longer it takes to understand (relatively speaking).March 25, 2009 4:11 am at 4:11 am #874679
not always, sometimes deep things just come in a flash. (those generally leave in a flash just the same)March 25, 2009 5:46 am at 5:46 am #874680
this is more like a deep random question but why do we place people on higher or lower levels than us in status? this came up recently and it really bothered me that I consider certain people “lower” than me. anyone know how to improve? 🙂March 25, 2009 5:53 am at 5:53 am #874681
ames: i wish i learned more during the slow update times!!!March 25, 2009 7:58 am at 7:58 am #874682
ames: those thought really got me thinking-even at this insane hour(it’s almost 4am!!!)
here’s a deep thought that’s been on my mind, since recently going to a levaya:
i keep thinking, of what hespadim at my levaya would be like!!! what would people say about me?? did i do anything great that people would have to say about me?? chossodim i did?? mitzvos that i did?? was i the best jew i could have been?? would they remember the good things i did in my life?? or would they just go on & on about how great my family is as a whole??
then all i start thinking of is all the time i wasted, when i really could have been a better eved Hashem!!!
ok i’m done rambling here for now!!! i’ll go find my bed!!!March 25, 2009 11:51 am at 11:51 am #874683
when anyone dies, everybody can find such good things to say about them. always! it’s too bad that sometimes we can completely overlook a person’s good qualities & think they are lower than us when they are alive & in front of us. take the time to try & find someone’s talents/strengths – if they had died you would not have any trouble, so there must be something about them, even if it’s not so apparent at the time.March 25, 2009 1:52 pm at 1:52 pm #874684anonymisssParticipant
kapusta, “Never look down on anybody, unless you’re helping him up.” I saw this quote recently and decided that I completelly disagree with it. Just because I might be in a position to help someone does not mean I’m better. I once hear that sometimes Hashem makes people needy because there’s someone else, who He made more able because he needs to give. For example, Hashem will make one person poor because there’s another man who needs the zchus of giving tzedaka. If the rich man doesn’t give the tzedaka, he will be responsible for causing a Jew to suffer unnecessarily. So being in a position of giving/helping does not at all mean that we’re better.
AOB, isn’t it sad that it takes death for us to be able to find nice things to say about a person?
~a~March 25, 2009 5:31 pm at 5:31 pm #874685
anonymisss, I think you slightly misunderstood the quote. The first half is metaphorical, the latter half is literal. It means never look down on someone. The only time to look down on someone is when he is on the floor and you are leaning over to give him a hand up. It does not mean that you should consider him lower than you while you are helping him. Capish? 😉
Jax, ames, I once read a short story about someone who was obsessed over what his obituary would read. But isn’t that aiming for the wrong target? Why do you focus on what people will think of you – it is only important what Hashem will think of you. If you are right in His eyes, then you can be sure that He will make things right for you. Just like Yossele the holy miser 😉March 25, 2009 6:16 pm at 6:16 pm #874686
i believe you misunderstood the quote
i believe it means:
never look down on anyone, period.
now if you are helping someone UP, then you are figuratively looking down on them only in the sense that they are DOWN (meaning: “down”, needing lifting, not “down” as in “inferior”)March 25, 2009 6:42 pm at 6:42 pm #874687
squeak, im adding not disagreeing
Rabbi Avigdor Miller, tz’l, said, as a “general rule”: when people in general think highly of a person, then HaKodeshBoruchHu most likely does also.
(obviously this wouldnt apply to a rasha successfully masquerading as a Tzaddik as well as other possible scenarios)
thats not to say that to concentrate on what others think of you is a good mahalach, rather that one who makes himself elevated in the eyes of HaKodeshBaruchHu, will automatically become elevated in the eyes of people. rather pashut actually.
and of course another meaning (also pashut) is that one who strives to do kindnesses to his brothers(l’shaim shamayimim, or even out of innate empathy)will become elevated in the eyes of Hashem, as well as in the eyes of the community.March 25, 2009 7:49 pm at 7:49 pm #874688
AOB, Jax, ames- fact of life: acharei moss kedoshimMarch 25, 2009 7:58 pm at 7:58 pm #874689
feivel, you are right, and before R’ Miller said it, it was a maamer Chazal: “Kol sheruach habrios nocheh heimenu…..”March 25, 2009 8:10 pm at 8:10 pm #874690anon for thisParticipant
feivel, squeak, that’s true to some extent but not universally so. Moshe Rabbeinu, the ultimate leader & greatest navi, had to deal with those who attempted to rebel against him. When the mishkan was finished, he accounted for all of the gold used in its construction. At first there was some gold which was not accounted for, until he realized that this was the gold used to make the hooks for the amudim. At this point, the medrash concludes, bnai yisrael were satisfied–implying that until then some suspected that c”v Moshe had skimmed off the donations to the mishkan to enrich himself. This may be due to the human tendency to want to “take others down a peg”; the greater & more distinguished the leader, the greater the desire to take him/ her down.
That’s why in bircas hamazon we ask that we find favor in the eyes of both Hashem & other people. The latter doesn’t necessarily follow from the former, so we daven for both.March 25, 2009 8:31 pm at 8:31 pm #874691
Rabbi Avigdor Miller, tz’l, said, as a “general rule”
(obviously this wouldnt apply to……….as well as other possible scenarios)
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