December 5, 2010 4:33 pm at 4:33 pm #593326bombmaniacParticipant
one of the goyim who works at my house warmed up some of his food in my microwave…so how do i kasher i?December 6, 2010 1:50 am at 1:50 am #716396Ashrecha YisroelParticipant
Like everything in judiasm: Machlokes.
Some say it’s impossible, others say it’s easy…December 6, 2010 3:49 am at 3:49 am #716398arcParticipant
bomb ask your local posek. want to know why? because frum jews trust their poskim not anonymous people in caps.December 6, 2010 4:12 am at 4:12 am #716399AinOhdMilvadoParticipant
Of course I am NOT paskening here, and you must ask your rov.
What I have been told however, is that you need only to clean it out well, and then boil a cup of water inside it.
Once the water has boiled, the microwave is kasher.December 6, 2010 4:33 am at 4:33 am #716400dunnoMember
I got the same psak as AinOhdMilvado.December 6, 2010 4:57 am at 4:57 am #716401so rightMember
I was given a psak I can use a treif microwave by double wrapping the food.December 6, 2010 5:23 am at 5:23 am #716402oomisParticipant
AOM and dunno both gave the same p’sak I got, but I was told to microwave the water for ten minutes, so the steam covers every part of the microwave, and then to move the cup over, so the spot that had been directly under it also gets kashered. Then throw the cup away. A big styrofoam cup is good for this.December 6, 2010 5:26 am at 5:26 am #7164032morecentsParticipant
wait at least 24 hours after cleaning it out before the 5-10 minutes of microwaving the cup of water.December 6, 2010 5:38 am at 5:38 am #716404mexipalParticipant
ask your rav or mashgiach they’ll know. better than heter shopping online. try heterbay they have good deals on heterimDecember 6, 2010 6:47 am at 6:47 am #716405smartcookieMember
I know someone with this same exact situation.
They were told a microwave CANNOT be Kashered.
A new one isn’t too expensive so please go do the right thing!
Realize how lucky you are that you found out about that Goy warming the food. You couldve never known and just continued using the microwave as is Chas Vsholom.
And of course, ask your Rav.December 6, 2010 12:14 pm at 12:14 pm #716406Ashrecha YisroelParticipant
Thank you all for proving me right.December 6, 2010 2:02 pm at 2:02 pm #716407jewish and working 22Member
From the ou website:
How is a microwave oven kashered to change the dairy or meat status, or to kasher from non-kosher use? A microwave can be kashered by placing a bowl of water in the oven. The oven is filled with steam by operating the microwave at the highest setting for approximately ten minutes. The bowl is refilled and moved to anotherlocation, and the above procedure is repeated in order to kasher the area where the bowl previously rested. If there is a glass plate on the oven floor, it is preferable to cover or change the plate since it is questionable how the halacha views glass. If the oven surface is plastic there are different opinions whether kashering is effective, but in case of necessity many poskim follow the lenient view. Kashering between meat and dairy can be done immediately after the previous use, while kashering a non-kosher oven requires a 24-hour downtime. In all instances, kashering must be preceded by a thorough cleanup. As is true of a conventional oven, kashering can be bypassed (even for a non-kosher microwave) by double wrapping the food.”December 6, 2010 2:17 pm at 2:17 pm #716408charliehallParticipant
“I got the same psak as AinOhdMilvado. “
So did I.December 6, 2010 2:44 pm at 2:44 pm #716409yitayningwutParticipant
As was mentioned, there are many opinions, and you should ask your rav.
An opinion not mentioned here is that a microwave does not need to be kashered, and can be used for both milchigs and fleishigs as long as the surface is clean. This is the opinion of my rav, and is also the psak of R’ Berger, the posek of NIRC.December 6, 2010 7:57 pm at 7:57 pm #716410
according to most poskim, the solution mentioned by charliehall,ainodmilvado and others is the right one. I have no idea what “frumladygit’ is talking about. As a matter of fact, the psak may even be closer to “iitayningwut”, because the food in the micro wave is only emitting “reiach”, which makes it much easier. I kind of am suspicious of this because i have had matter splattered over the walls, especially if the receptable was not covered.December 6, 2010 11:40 pm at 11:40 pm #716411
While the methods mentioned may be satisfactory to kasher the bliyos of zeias issur, there is a serious practical problem (maybe what frumladygit meant) that particles of food can be trapped in difficult to reach places or even inside the vent and fan. No form of hagala can kasher mamashus issur.December 6, 2010 11:49 pm at 11:49 pm #716412ItcheSrulikMember
Which is why you must clean the microwave thoroughly first. I was once told by a rav that I should be machmir if possible.December 6, 2010 11:54 pm at 11:54 pm #716413YW Moderator-80Member
you ask a good kasha
nevertheless there are many poskim who matir kashering a microwave
how they deal with your problem , youd have to ask a posek i imagineDecember 7, 2010 12:20 am at 12:20 am #716414ItcheSrulikMember
I repeat, by cleaning the microwave thoroughly, so there is no mamashus.December 7, 2010 12:21 am at 12:21 am #716415yitayningwutParticipant
Regarding splatters; that’s why I said one should check if the surface is clean. Also, my rav says as an eitza tova to cover the food with a napkin or plate to prevent splatters, just in case the next person won’t check if it’s clean. But that’s just an eitza tova, it isn’t required. Regarding bli’os from the splatters, I’m speculating because I do not know the sugya well enough, though I’m not a complete am ha’aretz in the area; before saying it is a problem one must consider that in normal microwaves the walls do not reach yad soledes bo, and therefore the splatter which is the il’a’ah cannot be bole’a completely into the walls which are the tata’ah, (according to the Rashba brought by the B”Y that the stationary thing is always the tata’ah). As for kedei klipah, well, being that the walls don’t get hot enough and they don’t touch the food which could possibly make them hot kedei klipah, they can never be poleit the issur. This also takes care of “hello99″‘s problem. I know this is all a bit technical, but I’m sure as a rabbi you know what I’m talking about.December 7, 2010 2:11 am at 2:11 am #716418
yitayningwut- thanks for your thougtful reply. your rov is absolutely right- to cover the food. As a matter of precaution, I always cover the food to be “microwaved”, so there is no splatter. you are also correct in saying that the walls of the microwave never attain “jad soledes bo” (try it and you will see) because the mechanics of the microwave is different than cooking. from what was told to me, it “shakes’ the molecules and in this way heats it. because they are “micro” waves they don’t touch mroe than the food and the rest of the “oven” remains fairly cool. the utensil in which the food is stored does get hot- so clearly you cannot use the same pot because it would be ‘bolea’. the actual oven, however, is not hot enough.
as far as the “zeia’ this is a tough sugya and-for whatever reason- R’moshe was machmir on this, especially in a regular oven. I never understood this psak because the shulchan aruch clearly does nto consider ‘reiach’ ossur, and the aspect of ‘zeiah’ is not mentioned in that sugya. i’d like to hear from R’moshe’s talmidim where he found the idea of ‘zeiah’ in an oven.December 7, 2010 2:26 am at 2:26 am #716419A Woman Outside BrooklynParticipant
What Frumladygit might be thinking of is kashering a microwave for Pesach, not for general usage. Because we are much stricter about even a minute amount of chometz, many Poseks hold that the microwave you use during the year cannot be thoroughly cleaned for Pesach because there might be chometz in the parts she spoke about. However, this is not applicable during the year.December 7, 2010 4:17 am at 4:17 am #716421A Woman Outside BrooklynParticipant
But by virtue of the fact, Frumlady, that those parts become the hottest, aren’t they virtually self-cleaning, like a regular oven? That’s the whole principal behind self-cleaning, raising it to an enormously high heat till things literally burn off. Many Rabbonim are very familiar with the mechanics of all appliciances – they have to be in order to answer the questions we bring to them. CR is fine for shooting the breeze on these issues, but anyone who relys on anything they read here about kashrus or otherwise is really in need of some serious guidance.December 7, 2010 1:53 pm at 1:53 pm #716422
frumlady-sorry to disappoint you but the microwave ovens do NOT operate on the principle that you think. They do NOT “trasmit the highest temperatures’ as you intimate. If that would be correct- you could not even TOUCH the microwave-just like you cannot touch a red hot regular oven- and this is obviously incorrect because the actual microwave oven and its walls remain very cool to the touch. As i explained, there is a very different principle of physics involved here and this is why it is very possibly to use the oven for multiple uses.December 7, 2010 11:15 pm at 11:15 pm #716423
ItcheSrulik: cleaning thoroughly will not help for particles trapped inside the vent and fan , unless you completely disassemble your microwave.December 7, 2010 11:19 pm at 11:19 pm #716424
yitayningwut: nice, but. First of all we do not pasken the Rashba. Secondly, since the waves are constantly heating the particles in transit, it is constantly on the fire and tata’ah gavar does not apply. Additionally, if heating very moist items, the walls of the microwave can get very hot. Finally, you have NOT solved my problem that the water vapors can contact mamashus in the vent and return to the food.December 7, 2010 11:23 pm at 11:23 pm #716425
ROB: zeia is mentioned in siman 92. While practically the dry heat of a conventional oven will not produce zeia only reicha, as you mentioned, the nature of a microwave is to excite specifically the water molecules and create a very significant cloud of steam. This is certainly zeia with all the resultant Halachos that will be difficult to overcome.December 8, 2010 11:38 pm at 11:38 pm #716426
hello99- thanks for your note. Indeed, in siman Tzadik- bais (92), ‘zeiah” (sweat or more accurately, vapor) is mentioned but- if my memory serves me right- it is in the context of an actual pot and a boiling pot at that, where you obviously see the vapor rise and hence it is considered “mamashos” – something real and solid.
I was talking about R’Moshe’s teshuvos where he maintains that in a regualr oven, there is also ‘zeiah’ from the walls, and it traspires from the walls, thereby making it improper to use the same oven for milchig and fleishig, for example.
ovens are heated and produce dry heat- and if the actual pot is covered, i don’t see how you can say that there is “zeiah”. i juts never understood that teshuvo- especially if you contrast it to the shulchan aruch and the halochos of ovens.(see joreh deah 108)December 9, 2010 4:35 am at 4:35 am #716427
ROB: If you are referring to Igros Moshe YD 1:40 you will see that Rav Moshe himself was quite skeptical if zeia exists in a conventional oven. However in a microwave zeia certainly IS an issue.December 12, 2010 11:29 pm at 11:29 pm #716428
anyone there?December 12, 2010 11:39 pm at 11:39 pm #716429WolfishMusingsParticipant
I’m here. But I don’t know enough about the subject to give you any answers. Sorry. 🙁
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