Rav Moshe Feinstein-Chalav Stam Story

Home Forums Bais Medrash Rav Moshe Feinstein-Chalav Stam Story

Viewing 50 posts - 1 through 50 (of 194 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #615381

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    There is this famous story about Rav Moshe tz”l inducing vomiting when he accidentally drank Chalav Stam. I would like to see if anybody has a source for this story. Some people say this story is false.

    #1149199

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    And some say that Rav Moshe tz”l did not do things like that.

    #1149200

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    I heard from R” Nota Greenblatt that in Memphis R’ Moshe drank cholov stam “and at least in the next 6 hours or so didnt throw up, ich veis nisht vos hut geshen nuch dem”

    #1149201

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    I heard third hand that it happened.

    And now you heard it fourth hand from an anonymous source on the internet.

    #1149202

    Chortkov
    Participant

    Don’t believe everything you read on the internet.

    –Abraham Lincoln

    #1149203

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    I want to see if anybody has a source for it.

    #1149204

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    I do, but it’s not a written source.

    #1149205

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    I was there, and it wasn’t just any cholov stam. It was actually a famous cholov yisroel brand that insiders know is a sham. Witnesses I know have seen them slipping in milk from noncholov yisroel cows.

    #1149206

    Joseph
    Participant

    What kind of “source” are you looking for? Something in the Igros Moshe recounting the maaisa?

    #1149207

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    Anybody close with Rav Dovid Feinstein shlit”a?

    #1149208

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    Like a known talmud of his or close family member.

    #1149209

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    How about someone who witnessed it?

    #1149210

    mik5
    Participant

    This story is true.

    Do a Google search or, better yet, ask Rav Belsky shlit”a.

    #1149211

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    Jewish Thinker

    My family is. Ive asked him before he said he doubted it was true.

    #1149212

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    I would like to know details, when it happened and where.

    #1149213

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    Jewish Thinker

    It was about 5-6 years ago on Purim, in his apartment

    #1149214

    golfer
    Participant

    Only in the coffeeroom can you find a Yekke who makes jokes that can actually make a person laugh.

    #1149215

    screwdriverdelight
    Participant

    start with the obvious.

    (A) There’s no reason to vomit after drinking cholov stam. (B) R’ Moshe Feinstein was renowned for his genius and didn’t do stupid things. (A+B=C) R’ Moshe didn’t vomit after drinking cholov stam milk.

    #1149216

    Joseph
    Participant

    Who said the vomiting was voluntary? The idea that he mistakenly consumed non-CY may have been revolting to him.

    #1149217

    Sam2
    Participant

    If true, the story says a heck of a lot more about Chalav HaCompanies being muttar than Assur.

    #1149218

    Toi
    Participant

    i have a hard time believing he threw it up. R moshe himself writes in a teshuva that whiskey blenders could be problematic so he refrains from drinking whiskey with a blender inside when not in public. cholov stam is lichoirah less problematic.

    #1149219

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    I also find it pretty hard to believe Rav Moshe tz”l actually induced the vomiting. But it could be as Joseph said that it was so revolting he just threw up.

    The people here who claim the story is true, can you please say where it happened and when?

    #1149220

    screwdriverdelight
    Participant

    No the story is that he induced vomiting–it could be that the milk was curdled and then his doctor told him curdled milk isn’t healthy so he made himself regurgitate.

    #1149221

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Sam, I’m not sure why, but anyhow, we don’t need a story to say it’s muttar; we have his teshuvos.

    Toi, your “lichoira” is lichoira wrong. He writes that he drank blended whiskey in public, but didn’t say that about c”s.

    #1149222

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    Sam2-Do you mind explaining yourself?

    #1149223

    hockonarock
    Member

    stop paskening based on gedolim stories, the notion that you can do that is utterly ridiculous

    #1149224

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Hockonarock, you spelled udderly wrong.

    #1149225

    Jewish Thinker:

    I would like to know details, when it happened and where.

    ubiquitin:

    It was about 5-6 years ago on Purim, in his apartment

    🙂

    #1149226

    Sam2:

    If true, the story says a heck of a lot more about Chalav HaCompanies being muttar than Assur.

    Jewish Thinker:

    Sam2-Do you mind explaining yourself?

    Second the motion.

    #1149228

    Toi:

    R’ Moshe himself writes in a teshuva that whiskey blenders could be problematic so he refrains from drinking whiskey with a blender inside when not in public. cholov stam is lichoirah less problematic.

    DaasYochid:

    Toi, your “lichoira” is lichoira wrong. He writes that he drank

    blended whiskey in public, but didn’t say that about c”s.

    Why should he have to, DaasYochid? He wrote to be mattir it,

    not that he thought it might be a problem.

    #1149229

    DaasYochid, why would he write that about cholov stam?

    #1149231

    Bookworm120
    Participant

    Ditto, yekke2.

    #1149232

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    What, that he kept it? Because he was encouraging people to keep it if they could.

    #1149233

    showjoe
    Participant

    “start with the obvious.

    (A) There’s no reason to vomit after drinking cholov stam. (B) R’ Moshe Feinstein was renowned for his genius and didn’t do stupid things. (A+B=C) R’ Moshe didn’t vomit after drinking cholov stam milk. “

    just saying that there is a spiritual effect that eating not kosher has on a person. im not saying that C”S is non-kosher, just that it might be comparable to one whos does not eat C”S.

    i cant remember the source for my original statement, so i understand if you don’t hold by it, but it definitely came from a vaild source.

    #1149234

    catch yourself
    Participant

    If I may be so bold as to say ??? in Sam2…

    ???? ?????? ?????

    It is inconceivable that ???”? would allow ????”? ??”? to eat something which is not absolutely ???.

    ??? ?????.

    #1149235

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Catch yourself, what’s the chiddush if he drank it by mistake? He held it was muttar. Unless when you say “absolutely ???” you mean with no reason whatsoever to be machmir, but that’s k’neged what he wrote in a number of teshuvos.

    #1149236

    Catch Yourself (al pi Sam2),

    in that case, I suppose that goes for the whiskey as well?

    #1149237

    i hate loshon hora
    Participant

    actually they say a story that rav Moshe was somewhere and he picked up a bottle of milk and put it down so someone asked him why he didnt drink it and he said that the bottle was empty!

    #1149238

    catch yourself
    Participant

    @ DY – No chiddushim, just explaining Sam2 (??? ????? ?????). I think Sam2 was not proving that ?? ??? held it is muttar; this hardly needs to be proven. My takeaway from his post was that this story, like so many others, is used by many people to prove a point, when in fact the story undermines that very point.

    @ Comlink-X – Yes, I suppose it would. Any ???? ??????.

    #1149239

    Could I have heard that story about orange juice rather than milk?

    #1149240

    i hate loshon hora
    Participant

    catch yourself

    maybe catch yourself before talking like that about one of the greatest gidolim!

    #1149241

    catch yourself
    Participant

    @IHLH – no doubt (and so it is said) an ugly rumor started that Rav Moshe does not hold of company X…completely ignoring that he picked up the bottle in the first place!

    In a similar vein, I heard from Rav Aharon Felder zt”l, arguably Rav Moshe’s closest talmid (perhaps after Rav Bluth), who was present when this occurred:

    Rav Moshe was known to be super makpid about his matzos. At a bris once on chol hamoed Pesach, the young Rav Reuven approached his father during the seudas mitzvah and said quietly (in Yiddish, of course), “these are not our matzos,” to which Rav Moshe replied, “if I don’t eat, people will say that it’s chometz!”

    #1149242

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    My takeaway from his post was that this story, like so many others, is used by many people to prove a point, when in fact the story undermines that very point.

    What point do you think people try to make from the story and how does the story actually undermine this point?

    #1149243

    catch yourself
    Participant

    DY – The people who have told me this story have always used it to show that Rav Moshe “really held” that chalav stam is assur. The story refutes this because if that were true, it would have been impossible for him to drink it even by mistake because ??? ???”? ???? ???? ???.

    That said, I think the real moral of the story (if it is true) is about the incredible sensitivity he had to something which he held should not be consumed by a baal nefesh, as per Joseph (Lior), et al.

    IHLH – I’m not sure what you thought I meant. Chas V’Shalom, I did not intend anything other than the greatest respect for Rav Moshe. Let me be clear. My point was that since Rav Moshe is obviously included in “??????”, it is inconceivable that he would have consumed something that was not kosher according to his own opinion.

    #1149244

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    If you want to refute people who think Rav Moshe held it was assur, just show them the teshuvos. They’re a much better raya than a diyuk from a story.

    #1149245

    Sam2
    Participant

    Hashta Behemtan…

    #1149246

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Someone asked R’ Dovid shlit”a how could he asser NYC water – his father drank it! He answered, “If he knew there were bugs in it, he wouldn’t have drunk it”.

    #1149247

    catch yourself
    Participant

    Sam2 – ???? ???????

    DY – Agreed. The only reason to discuss the story is the irony.

    #1149248

    Jewish Thinker
    Participant

    So far nobody has given me a source for this story. (Someone mentioned Rav Belsky shlit”a but please tell me when it happened and where.

    Only in the coffeeroom can you find a Yekke who makes jokes that can actually make a person laugh.

    There are a lot of Yekkes with a good sense of humor.

    #1149249

    Rav Moshe’s grandson told me the story never happened and is not true.

Viewing 50 posts - 1 through 50 (of 194 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.


Trending