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How can someone do teshuva for murder?
The same way one does teshuva for avodah zora or mishkav zochor.
Or turning on a light on shabos.
TheChevra, just on the slight chance this question is not posted for purely academic reasons, if you have any information regarding the commission of a crime by you or anyone else, posting it on the internet is extremely ill-advised.
There’s a reason police tell you, “You have the right to remain silent.”
The Rambam says you can do Teshuvah on anything however If a Chillul Hashem is involved it will require Missah to be completely mechaper.
However the Rambam and Shaarei Teshuva as well as other sources (I believe its a Gemara) That if one sins and says Echta Veashuv – I will do Teshuvah afterwards his Teshuvah is not accepted.
Your question wasnt can someone do Teshuvah on murder but “how can someone.” As though it happened…Im trying very hard not to read too much into this…
Either way if you want to know how to do Teshuvah on such an Aveira you should learn through the Rambams Hilchos Teshuvah which isnt too long and the sefer Shaarei Teshuvah by Rabbeinu Yonah.
Homeowner, did you hear about the guy who got a speeding ticket? He placed a video of himself speeding on the internet. And the police ticketed him! I am not making this up! It was on a news site (I think YW)
Does retzicha only include intentional murder? My very frum, extremely nice neighbor accidentally hit someone while driving and killed him. Maybe something similar happened to TheChevra.
see sharei teshuva end of hilchos teshuva on teshuva on retzicha [i’m almost sure its there] thre is also a teshuva in noda biyehuda on the issue. details are not fit for this forum or anyother blog
Please distinguish between teshuva and kapara. Kapara is what is required to restore the Torah-governed balance of things that was upset by a wrong act (kapara, from kaf, kipa – to cover over something). To get a kapara for killing someone may be extremely difficult and depending on the circumstances, the kapara may not occur until the killer himself dies.
Teshuva is a different story. The killer can better himself and remedy his own personal misconduct by regretting his wrong act, resolving to abstain from it in the future, and actually mending his ways when a similar situation presents itself in the future.
Retzicha is not just “any” aveirah. You can’t just read a sefer and say ok i’m doing teshuvah. I suggest to go to not just a local orthodox rabbi but rather to an accepted godol such as a rosh yeshiva, mashgiach, chasidish rebbe. and go to the top in each category. Like Rav Moshe Wolfson or Rav Matisyahu Solomon. However if you’re just interested as an intellectual exercise, then you can see what various seforim say about it.
Does retzicha only include intentional murder?
Retzicha refers strictly to unlawful murder. Putting someone to death is harigah, not retzicha.
If it was purely an accident, then I’d say no — he is a “horeg” but not a “rotzeach.” If he was a shogeg (i.e. at least partially negligent), then I’d say yes (the Torah uses the term for someone who must flee to one of the Arei Miklat).
The Wolf
if done on purpose, there is no mechilla, kapara, or coming out of gehenim
chesedname:
The Rambam says you can do Teshuvah on anything.
Kayin did teshuva.
The Rambam says you can do Teshuvah on anything.
Does the Rambam address Acher?
The Wolf
if done on purpose, there is no mechilla, kapara, or coming out of gehenim
I’d like to know your source on that.
The Wolf
i dont know about the Rambam but Rabbi Miller, tz’l, said acher absolutely could do Tshuva, only he would not be aided in this. the bas kol was a test just like the Nevuah to Yecheschiel that he would shortly die and Tshuvah wouldnt help
d a (I see why you use lower case letters as they surely do not stand for “district attorney.”)
No, I didn’t hear that story nor would I care. A ticket in New York requires the officer to personally observe the commission of the offense charged.
Personally, I think this thread is a big put-on.
Homeowner, good point!
d a – you are hereby charged with changing your screen name to something that does not imply you are a district attorney! This is a very serious offense. Take this friendly advice or you get in trouble.
but Rabbi Miller, tz’l, said acher absolutely could do Tshuva, only he would not be aided in this. the bas kol was a test
Did Acher know it was a test? If HKBH told you something, would you not take Him at face value? Avraham Avinu did — to the point where he was ready to slaughter his son.
The Wolf
A better question is, how to do teshuva for all the lashon hara, read and written on YWN.
d a:
the d stands for EDITED and the a stands for EDITED
i dont know wolf
why dont you study the sugya wolf and learn what the meforshim say or ask a Talmid Chchom to explain to answer your speculations. i am not a Talmid Chochom.
if Rabbi Miller, tz’l said it was a test it was a test. he didnt make things up out of thin air. why dont you think about it and see if you can come up with a possible explanation
R’ Meir obviously disagreed with Acher because he never gave up trying to be (for lack of a better word) mekarev him.
chesedname
FALSE! FALSE! FALSE! – There is absolutely NO aveirah in the world that one cannot do teshuva on! Ask any competant Rov, (or any Breslover chosid as they are all well versed in this topic.)
he didnt make things up out of thin air.
I never said he did. Please don’t imply that that is what I meant.
The Wolf
There is absolutely NO aveirah in the world that one cannot do teshuva on!
Well, there is the sin of my being alive. 🙁
The Wolf
Wolf
Rabbi Shafier from the Shmuz discusses it in his Hilchoos Teshuvah boot camp 3 shiur series. Worth a listen!
R Shmuel
not true murder, aishesh ish, etc
there are a small amount where u stay in gehenim
chesedname,
What is your source for your assertion?
not true murder, aishesh ish, etc
there are a small amount where u stay in gehenim
Still waiting to see a source (and, since you’re stating there’s more than one) a list of which sins are covered.
The Wolf
chesedname
What you are saying is WRONG. Even on the most chomer aveiros including murder, eishes ish, etc. one can do complete teshuva.
Many people somehow have a wrong hashkafa on this matter.
Wolf
I am not sure what you mean – please explain
i’m aware of teh rambam, this wouldn’t be the first time i saw a machlakos.
see
gemarah rosh hashanah 17a
sanhedrin 99a
bava metzia 58b
shaarei teshuvah, whole chapter, title is , the sins that ppl won’t come out of gehenim
chofetz chaim chovat hashemirah on ribis where he says they won’t have techias hamesim.
What you are saying is WRONG. Even on the most chomer aveiros including murder, eishes ish, etc. one can do complete teshuva.
Many people somehow have a wrong hashkafa on this matter.
Incorrect. Once you brought a Mamzer into the world thres no undoing that. Although there may be some way to do Teshuvah Im not sure theres a 100% Teshuvah for making a Mamzer.
I am not sure what you mean – please explain
I mean that if chesedname is going to make such an assertion, I would like to know the source and the complete list of sins for which there is no teshuva.
The Wolf
R Shmuel, how does one do teshuva for Chilul Hashem? I ask because although one could theoretically ask the Almighty for mechila, many hold that this is also a sin against the entire B’nai Yisroel since all are harmed. How could one ask mechila from the entire B’nai Yisroel?
chesedname: Those sources are talking if the person didn’t do teshuva; not if they did.
The same way one would go about asking for mechila from “modern orthodox jews” or “everyone in lakewood” or other large groups of people frequently disparaged on YWN.
Teshuva for murder is completed only with the death of the posheya. Murder and killing someone are not necessarily the same thing.
There is teshuva and there is a kappara. A person does teshuva, hashem provides the kappara.
kol hamalbin es pnei chaveiro b’rabim ki’eeloo horgo. i was once so humiliated i actually felt the color draining from my face.
Anyone can do teshuva for any aveira. Even Levi Aron can do teshuva. There is no such thing as an aveira you can’t do teshuva for.
How do you know if someone did teshuva for a public aveira?
“Even Levi Aron can do teshuva.”
If he’s insane (Shoita), he doesn’t have to.
Health” If someone is insane they cannot be held responsible in Beis Din. Only Hakadosh Baruch Hu knows how in control they were of their mental faculties and how much, if any, Teshuvah needs to eb done.
I would imagine that in oreer for Teshuva to be reached, they must get forgiveness from those the murder affected like parents, spouce, kids etc…not sure if that is possible
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