What is the Ner Yisroel college program

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  • #610750

    jwashing
    Member

    I heard that it is associated with Johns Hopkins and University of Maryland what does that mean? Will you get degree from one of these schools?

    #1159497

    nem621
    Member

    to my understanding you go to college twice a week and get a degree from there and your shiur gives you grades that are counted instead of the non essential to the degree classes i am not in yeshiva gedola in ner but i do know several people who are i might be incorrect but i think this is pretty accurate

    #1159498

    jbaldy22
    Member

    ner israel only officially allows 2 courses a semester (besides for the yeshiva credits) – might take you a while to complete a degree at that pace. also to my knowledge they are associated with Towson University not University of Maryland these days. Someone can correct me if I am wrong.

    #1159499

    Ender
    Participant

    It depends which degree you want to get. Do you have something specific in mind?

    #1159500

    jwashing
    Member

    Would it be possible to get a history degree for example from Hopkins and how long would it take

    #1159501

    LevAryeh
    Member

    Posting on the Yeshiva World is probably a better way to get acurate information about Ner Yisroel then, say, calling Ner Yisroel.

    #1159502

    jwashing
    Member

    i called them but the head of the program was out for a week

    #1159503

    jwashing
    Member

    so i just wanted to know if anyone that was part of the program could just explain what it is

    #1159504

    jwashing
    Member

    anyone please

    #1159505

    Chevrai, I am personally a bochur at the Yeshiva, and I first want to say that college is an absolute bedieved, and we must remember that at all times. I am embarrassed to say that I am in college. If you must go to college there are options. You can do Johns Hopkins where you get half of credits from ner and about 20 classes over 2.5 years from johns Hopkins and that is an undergrad in business. Pre-med is done through Towson, and you take the necessary science courses and use your Bachelors in Talmudic Law to apply to Medical school, dental school,etc. There is also a program with UMBC, where it is half ner credits but these credits you must actually take classes for, albeit jewish classes that they offer in ner, and about 60 credits of whatever your major is at UMBC.

    I want to wish you much Hatzlacha, and I want to leave you with a sthickle form the Ramban on Berieshis. I love the Ramban and I encourage everyone to learn it. Efshur its more important to learn Ramban than Gemara. Efshur. Anyway we know that by the creation of man on day 6, pasuk says tov meod. Chazal darshan from this pasuk that its referring to yetzer hara, and other things generally thought of as being bad. So the obvious question is why is it being called good? SO the Ramban answers that looking at things individually and in isolation it might seem that things are bad. Be it the yetzer hara, be it events that take place. But when you look at things form a birds eye view, and when the full picture finally becomes clear, and in the culmination of an event, then you see that that what you thought was bad actually turned out to be VERY GOOD. Meine tireh chaverim, take care and hatzlacha in all that we do.

    #1159506

    jwashing
    Member

    mordechai-ryan

    if you do business from hopkins do you get the degree from hopkins and is there anyway to get a degree in history and is it a btl or a bs

    #1159508

    akuperma
    Participant

    I suggest checking the websites of the schools mentioned (JHU, Towson and UMBC) to see if they are discussing “joint” programs, as opposed to a student at Ner earning credits that can be transferred subject to the those schools’ transfer policy.

    Depending on what you need a degree for, there are many other options to get college credits (including CLEP and AP courses, and distance education programs such as University of Marland’s University College). A program focused on adult distance students might be much happier about accept “yeshiva” credits then a school that has very high acadmeic standards

    #1159509

    @mordechai-ryan

    Why do something if you are so ashamed of it? Is it that you want to live a middle class lifestyle but you want people to think that you are a “hard core kollel family”

    Why not just be proud of the fact that you take your familial responsibility seriously?

    #1159510

    jwashing
    Member

    @akuperma

    i couldnt find anything about joint programs and im not sure what you meant in that last part about yeshiva credits

    #1159511

    The person who administers the Ner Yisroel college program is sitting shiva this week. In short, they monitor the number of evenings per week (usually two) one can register for classes. Boys attend a number of local colleges such as Johns Hopkins, Univ Md Baltimore County,local community colleges, Towson, Univ Baltimore, and Loyola University. It does require attending summer sessions and most boys finish within 5 years with yeshiva credits counted towards the college degrees. Yes, college is secondary to Torah, but Ner Israel has since its early years been an advocate of merging serious Torah learning with the ability to obtain credentials to seek a parnasah too.

    #1159512

    akuperma
    Participant

    jwashing: I couldn’t find any reference in Towson, UMBC or JHU to a joint program with Ner – but that was several years ago. I believe the “joint” program means that a Ner students gets a (NOT entirely worthless) degree from Ner while filling out the secular studies (and professional requirements) elsewhere, or that students can transfer Ner credits (which are potentially transferable since Ner is an accredited college) to get a degree elsewhere. Unlike the typical “joint” programs, student pay full tuitions to both schools.

    I suspect a distance education degree from the University of Maryland might be more practical, depending on their policy towards “yeshiva” credits.

    Ner really shouldn’t call it a “joint” program unless the colleges see it that way, which apparently they don’t.

    #1159513

    jwashing
    Member

    @shlomo Radomska where do you get your degree from and what types of degrees can you get

    #1159514

    jwashing
    Member

    and does anyone know if you have to pay extra for the college and how much

    #1159515

    Unless it has changed since my time, which admittedly is many years ago, but you come out with both a BTL and a secular degree from one of the colleges they have a program with — Towsons, UMBC, Hopkins, etc. Approximately 60 credits from yeshiva are transferred, and thus you only need to take 60 secular credits. Something like 32 need to be in your major. If you go to summer school as well, you can get your BA/BS in 2-3 years. NIRC restricts 1st year Bais medrash guys, but essentially you have your degree 4-5 years after graduating high school. In my time, very few guys went to Rowsons. Guys who were going for computers, accounting or law went to UMBC and guys who needed a science degree went to Hopkins. The state universities are much cheaper.

    #1159516

    jwashing
    Member

    @yiddle with a fiddle so you have to pay the full tuition price. What do you mean by law in UMBC and hopkins is only for science

    #1159517

    jesses1
    Member

    I am also currently in Ner Yisroel, and in truth the options for college are quite limited. There are basically 5 programs:

    1)The Hopkins business program- as far as I know is set up as mordechai-ryan describes. The issue is that Hopkins is closing it’s part time business program,so I don’t think they are accepting any new applicants. As far as I’m aware, there are no other undergraduate majors through Hopkins set up with yeshiva. There are rumors going around that the yeshiva is trying to set up an alternative to the Hopkins program. There is no way to ascertain the veracity of these rumours.

    2)There is an education program (a masters) through Hopkins which is done over the course of two summers, with no coursework throughout the rest of the year. It is run as a separate yeshiva class (not integrated with actual Hopkins, but still a Hopkins degree). That being the case, the program is only offered when there are enough bochurim to start a cohort (10-15 students). The problem is a new group just started this summer, and you can’t join in the second year, and there usually is a buffer year, so you’d have to wait 3yrs to start, and by then moshiach hopefully will have come (or the program will be non-existent). cost- aprox $18000

    3)There is also an MBA program through Loyola which also takes about two and a half years, in which you use your BTL with Business prereqs (I think its 10 courses) to get in and you take 10 graduate courses at Loyola. I don’t know much about it, but its generally not recommended because you have no undergrad backing and you are considered to be overqualified with a masters degree.

    4) Premed/dentistry/PA/anything science related through Towson, is as mordechai-ryan describes. Your science prereq courses are done through Towson over 2 yrs, but you don’t get a degree from there there. Good luck. Also, to apply the program to other science related fields isn’t so simple as the program was set up for med (dental) school. Cost-aprox $8000

    5)UMBC(University of Maryland Baltimore County)- for those from outside Maryland, this is not to be confused with the real University of Maryland (College Park-ranked 62nd versus UMBC ranked 158th). UMBC takes up to (supposedly) 90 transfer credits from Ner, but no Talmud credits. The courses in Ner you’ll have to take shldn’t be that big a deal though (they are mostly in Jewish subjects). The way it is set up is that somehow these courses take care of your electives and most gen ed reqmts (all but a science, English Comp, and a math) leaving only your major to be done at UMBC. Most do psychology, some econ, but you could do History as well (it’s a 39 credit major at UMBC). In this way you’ll do 39 credits plus the gen eds not covered by Ner. It takes about 2-2 and a half yrs. Your degree comes from UMBC. However, how this all works out (i.e- Are there aprox 75 non gemara credits offered at Ner? How do they cover gen ed reqmts?)is quite confusing. Cost- aprox $30,000.

    All timelines are minus 6/4 month fridge (exactly how long you have to wait depends on the program).

    All costs are in addition to yeshiva tuition.

    There will be no info on any of the websites about joint agreements, all are grandfathered in. The credits from Ner do transfer.

    I agree with LevAryehBoy, posting on Yeshiva World is probably a better way to get accurate information about Ner Yisroel then calling Ner Yisroel. Nothing is poshut, you’ve got to speak to guys. Doing college at Ner Yisroel is a test of Bitachon; How anything works doesnt make any sense, and seemingly simple things take forever to achieve (interpret that as you wish). There will be more bittul zman on logistical issues than on the actual college itself. In the end though, with enough davening and at the last possible minute, everything will work out.

    #1159518

    jwashing
    Member

    @jesses1 are the cost annual or all inclusice

    #1159519

    jesses1
    Member

    all inclusive

    #1159520

    jwashing
    Member

    any idea what the new hopkins program might be

    #1159521

    To jwashing: I have degrees from Hopkins (BA and Masters) in psychology and my son has a degree in Information Technology from UMBC. College tuition is in addition to NIRC tuition. Many NIRC grads enter Federal Service at SSA or other local or DC Agencies. Some attend law school at UMd or UB, pass the Md Bar and enter the legal world. Others are in the Accounting, Information Technology, or math-actuarial science areas. There are as many options as there are majors at the schools. While NIRC monitors the number of evening a week the boys can attend they do not monitor what you are majoring in. Just don’t expect much help from NIRC, it is all from the boys themselves and the college career advisers. There is no formal partnership with any colleges so calling them is useless. It is a transfer and acceptance of certain credits from NIRC. Israeli yeshiva credits are more suspect and most will not be accepted. All in all if you are thinking about an out of NY area yeshiva where serious Torah learning can co-exist with college then NIRC is the place. Check it out.

    #1159522

    Josh31
    Participant

    Instead of Bochurim needing permission to go to college part time, it should be the other way around. One will need to prove that if he is allowed to learn full time that he will actually learn full time. The status of “full time learning” should never be the easy way out.

    #1159523

    bklynmom
    Participant

    Many yeshivos including Chofetz Chaim, Ner Yisroel, Shaar hatorah, Torah Vdas (& others) have the ability to issue a BTL degree after usually 4 years of post high school learning (average age of 21-22). With this BTL degree, various Graduate Programs are available, some need additional prerequisites when you apply. This might be the easiest path for higher learning and professional degrees. Many of the online or CLEP courses in essential subjects are looked upon as garbage.

    #1159524

    LevAryeh
    Member

    jesses1 – Are you serious? I was being extremely sarcastic.

    #1159525

    akuperma
    Participant

    bklynmom: Any yeshiva that is accredited can give a degree that will meet the requirements of having a college degree. An unaccredited (as a college) yeshiva that is state licensed to give degrees can give one that will be accepted only in that state. For many jobs and graduate programs, any college degree is the requirement. If a job has specific requirements (e.g. the formal premed requirements, or for some jobs, 30 hours of a given subject, etc.), that’s a matter of a transcript. For some jobs, a degree in “talmud” (or for that matter, art history, or chess, or motion picture history) is enough – for other jobs they ask for something more specific. There are no legal requirements that a B.S. or B.A. cover any subject – 100% in Talmud is fine under American law.

    CLEP and AP are accepted by all but the most elite schools, and sometimes by the elites. They cover all the basic freshman subjects. You study for the test, and take the test. Online courses from accredited universities (typically public ones) that are offered for credit (often with a proctored exam) are accepted widely and meet any requirements. Indeed, one can get a fully accepted bachelor’s from several major universities from online only programs.

    However a “program” such as Ner’s isn’t really a “joint program” since the “participating” schools don’t recognize it as such. You are taking college credits from one college (Ner, which is an accredited college) and transfering them.

    #1159526

    wallflower
    Member

    MordechaiRyan, get over to the Nightly Dvar Torah thread, they need you.

    #1159527

    sharp
    Member

    jwashing, – you’re welcome, dude.

    #1159528

    CRuzer
    Member

    @jesses1,

    Great post! Ner should put that on their website for everyone who has this question! Ner should also make a website…

    @jwashing,

    jesses1 wrote up a very long and very well explained answer to your question (and one that many people have), and you didn’t even say thank you! Ner Yisrael is not the place for you. Hatzlacha

    #1159529

    jwashing
    Member

    im sorry but @jesses1 thank you

    #1159530

    imamom
    Member

    FYI: According to US News and World Report rankings, UMBC is a terrific college! They are very strong in STEM and in social sciences as well.

    #1159531

    Shanifirst
    Member

    I think that Ner is an amazing yeshiva for amazing guys and I think that if you want to go to yeshiva and go to college at the same time Ner is the best yeshiva for you! Talk to the Rabbis there and for the class at Ner request Rabbi Frand i heard how much the boys love him and i listen to all his speeches and read all his books and go to his shiurim. His a really amazing person and amazing Rabbi B’H – that if i wore a boy and went to Ner i would TOTALLY want him and request him:)

    #1159532

    Sparkly
    Member

    It means that you learn and go to college part time. Many boys do that that want to end up working and learning. Its a very good yeshiva for future worker learners and it really helps frum boys get degrees while learning. Most boys end up going to ccbc or umbc there both really good just that ccbc is a community college while umbc is an honor college. Ner gives you an accredited degree in judaic studies and then you just take the required classes for your major at umbc or ccbc. perfect for future doctors that way they only need 4 years of being in a not jewish school plus 10 pre req science classes. Wish they had a program like that for girls that they can learn chumash nevi etc… in a jewish environment and only take the required classes for their major.

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