June 22, 2010 10:59 pm at 10:59 pm #591822
just want to know when the ‘oilam’ in the cr is going up to the Catskills. (who ever is going)June 22, 2010 11:08 pm at 11:08 pm #687697
We never were the “go away” type — whether it be for the summer to a bungalow or to a hotel for Pesach or the like.
That’s not to say, however, that we never took a vacation.
The WolfJune 22, 2010 11:12 pm at 11:12 pm #687698
i (H.S. son) am going to camp monday, at 1PM.
My brother is goin on tuesday, so there will be no posting on this account basically from tuesday till august 24thJune 22, 2010 11:25 pm at 11:25 pm #687699
Have a good summer, HIE. Make sure not to use the camp eruv. 🙂
The WolfJune 22, 2010 11:48 pm at 11:48 pm #687700
sof davar hakol nishmaMember
b”h, no such worries, were out of towners!:) 🙂 🙂June 22, 2010 11:51 pm at 11:51 pm #687701
Its funny that in NY, its “when are you going to the country?” anywhere else its unheard of…not saying its bad just interestingJune 22, 2010 11:59 pm at 11:59 pm #687702
wolf, may i ask y notJune 23, 2010 2:10 am at 2:10 am #687703
Because someone might misuse it, making it pasul for everyone. Or have you forgotten the claim you made about eruvin in our previous discussion on the subject?
The WolfJune 23, 2010 3:22 am at 3:22 am #687704
I’m an oot but going to camp on July 26.June 23, 2010 3:55 am at 3:55 am #687705
which camppJune 23, 2010 4:31 am at 4:31 am #687706
in the catskills but I won’t say which.June 23, 2010 1:54 pm at 1:54 pm #687707
I’m going up Thursday IY”H. Kids leave for camp the following week.June 23, 2010 4:25 pm at 4:25 pm #687708
an eruv in a reshus hayachid is ok. the camps i go to are a reshus hayachid. BP and FB are both Reshus harabim, therefore the BP and FB eruv are PASUL and its ASSUR M’DAIRAISA to carry in BP and FB on SHABBOS.
can you remind me what i said cuz i dont rememberJune 23, 2010 4:46 pm at 4:46 pm #687709
an eruv in a reshus hayachid is ok.
Right. No one argued against that.
You, however, said that a perfectly valid eruv becomes pasul if it is misused. The context was in boys playing ball within the eruv.
I have seen people playing ball in the street and i’m not evening talking about the fact that your not suppose to play ball on shabbos but….
My response to that was (bolding mine):
If there’s a problem with playing ball on Shabbos, then educate people on that aspect of it — don’t conflate it with carrying.
In any event, I agree with you that there are people who might abuse the rules regarding carrying on Shabbos with an eruv — but that doesn’t detract from the validity of the eruv itself. If it’s valid, then it’s valid regardless of the fact that some people may choose to abuse it.
Your response was:
no wolf, that invalidates it.
IOW, you held (and gave a source from some sefer that no one ever heard of) that if someone misuses and eruv, that makes it pasul.
So, I’m advising you that since you don’t know for sure if anyone in the camp is misusing the eruv (and making it pasul according to your position) that you should not use the eruv. After all, chillul Shabbos is a serious matter. As you said:
Shabbos is Shabbos, and it is unadvisable to play with shabbos
The WolfJune 23, 2010 4:47 pm at 4:47 pm #687710
im sorry, an eruv in reshus harabim thats not dairaisa is ok, an eruv in a reshus harabim dairaisa is okJune 23, 2010 5:10 pm at 5:10 pm #687711
While I happen to be one of the non-carriers, the BP eruv does have its fair share of really top rate rabbonim who say its a go (no comment on the flatbush eruv. I don’t live there).
But to say its an issur d’oraisa? No so fast.June 23, 2010 5:26 pm at 5:26 pm #687712
BP and FB are NOT reshus harabim, they are shvilei rsus harabim, hence the machlokesJune 23, 2010 5:33 pm at 5:33 pm #687713
my family is there since last week ThursdayJune 23, 2010 5:34 pm at 5:34 pm #687714
an eruv in a reshus harabim dairaisa is ok
Yes, I know. But you said that an eruv, even if otherwise valid, is passul if people misuse it (by playing ball, for example).
That being said, I just want to remind you not to use the eruv in your camp since you don’t know if people might misuse it and make it passul (according to you).
The WolfJune 23, 2010 5:43 pm at 5:43 pm #687717
there are many INCLUDING rav Belsky who wont walk into BP due to the chillul shabbos that goes on there. B”H i live in flatbush where almost no one holds of the eruv, B’HJune 23, 2010 5:50 pm at 5:50 pm #687718
You’re missing the point. I’m not talking about Flatbush or Boro Park or Rav Belsky.
You said that an eruv — if otherwise valid — is made pasul by people misusing it (by playing ball). I’m just reminding you of that so that you don’t use the eruv in camp (for the reasons I stated above).
The WolfJune 23, 2010 5:53 pm at 5:53 pm #687719
there are many INCLUDING rav Belsky who wont walk into BP
Yes, I know that. It pains my rov as well. And I know of one person who still yells “SHABBOS” like he’s at a rally in EY.
But that does not negate the position of the rabbonim who say its ok. Ball playing? Bike riding? No, that’s not ok. Pushing a baby carraige? Were we in the baby carrage stage when the eruv went public, not so sure I would have insisted my wife go along. At this point, to me its like an issue of cholov stam vs cholov yisroel. I can be machmir, but if the need is there (and believe me, going out on Shabbos if you work all week is a need) and there are serious rabbonim who says its a-ok, I’m not so sure I’d put my foot down.
(sorry mods. Off topic, but this one’s too hot to drop)June 23, 2010 6:12 pm at 6:12 pm #687720
no, it’s not like cholov stam, cuz cholov stam is a chumra this is an issur dairaisa.
and btw, in the camp i go to, its unheard of to play ball on shabbosJune 23, 2010 6:17 pm at 6:17 pm #687721
and btw, in the camp i go to, its unheard of to play ball on shabbos
So, you can personally vouch for *every* camper, staff member and visitor to your camp on Shabbos that they won’t do *anything* that might be considered improper on Shabbos? I don’t think you (or anyone else, for that matter) can provide such a guarantee.
I think you shouldn’t take the chance. Shabbos is Shabbos and it is unadvisable to play with shabbos.
The WolfJune 23, 2010 6:22 pm at 6:22 pm #687722
I’m leaving to NY on sunday and going up to camp on monday morning…
Why dont we share where were going??June 23, 2010 6:54 pm at 6:54 pm #687723
K so i’ll start – I’m going to work at Camp Kochavim on monday.
(btw – Sharing this information does not constitute as “pry out personal information. Any questions or comments directed towards trying to “figure out” a blogger’s identity”, as stated in The Personal Information section rule #1 , because there are from 250 to 800 people in every camp so the info doesnt help to figure out,
I’m just curious as to where the YW chev goes…June 23, 2010 7:02 pm at 7:02 pm #687724
I’m just curious as to where the YW chev goes…
I don’t go to camp. I work. 🙂
The WolfJune 23, 2010 7:10 pm at 7:10 pm #687725
Wolf-me too 🙁June 23, 2010 7:12 pm at 7:12 pm #687726
Camps have over 500+ so its realitivly easy to stay anon. Colonies have about 100-200 or so possible suspects, so narrowing it down to a place would almost certainly blow your cover (although, were any of my neighbors to read the CR, they would spot me in a heartbeat, but that’s no reason to make it easy)June 23, 2010 7:14 pm at 7:14 pm #687727
Dovv – Chocavim! I thought all the CR members were Lakewood material!June 23, 2010 7:30 pm at 7:30 pm #687728
Ohr Shraga, Ellenville, NY – 1st half
Agudah- ferndale, NY 2nd halfJune 23, 2010 7:34 pm at 7:34 pm #687729
I’m not going as a camper.. im WORKING there.. the staff has a nice FRUM chavraJune 23, 2010 7:34 pm at 7:34 pm #687730
I thought all the CR members were Lakewood material!
Hi! Allow me to introduce myself — my name is Wolf – and I am not Lakewood material. 🙂
The WolfJune 23, 2010 7:35 pm at 7:35 pm #687731
FWIW, my kids used to go to Mogen Av/Sternberg (when I sent them to camp that is. Now it’s just too expensive).
The WolfJune 23, 2010 7:38 pm at 7:38 pm #687732
Wolfish, may you be zocha to reach that madreiga b’korov.June 23, 2010 7:39 pm at 7:39 pm #687733
Wolfish, may you be zocha to reach that madreiga b’korov.
What if I see a different path in Avodas HaShem for myself? Is Lakewood the *only* way to go?
The WolfJune 23, 2010 7:40 pm at 7:40 pm #687734
There are alternatives for those on other madreigas…June 23, 2010 7:41 pm at 7:41 pm #687735
Ya i dont even know why i was trying to defend myself BP… Hi my name is Dovv and i, like Wolf, am not Lakewood material.June 23, 2010 9:47 pm at 9:47 pm #687736
Wolf – Not lakewood material? Of course you are.. you just don’t show it :).
Dovv – I did not mean that is a serious tone or in a bad way. My comment was based on the ad I hear on the radio, and the yeshivas they list as where their staff comes from, while top rate yeshivas in their own right, are not what you (or anyone) would call “black hatters”
In any event, I’m not Lakewood material by any stretch of the imagination either (refuse to give up my 3-button polos and baseball caps 😉June 23, 2010 9:49 pm at 9:49 pm #687737
And one of my boys went to Heller, then to Bey Kyta when it opened (definitly not Lakewood material)June 24, 2010 12:04 am at 12:04 am #687738
what are you being in Agudah 2nd half?June 24, 2010 12:15 am at 12:15 am #687739
shteiging, a Junior Specialty.
how old are you and what are you doing this summerJune 24, 2010 12:20 am at 12:20 am #687740
“What if I see a different path in Avodas HaShem for myself? Is Lakewood the *only* way to go?”
In the yeshivish world, yes. Lakewood or the Lakewood style is the only way to serve Hashem. We serve him through learning Torah no other way is nearly as good.June 24, 2010 12:38 am at 12:38 am #687741
HIE- I’m going to be in agudah 2nd half as a lifeguard.June 24, 2010 1:08 am at 1:08 am #687742
“Now it’s just too expensive”
So what are yur kids doing this summer? Are they going to day camp or will they just waste the summer away?June 24, 2010 1:20 am at 1:20 am #687743
I think hie is right about the eruv. If some1 uses a eruv to play ball it does make it pasul for every1. My rebbe told us this.June 24, 2010 1:28 am at 1:28 am #687744
mosherose, day camp?! How can you send any heilige yiddishe neshama to day camp? Don’t you know it’s bitul zman and bitul Torah, with all those arts ‘n crafts, sports, sprinkling, trips, color war, and activities? Oy, a bizayon! A shanda!June 24, 2010 2:17 am at 2:17 am #687745
shteiging, what yeshiva u go toJune 24, 2010 3:51 am at 3:51 am #687746
HIE- i go to MYRCBJune 24, 2010 4:28 am at 4:28 am #687747
i go to M-YTV
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