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square root of 2Participant
joseph, how?
square root of 2Participantwhy did hashem even make our generation?
square root of 2ParticipantSo basically it seems that yerushalmi, for one reason or the other, is less accepted in halacha than bavli is. IS that a fair summary?
Sam2, that’s very interesting (that there may be a third gemara). Does anyone have any proof one way or the other?
square root of 2ParticipantI find it hard to believe that the bavli is learned more because it’s more interesting.
square root of 2ParticipantSo back the question up a little bit. Why has talmud bavli been learned for years, and not yerushalmi?
square root of 2Participantso how does that differ from emunah?
square root of 2ParticipantOn a related note, sometimes people will point out a sick person who has it so hard, etc. and say “we have to be thankful to Hashem that our hands, feet, lungs…etc. function properly and we don’t have these problems.”
Am I wrong in assuming that’s incorrect? People with problems have them because that’s their nisayon, (or maybe a punishment, in some cases.) That’s not the way it’s supposed to be in all cases. I feel it’s like saying you have to thank someone because they didn’t punch you in the nose. Of course, if Hashem would inflict someone with a problem, it would be bidin, as opposed to a jerk who punches you, but if he doesn’t, it’s because we in our situation are not supposed to have that issue, so why must we thank him for that?
square root of 2ParticipantYou’re right and I don’t think kefirah and arayos are insignificant, however, as I said in my original post, frum colleges really don’t have those issues.
square root of 2ParticipantSo what’s your answer? That really there’s nothing wrong with college (aside from bitul torah) but people are still wary of it because colleges teach kfira and arayos?
square root of 2ParticipantTell me, if the cash register has an instruction manual, would he read it? If so, he obviously does read secular material, and his not going to college is not because he considers it assur to read secular material.
Well, that was basically my point in my original post.
square root of 2Participantdaas yochid, so the point of telling such stories is basically only to prove that missing the meeting was for his good, but it doesn’t directly answer his broken foot?
square root of 2ParticipantDaasYochid, then why do many yeshivish families who have a son not holding by learning, refuse to send him to college, and instead find him a job as a cashier or something?
square root of 2ParticipantThanks, DaMoshe for highlighting the fact that modern orthodox learn a lot. I mentioned before I know someone who goes to a modern orthodox yeshiva. The bais medrash there (and in most modern orthodox yeshivos) is set up with a shelf in front of each seat, which is literally full of seforim. He personally has his own reference shas and rambam, plus a lot of rishonim and acharonim on what he’s learning, plus classical mussar seforim–nefesh chayim, sifrei maharal, and others. I thought at first that they don’t learn bi’iyun but he tells me over the shiur sometimes and it’s a regular lomdishe shiur. And he and many over there are big masmidim.
square root of 2ParticipantBarryLs1, you said that we should drop the labeling altogether, but in truth modern orthodoxy isn’t a “label” like “yeshivish” or “balabatish”. Modern orthodoxy was a movement, an intentional act to change something, and modern orthodoxy would label themselves as such as well. It’s like saying we shouldn’t label people who go to different yeshivos by saying, “He attends___” and “he goes to _____”, rather everyone goes to one yeshiva.
square root of 2ParticipantAnd zahavasdad, my username wasn’t a question, and your answer is inaccurate, anyway. The square root of 2 is irrational and doesn’t serve any apparent function besides provide material for mathematicians.
square root of 2Participantagain, thanks everyone for your answers, especially yours, richashu. 🙂
I want to point out, something I forget in my OP, that there are a lot of modern orthodox who are extremely scrupulous in halacha–more so than some ‘chareidim’–(unless maybe certain areas, i.e. tznius, which as I said before, there is room to be lenient even al pi halacha), R Lichtenstien being a perfect example. I know someone from a modern orthodox yeshiva who puts me to shame in learning. It’s probably more the attitude with which they approach yiddishkeit that plays the main difference; in a sense I can feel it, too, and has the outcome richashu pointed out.
Hey, I meant to ask that as part of the question, but I realize I basically answered it–with all your help. Thanks!
square root of 2ParticipantR. Moshe was modern orthodox?
square root of 2ParticipantThanks for the answers, everyone. I didn’t yet read through all of Joseph’s post, I’ll have to save that for some other time, but basically everyone else seems to indicate that there isn’t much difference.
What flatbusher said, many “balabatish” people don’t wear hats for davening and aren’t considered modern orthodox, and as far as women being more relaxed in their dress: you’re right about that, but as far as halacha goes the only thing they really do wrong is not covering their hair and that’s not enough to define the difference between modern orthodox and regular orthodox. (I know I took that line out of context and your answer was more substantial than that.) (And as it happens, there is a major decline in tznius among chareidim recently.)
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