Bloomberg or Trump?

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    Factors to consider
    Trump: biggest supporter of Israel of any President, hakaras hatov, pro-religious Republican
    Bloomberg: May be as pro-Israel as Trump, Can prevent anti-semitic Democrats from running in 2024, too old to run ever again if he loses, can make Democrats pro-Israel, Jewish (can also be a negative), may cause people to hate Jews for being rich and kicking Trump out of office


    Remember the metzitza bpeh witch hunt guess who helped it along ? Bloomberg.


    Bloomberg is an antisemite, self-hating Jew. He opposes Judaism and has tried to outlaw Jewish practices.

    concerrned mom

    Jews for trump! There is no better option…would be amazing if it can show in voting blocs like if certsin places in new york turn trump!!


    I won’t vote Trump under any circumstances.
    I’ll wait to see who the D nominee is before deciding if I am voting for him/her.
    As a delegate to the state D party convention and assumed delegate to the national convention I have been contacted repeatedly by the D contenders including the Bloomberg campaign but have not committed by vote as of yet. Our state primary is in April, I’ll see who is left in the race before voting


    Trump 100%. Don’t fool yourself.


    Bernie Sanders is going to secure the Democrat Nomination [Please bear in mind, that the rage against the Democrats for having stolen the nomination from Bernie to Hillary 4 years ago, is so palpable, is a huge factor in Bernie’s leading the pack], and it shall be laughing stock watching Bernie & President Donald Trump thrice at the debates, but thereafter, President Donald Trump is going to win handsomely.
    Please mark my word on these 2 fronts!!


    Trump is a friend of (frum) Jews, Bloomberg is an enemy. Under Trump, the government is pro-religion (excluding those whose religion requires them to kill or persecute others) and American policy is to support Freedom OF Religion; under the Democrats the government will support a policy of militant secularism and “freedom FROM religion”.


    I can’t imagine Trump performing well in any debate, even against Biden. Klobuchar, Mayor Pete, and even Bernie would destroy him.


    Do you really think Trump can handle three debates? He didn’t exactly do very well against Hilary

    Resident Mortal


    You are a delegate for a party that is advocating for abortion and tuvya marriage. You should be ashamed of yourself.


    If Bloomberg is gone by 2024 who will take down the hard-core anti-Semitic radical Democrats?


    Don’t listen to CTL selfish motivation for voting Dem. Bloomberg as president would be a tragedy.


    Pull you head out of the sand and that this is 2020.

    Abortion is legal having been declared so in 1973 by the US Supreme Court
    Same Sex Marriage is legal having been declared so in 2015 by the US Supreme Court.

    The party of which I am a delegate is not advocating these already legal things. They were made legal not by elected officials passing laws but by the Judicial Branch of Government.

    Keep your false hatred to yourself.


    Your ignorant posts never cease to amuse me.
    I have stated that I’ll vote against Trump.
    I have stated that I’ll willing pay more taxes to provide social programs to the populace.
    What is selfish about that???
    Have I suggested anyone else vote for the Democratic Party? I dare you to find me trying to sway a vote in the CR.

    You are just oppositional. If I say something you find the need to post in opposition.
    Joseph and I disagree on many things but don’t feel the urge to attack that you have, I suggest you grow up and just scroll on by and don’t read my posts

    Little Froggie

    Is that the guy from the snow removal fiasco, the one who had others fired because of HIS blunders?!?

    Is that the guy who changed the laws to allow himself to be mayor for three terms and then afterwards changed it back so that no one else could do it?!?


    Little froggie
    Is that the guy who banned all sorts of creature comforts because they are bad for the environment but then left his limos running all day so they would be cool when he steps into it?
    Mr know it all


    You don’t like Trump for personal business reasons.


    It makes no difference whom CTL or I vote for, since we live in states that are solidly blue. I’m guessing the same is true of most CR denizens, given that the majority of frum Jews in America live in NY and NJ.

    Resident Mortal


    And the executive branch puts up for nomination the judicial branch including the supreme court; One more justice and abortion will be illegal on the federal level once again but even if it stays status quo the judicial branch never made late term abortion legal only the concept of abortion.

    About same sex marriage is the least of the problems, now the democrats are becoming social justice warriors wanting to increase LGBTQ+ rights which is antithetical to Torah doctrine.

    I dont hate you i just think your an idiot that puts your personal ideological beliefs before the torah.


    You have no idea what my personal moral beliefs are
    I point out what is legal in these United States.
    The fact that abortion is legal and is same sex marriage does not mean I would participate in either or recommend them or condone them.
    I do believe that beyond the Noahide Laws we members of the Jewish Minoroty cannot expect the secular government to apply Torah principles and laws to control the behavior of non-Jews.

    I am a fiscal Conservative and a Social Liberal (in terms of government and the populace). If an adult female wants an abortion, that is her decision and she should pay for it herself.
    If two adults want to buy a license so that their cohabitation has the same tax advantages and legal protections of any other married couple That is just equal application of the laws. No one is making me date or marry another man.

    The Supreme Court that decided Roe v. Wade was under a Republican President. Even if another conservative justice is appointed and Roe overturned, it will not stop legal abortion in NY, CT and many other states where it is either codified into law or been permitted by state courts. Same with Same Sex marriages. It might stop the pending of federal funds such as Medicaid to pay for abortions and stop federal income tax deductions for a same sex couple, In these northeastern states who had legal same sex marriage before the SCOTIS rule, couples files state taxes as married and federal as singles


    ” One more justice and abortion will be illegal on the federal level once again”

    there is about a zero percent chance of that happening
    At worst they will rule that there is no constitutional “right to abortion” in which case it would be up to the states. Even this is unlikely, but at least plausible


    CT for a lawyer obsessed with technical accuracy this last post was misleading at best and probably faulty as well.

    Noahide laws?
    Outlaw abortion (it’s called murder)
    Outlaw gay activity (arayos)
    So yes as a practising Jew you should do all you can to make sure the secular government doesn’t transgress these two.

    Your statement that the Supreme Court that legalized abortion was ”under a republican president ” is total obfuscation.
    That’s like saying the car accident took place under johns window.
    Presidents can’t remove (or change) justices. And you know that good and well. They can only fill vacancies. So the question is who appointed the justices that ultimately legalized murder and debauchery.
    Not in which presidential calendar cycle did it take place.
    Some of us are not so easily fooled by barrages of well made sentences. (aka we are republicans not damnocrats)

    Little Froggie

    We, as Yidden (that’s ‘Jews’, for the uneducated), have to stand up for what’s moral, upright, upstanding. And our ‘neighbors’ acknowledge that, they expect us, as HaShem’s chosen people, to do so. And that’s why every misstep chalila makes it into the news. Because we have a higher standard, a higher calling – whether we like it or not. We’re expected to behave differently.

    As a visibly identifiable Yid (again, that’s a Jew), we cannot condone nor disregard moral depravity. It has to be called out again and again. It has to be known that “while current U.S. law cannot forbid, nevertheless it is still utter depravity. And I abhor it and call it out in no uncertain terms. I know it and you know it too.” Yes, it’s freedom of speech. Standing up for what’s moral is not outlawed (YET). Let them hear it over and over again, just as much as the democrats and liberals try to spew THEIR filth onto us. Just as much as they’re trying to rip away at human society, at the last visage of Godly grace, צלם אלקים.

    President Trump, with all his … notwithstanding, still appears to hold on to these last stands of decency. Think of the moral decisions he’s made whether abortions, toeva community, so-called climate concerns… He’s also used his guts to stand up to the nations and do what needed to be done, whether Israel, UN, Iran, North Korea, China. He’s got a spine like no other president I can remember, BECAUSE of his personality. While we may not necessarily like it, sometimes it seems a bit… it’s all tools the manner he presides. That’s the President HaShem has chosen for us, הממליך מלכים, and he comes with all his tools. And boy has he made a splash – in the right direction.

    These other no-gooders (dems, libs, וכל טמא לנפש), are just concerned with their power, their own agenda which is to wipe off the last visage of shame from human society. Anything’s ok. Just do your one thing. And then turn it into a pride!! Hear that?! Turn shame into pride. Disgusting. And then these nincompoops who want to tear down human society, are so concerned about climate change. (For those who don’t recall – first it was global warming… but when proven that there’s nothing to substantiate that claim, they turned their mission to climate change. Like in the olden times the weather didn’t change!) Which again, all these Copenhagen chachmei Chelm notwithstanding, there’s nothing to back their claim either. No – AOC and Co. – the world is not going away in twelve years! Unless Brooklyn is from some other planet, I don’t see it sinking.

    What is sinking at an alarming rate is basic human decency. But OH. And Duh! That’s what dems and libs are all about.


    RE: CTLawyer vs ResidentMoral

    Slavery was legal in the United States, and the Supreme Court upheld it. It required some very unconstitutional measures to change (civil war, stripping a third of the states of their political rights, getting several percent of the population killed). Also note the the scientific consensus supported slavery, it was the religious fanatics who brought it down.

    Murdering Jews was legal in Germany, based on laws constitutionally passed by a democratically elected government (n.b. the post-war trials conducted by the Allies were for killing non-Germans, which violated international law). One should note that German policy was based on American racial policy, and reflected the
    scientific consensus at the time on racial and ethnic supremacy.

    Abortion is no more morally reprehensible than American slavery (which was unusually reprehensible compared to Roman or Jewish law), or the mass murder of ethnic and religious minorities – if you like one, you’ll like them all.

    Resident Mortal


    You can spend today until tomorrow yapping about how I do not know what your moral beliefs are but when you not only stand with a party (which is bad enough) but also defend a party that is FUNDAMENTALLY devoid of morality it shows exactly where your beliefs are.

    You can try to cloak your moral depravity with a garbage belief that as a Jewish minority we cannot expect the secular government to apply Torah principles and laws to control the behavior of non-Jews but its not working.

    Here are the facts.

    Gay relationships is specifically called out in the Torah and is called an abomination and for the you to not only sanction it but advocate benefits for doing it is disgusting and vial.

    Abortion is Murder, PERIOD. The mere fact that you defend a “woman’s right to kill” shows us exactly how morally bankrupt you have become. Would you advocate a woman’s right to kill her 1 year old baby?

    There is no half measures here, what you are doing is wrong!


    I love how you started your response with I don’t condone and then you go about condoning and defending said beliefs you espouse that you didn’t condone.

    Reb Eliezer

    Is it moral that if not for Jewish charities, Jews would starve and be unable to pay their mortgages or rent as the Republicans don’t care? They say sink or swim. They drive up the deficit and thereby the National Debt sky high.


    The Republican is all for calling abortion murder, but as soon as that child is born, offers no help to assist in it’s upbringing.

    You not what may actually reduce abortions? Better welfare.

    It’s the people with the least access to birth control and education that need these abortions the most.

    But no, SNAP, healthcare, rent assistance is cut every year in the budget and people wonder why women don’t want to carry their children to term.

    Republicans, so quick to take the moral high ground, “morals” often guided by religious influence and are all too quick to call abortion murder. But suggesting welfare to help these mothers raise their children? Suddenly morals and religion’s guidance on charity all goes out of the window.

    It’s not like these programs are all that expensive either. In 2017, the average taxpayer paid $91.29 of taxes towards SNAP (formerly Food Stamps)

    And $3,044.79 of taxes towards funding the military.

    Those numbers look pretty immoral to me.


    Bloomberg is scary.

    Resident Mortal

    Not speaking as republican but as a Jewish person who tries to live his life according to the torah



    you had me with your lofty speech until “President Trump, with all his … notwithstanding”

    you cannot claim to support that which is “stand up for what’s moral, upright, upstanding.” and then support Trump in the same post.

    If you say Trump is the better candidate so we have to disregard the fact that he is the polar opposite of all that is “moral, upright, upstanding.” and vote for him any way I hear that .

    But you cannot then claim to support that which is moral upright and upstanding. you support the candidate that you feel is MORE in line with (your view) of what is moral upright and upstanding, and he rest of us will do the same

    Little Froggie


    Sorry for that long winded derasha, Certainly did not mean it to be “lofty” or anything of that sort.

    To clarify, of course I pick the better of the two… And there are two issues I’d like to further clarify:
    #1) He doesn’t go around throwing, spewing and broadcasting his lifestyle upon us. A goy, like all other goyim, some with a bit more, some with a bit less.. nothing for a Yid to admire. Again, as Rabbi Miller זצ”ל says over and over, the best of אומות העולם cannot hold a candle the the lowest of עם הקודש. But the mere fact he doesn’t turn it into some “pride”, that of itself is something.
    #2) He’s OUR PRESIDENT now. And Chazal say גם במדעך מלך אל תקלל, I think it surely applies to our sitting President. We don’t curse or bad-mouth him.
    #3) As someone else mentioned, his views aren’t skewed, they’re more aligned with an upright, moral standard of lifestyle. As opposed to the others who are so open headed and mindless. Right and wrong are so skewed… They’re worried about a planet they “claim” is sinking while they disregard their morals which has sunk.. to the depths…



    ” He doesn’t go around throwing, spewing and broadcasting his lifestyle upon us”

    Lol he does. He has been in the limelight for decades. he epitomizes ALL the negative qualities you claim to, that is his claim to fme and how he got elected .

    “We don’t curse or bad-mouth him.”
    So don’t

    ” they’re more aligned with an upright, moral standard of lifestyle”
    That’s your opinion, and I get that and not going to dispute that.

    BUT, take a step back and realize that it is not absolute. you say “have to stand up for what’s moral, upright, upstanding.” and I agree, but regardless who you vote for you have to compromise on your ideals (meaning by way of supportting the lesser of two evils). The only question is which is the lesser,. but it is silly to say if you vote democrat then you automatically support xyz but I can support Trump while still being say pro-truth.

    Bottom line:
    Supporting a candidate (or party) does NOT mean you automatically endorse/support every position that party or individual takes.


    Ubiq I think you side stepped his point.
    Trump for all his many failings does not ADVOCATE living his lifestyle.
    Sure he enjoys it and flaunts it. But he doesn’t claim ”it’s the proper way to live ”he just says I’m trump so I can do whatever I want. And get away with it.
    You know what ”get away with it”means?
    It means ”sure I know it’s wrong, but I enjoy it and nobody can stop me so I’m going to do it anyway ”
    As opposed to
    ”if you don’t support gay marriage you are a closed minded evil discriminatory person.
    If you don’t support infanticide, you are anti women and a misogynist. ”

    Both are statements that this is the correct way to live.
    I can support a candidate who joys he is a pleasure glutton even though it’s wrong for him.
    I can’t support someone who makes the worst activities into a ”positive lifestyle ”

    Little Froggie

    KY: Exactly.

    You ARE a Kluger Yid!!!


    “Ubiq I think you side stepped his point.”

    I did not .

    your lomdishe chiluk is irelevent the bottom line is DY said it best on another thread

    “Trump is very far from a bastion of morality…. Trump proudly admitted to arayos which are included in the sheva mitzvos b’nei Noach. In many ways, he’s a big menuval.

    I may very well end up voting for him because he will (again) be the lesser of two evils, but please, let’s not pretend there’s such a clear and obvious moral superiority here.”

    “I can’t support someone who makes the worst activities into a ”positive lifestyle ””
    So don’t .

    Though who supports “infanticide” ?

    Resident Mortal

    “Though who supports “infanticide” ?

    The democratic party.



    “The democratic party.”
    That’s horrible! the whole party ? certain members ? which ones? I generally consider my self somewhat versed in politics, can you provide a source for this horrible accusation?


    Though who supports “infanticide” ?
    Anyone who supports abortion except in cases of danger to someone’s life.
    Have you been smoking legal damnocrat weed lately?
    You feel better if we call it fetalcide?
    Once it’s a viable fetus forty days after conception, by all accounts, it’s murder to ”terminate ”
    And you know that.
    Not sure what your game is, but I fell straight into your trap, so you can spring the clincher on me. I’m ready.


    KlugerYid: I couldnt agree more.

    The difference between Trump and a Democrat like Sanders is that the Democrats are trying to change society into a morally depraved society in which Noahide laws arent followed, sodomy is encouraged and abortion is encouraged. these people want to teach children that sodomy is a good thing, they want to promote it. California even passed some kind of meshugah law in which they start teaching kindergarten children in public schools about “transgender”. I know we don’t send our children to public schools, but do we really want all children in society to be taught about this kind of garbage in schools? is that the kind of society we want? Trump may be morally terrible himself as a person, but he actually supports laws that make society a better place for everyone. Which is whats good for yidden and for everyone else as well.


    “Anyone who supports abortion except in cases of danger to someone’s life.

    I don’t follow. In what language does “infanticide” include abortion?

    “Have you been smoking legal damnocrat weed lately?”
    I don’t know what that means

    “You feel better if we call it fetalcide?”
    no I dont feel better.
    He said “infanticide” I;m not such a stickler for word purity, but a semblance of meaning needs to be attached. does infanticide include abortion? since when? And if not why say something it isnt
    Does it make sense to say Republicans support infanticide since they oppose gun restrictions? Granted it is closer to reality than saying Democrats suport infanticide, bu t it is still a stretch .

    “Once it’s a viable fetus forty days after conception, by all accounts, it’s murder to ”terminate ”
    And you know that.”
    Um no I don’t certainly not by “all accounts” (R’ Moshe being a notable exception) and also not in practice in the cases I’m familiar with


    Killing of infant
    Democrat party supports post birth abortion.
    Post birth a fetus is called an infant
    Besides you know good and well that I meant aborting a full term baby which is legal is basically infanticide.
    But if you want to be a stickler, have it your way.
    Change it to supports murder.
    Killing a fetus in late stage because it’s not in my plans to have it, is murder.
    And the democrat party champions the right of every woman to do so unmolested.
    You won’t find any mainstream posek who says that killing a fetus in the ninth month because the mother is not interested in having a baby, is OK.
    You will find all kinds of talk in various outliner cases
    That’s not the discussion and you know it. The discussion is quite simple
    If a woman eight months pregnant reader she doesn’t want the fetus just because she is not in the mood to deal with having a baby. can she kill it?
    The democrat party says it’s her God given right
    I say that’s murder
    I’m wrong?
    Show me the source
    Don’t jump on my phraseology
    Don’t show me scenarios


    “If a woman eight months pregnant reader she doesn’t want the fetus just because she is not in the mood to deal with having a baby. can she kill it?”


    “I say that’s murder I’m wrong?”
    Yes, ( though, thats not the discussion here, the question was regarding “infanticide” which it isnt. it isnt regicide nor suicide either )

    “Show me the source”
    Sure. provided more on the other thread. Heres one:
    Mishna in ohalos allows abortion when life of mother is at stake. Do we murder one person to save another? No, as the mishna concludes “ein dochin nefesh mipnei nefesh” Eleh mai pre birth isnt murder.
    (again some disagree, and of course lots of things that arent murder arent allowed.

    I’m not saying its allowed just that it isnt “infanticide” (nor murder, though some argue so if you say it Is murder that is your prerogative)


    “Democrat party supports post birth abortion.”

    source please? (that “the party” supports this)

    “I meant aborting a full term baby which is legal is basically infanticide.”

    Is it?
    So Halacha calls for infanticide if a mother is chayiv misah (Erachin 1:4) ?

    “You won’t find any mainstream posek who says that killing a fetus in the ninth month because the mother is not interested in having a baby, is OK.”
    Oh definitely not. Its very much not ok


    ”Oh definitely not. Its very much not ok”
    This is what we are talking about
    This is what the democrat party demands you glorify.
    This is why I and others here call them murderers.
    Thank you.
    I’m not interested in exceptional cases .
    The point is they don’t just allow exceptional cases.
    They want total approval for abortion on demand with no limits


    It is, however, significant that a centrist Democrat like Biden has now come out against Hyde. That shows that calling for a repeal of the amendment has become a mainstream position in the Democratic Party, something that was hard to imagine even five years ago. ”vox” (whatever that website is)

    The Hyde Amendment, first passed in 1976, bans federal funding for abortions except in cases of rape, incest, or a threat to the life of the pregnant patient. The exceptions for rape and incest were added in 1993, when Bill Clinton was president.


    Believes abortion is between a woman and her doctor.
    Klobuchar views abortion as a decision between a woman and her doctor.
    In 2006, Klobuchar said that “we need to start talking about common ground, and about reducing the number of abortions–making them safe and making them rare.”
    Klobuchar co-sponsored the Women’s Health Protection Act. The legislation prohibits states from setting restrictions on abortion.

    Resident Mortal

    Google it. They (the people running for the presidency) aren’t even hiding the buck.

    Pete Buttigieg:

    “I am a proud Pro-Life Democrat,” Day opened her question to Buttigieg, “So, do you want the support of Pro-Life Democrats, Pro-Life Democratic voters? There are about 21 million of us, and if so, would you support more moderate platform language in the Democratic Party to ensure that the party of diversity and inclusion really does include everybody?”

    “I’m not going to try to earn your vote by tricking you. I am pro-choice, and I believe that a woman ought to be able to make that decision.” Attempting to soften the appearance of his extreme anti-Life position, Buttigieg, who refuses to endorse any abortion restrictions, continued, “But I know that the difference of opinion that you and I have is one that we have come by honestly. And the best that I can offer — and it may win your vote, and if not, I understand. The best that I can offer is that, if we can’t agree on where to draw the line, the next best thing we can do is agree on who should draw the line. And in my view, it’s the woman who is faced with that decision in her own life.”

    Elizabeth Warren:

    “Just this weekend,” said debate moderator Rachel Maddow, “Louisiana reelected a Democratic governor, John Bel Edwards. He has signed one of the country’s toughest laws restricting abortion.”

    “Look, I believe that abortion rights are human rights. I believe that they are also economic rights,” said the Massachusetts senator. “And protecting the right of a woman to be able to make decisions about her own body is fundamentally what we do and what we stand for as a Democratic Party.”

    “Understand this. When someone makes abortion illegal in America, rich women will still get abortions. It’s just going to fall hard on poor women. It’s going to fall hard on girls, women who don’t even know that they’re pregnant because they have been molested by an uncle. I want to be an America where everybody has a chance.”

    “I know it can be a hard decision for people,” Warren continued. “But here’s the thing. When it comes down to that decision, a woman should be able to call on her mother, she should be able to call on her partner, she should be able to call on her priest or her rabbi. But the one entity that should not be in the middle of that decision is the government.”

    till more babbling. But to Maddow’s great credit, she wasn’t having it.

    “Senator Warren, I need to push you on this a little bit for a specific answer to the question. Governor John Bel Edwards in Louisiana is an anti-abortion governor who has signed abortion restrictions in Louisiana. Is there room for him in the Democratic Party with those politics?”

    Warren responded with yet another non-answer: “I have made clear what I think the Democratic Party stands for. I’m not here to try to drive anyone out of this party. I’m not here to try to build fences. But I am here to say, this is what I will fight for as president of the United States. The women of America can count on that.”

    Bernie Sanders

    Speaking at the “Our Rights, Our Courts” forum in Concord on Saturday, the senator from Vermont was asked by MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle if he believed it was possible to be pro-life and a Democrat.

    While acknowledging the existence of a few pro-life Democrats in Congress, Sanders nevertheless concluded, “By this time in history, I think when we talk about what a Democrat is, I think being pro-choice is an essential part of that.”


    “I think being pro-choice is an absolutely essential part of being a Democrat,” Sanders replied. “By this time in history . . . when we talk about what a Democrat is, I think being pro-choice is an essential part of that,” he added.


    Bloomberg criticized abortion-rights supporters who support abortion-rights opponents in elections, saying that supporters must “exercise vigilance” so that lawmakers do not “try to nuance themselves away from that commitment in the interest of political expediency.” Some analysts say Bloomberg’s comments signal a condemnation of Sen. Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.) and other abortion-rights supporters who are supporting candidates who oppose abortion rights. Schumer heads the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, which recruited Bob Casey (D) as the only way to beat Sen. Rick Santorum (R) because Pennsylvania voters are split on the issue of abortion. Casey opposes abortion rights with exceptions for cases involving rape or incest or to save the life of the woman and supports family planning programs. Bloomberg said, “Reproductive choice is a fundamental human right, and we can never take it for granted,” adding, “On this issue, you’re either with us or against us.”
    Source: Website , May 2, 2006

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