Very disturbing, please only kind people read.

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  • #601532

    I can barely get my thoughts together to make this post intelligible, because I am suffering from postpartum depression, and have gone off Zoloft, and I need to be back on it. Until I can get my head together, and figure out what to do and where to go with my life plans, I am really ….um…what is the word I am looking for??? confused? Sad? Lost?

    Today and yesterday, and the day before and the week previous to that, and actually for the whole past year or 2 (my husband and I) are fighting a real lot. He is harsh in his responses to me, over anything and nothing. He snaps, he is a grump,of course it hurts my feelings, ruins the shalom bayis, I turn sulky, beg for his acknowledgement and apology or at least to notice he did something wrong, but he does nothing except justify his actions.

    Very lately he is turning into a monster. The anger and whatever (call it depression) is escalating with in him, and he is taking his frustration in the marriage out on the kids. This depressive mood is almost tangible in the house since I am in a deep depression because of him and the life he has to offer us with all his problems.

    But today (shabbos) I was in a miserable mood seeing as I am basically stuck in this marriage with him, and from how he has treated me yesterday. So i told them to go ahead with the seuda and I laid down and let him deal with the kids. I heard him yelling / barking orders at them, typical Saadam-Hussein-Style, and then all of a sudden a major commotion out there and a massive Bang followed by a child crying and him storming out of the room. I felt in my heart “oh my g-d he has hit one of them!!!”. (not that its unusual) Just it sounded worse than usual. I sat up in bed, and decided I just got to go see what this is all about. Its like I could “smell” the violence. I saw my daughter standing outside my room, looking wounded emotionally, standing there crying, so I motioned for her to come into my room. I asked her what happened. She said Daddy threw me (or my head) into a wall. I looked where she was pointing on her forehead and there was a MASSSIVE bump. White and real big. I felt sick. I felt so helpless to protect her. It later turned bluish green now.

    IT brought back memories of 7 yrs ago he did this to my older daughter for talking on the phone to a friend he had said she couldnt talk to, then he changed his mind that she could, so he caught her doing something he had given permission to do, and then gone and taken the phone out of her hand and slammed in on her head leaving a wallop of an egg sized bump in blue and green color.

    So now I hugged this little one tight and broke down shaking and crying with her. He appeared angrily at my bedroom door and shouted “What is this?”. “What did she say”?” So I said look what you did to her. I ( had asked he what happened. and she told me)He denied it. He said I am putting words in her mouth. She said in front of him, then also, that he had done it, but he kept standing there and in an angry voice intimidating her until she said “well I dont know how it happened. maybe I fell”. ( she is only 6 and became confused obviuosly) Because thats what he kept saying thats how it happened TO HER. I got up and put our coats on. He approached us at the door. “Where are you going”?? he barked. I said “I am going down the road to the Police Station. I will not PROTECT you anymore”. (protect him from being exposed as the abuser, that he is)

    He slammed the door shut with a massive intimidating bang and said no you are not. He admantly kept lying that he did not do that. Its so obvious. In fact, its ridiculous because at one point he said “I had no idea she had fallen off the bed and hit the wall”. I said that not true or else you would have asked her sweety what ever could be wrong when you see she appears in the kitchen holding her head crying.” Or when I showed it to you you would have felt empathy for her bump. You were just defensive and angry.

    Last night, after the children got into pj’s I told them if they were good they’d get a treat of candy. so I gave them the end of a bag with a few pieces. Suddenly he was running into my room, at me angry, and I just stood up to him and said “What are you angry at me for now”? And he said “that one is already so fat/chubby how can you feed her candy?” So i said its already a tradition that on friday nights we give a treat, and its only a bit. So he stormed out of the room and went up to that child on the couch, violently grabbing the poor little girl who had been sitting there peacefully in her cute pj’s, and grabbing her by the arm whipped her off the couch screaming ITS BEDTIME NOW.

    She was shocked. She had no idea what she was doing wrong. Why her father was doing that. She started crying.

    I had to intervene and tell him to behave again. I really hate how he is treating us and not even being self reflective, or honest enough to admit he was wrong and will ammend. The kids are always biting and screaming and fighting in this unhealthy house where I am losing my temper and them and him, and he is losing it on them and me, and they are losing it on each other. There is no peace in our house.

    So I thought and thought all day what am I going to do wtih my life? I told him to leave the house or I will leave. BUt i have no where to go. Literally. Except a shelter? I dont know how I even have the courage to post this shameful story but i am seriously desperate, and hopefully fully anonymous in this CR.

    He doesnt want to leave. He is adament that we can work it out. However I am past the snapping line. I have zero interest, and not just because of this one incident. We are talking here about a highly controlling character in all fields of life.

    What do I do? If i expose him, he is finished in life, and the community. Our family is finished. We/he will be farshamed.

    I feel like i have to just silently push him out, b’shalom. Without taking action about the physical abuse? Or was it abuse? Maybe its always just a “one time incident of losing his temper”?

    Or should I give him another chance since it seems to me that he is suffering from depression, and could possibly still get treatment and we keep the family together?

    #842243

    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    PLEASE LEAVE! Go to a shelter or just go to the rebbitzen of your shul. Or go into your neighbors house with your kids and call the rebbitzen from there. He will sweet talk you into believing it wont happen, or threaten you into it, or convince you it didn’t. But for your sake and the future spouses of your kids (and themselves) please leave WITH them and call someone.

    #842244

    soliek
    Member

    oh it be over. for your own sake and the sake of the kids go to the cops–after getting the heck out of there with them. seriously if you have evidence of abuse against him, take them and run. an abusive spouse/parent never gets over it, and never gets better.

    #842245

    maah
    Member

    1) this is the wrong forum for your question

    2) speak to a rav you both trust, quickly!!!

    3) if you’re at your breaking point beg him to get help, he will resist and say there is nothing wrong with him, tell him, that might be true, but it’s help or goodbye

    4) as far as worrying where to go, shelter etc.. if you decide to leave and need help, i can get you a job, where you will be able to afford an apartment, food, etc… i can be contacted via the mods

    #842246

    Harotzehbilumshmo
    Participant

    This is insane. Not one of us know the details or external situation. I agree with everyone that you must run,immediatly and as fast as you can, but only to a responsible Rov or the like. Someone with experience. Wittout so you can possible make a huge and irreversible mistake. Please, call that person now.

    #842247

    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    And call us when you get there – we want to be with you and tell you things will get better. Yes, toppling the applecart doesn’t SOUND better, but think about it. Can it really be worse?

    #842248

    BaalSechel
    Participant

    It sounds like you need advice from someone who has his head screwed on really straight, preferably someone who knows you/ your family. Is there a family Rav? Is he a person with Sechel (not everyone who has the title “Rabbi” is necessarily a Ba’al Eitza, but an awfully lot of them are Ba’alei Eitza). You can arrange to speak to him while your husband is out at work. Even if you have no family Rav, every city has prominent Rabbonim with much life’s experience that you can speak to. Which city are you from? (only answer this last question if there are thousands of frum Yidden in your city, to protect your identity)

    #842249

    Get out NOW.

    Get away from him NOW.

    This is potentially dangerous abuse.

    I have seen this type of thing with family and friends; there may be treatment, counseling and reconciliation in the future, but right now it’s dangerous, both for yourself and your children.

    There are people and agencies who help frum people. I’m sorry I don’t know of any firsthand; hopefully other posters can make suggestions.

    #842250

    maah
    Member

    one more thing ignore ALL bad advice here!!!

    the cops at this point is not the right option, neither is just getting up and leaving (you can lose your kids for abandoning them)

    PLEASE don’t listen to advice here, speak to a rav you both trust or is very familiar with shalom bayis

    #842251

    shuli
    Participant

    wow, always, your story is very, very sad and terrible. i am sincerley sorry and i hope everything works out for you this is not a situation where he is just losing his temper, and you should NOT be afraid to do something. this is WRONG, and you have to tell someone. be it your rabbi/rebbetzin/good friend, whoever etc. and get some help.

    #842252

    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    The advice to leave said to take her kids with her.

    #842253

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    Wow, that is very brave of you to post that.

    I agree with the others here; it sounds like you need to leave.

    I think you should call shalom task force- I’m guessing they will have information for what you should do next, and good lawyers to speak to.

    Their numbers are 888-883-2323; 718-337-3700. Please call tonight.

    #842254

    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    I agree with pba

    Shalom task force is great

    #842255

    aries2756
    Participant

    I don’t know where you live. If you are here in the states, you should go to the court and get an Order of Protection against your Husband to protect yourself and your children from harm. That is the first step. When your hubby sees that you are serious he will have to take it seriously as well and either give up on having a family or do whatever is necessary to keep you. That means he will either agree to go for therapy on his own or be court ordered into therapy. In the mean time he will be removed from the home and you can establish some peace there. You told us that you recently had a baby and had post-partum depression. It is really important that you protect your children especially the infant who is helpless and that YOU yourself get therapy and support that you desperately need at this very difficult time.

    Unfortunately, due this terrible abuse you are really not capable of making appropriate decisions for yourself and your kids and because you want things to be normal you wish them to be so and believe them to be at quiet times. Otherwise you would not have brought another innocent neshoma into thies horrific environment. Each day that you don’t do something positive to protect your children you are subjecting them to YOUR life in the future. You are almost promising them this same marriage for them in the future because they won’t know that they deserve better.

    Please understand that you DON’T deserve this, no one does. YOU are not RESPONSIBLE for your husband’s illness nor actions. He and he alone is responsible and accountable and it is HE who must step up to the plate and do whatever is necessary to make it better. If he chooses not to, then you must make the very difficult decision to remove yourself and your children from harm. The easiest way to do that is to remove him from the home.

    #842256

    devrachel
    Member

    Hugs!! sounds like he is a time bomb and in a really bad place! B’H your child is fine. …but consider it a FREE ONE TIME PASS, time to step it up , get help and get the kids TO SAFETY FAST. take a picture of this injury . CALL SHALOM TASK FORCE !

    head injuries are no joke , you could be holding a dead child right now ! has v chalila lo aleinu. All the best and may Hashem grant you wisdom and strength to protect your precious children.

    #842257

    the.nurse
    Member

    To those who say maybe he’s just depressed -it is NOT ok for him to hit his kids that way that leave those type of marks. It is NEVER ok to do that. And the OP wrote that this is not the first time.

    OP -I feel terrible for you, but YOU are the one that has the power to protect your children from physical abuse. Your kids are just children and they are relying on their mommy to help them. Your kids do not deserve to be treated this way. I don’t know if they will forgive you down the road if you did not do your all to help them.

    I think you should take pba’s advice and call the Shalom task force ASAP. I’m not saying something can never be worked out, but maybe your husband needs a really strong reality check, such as you taking the kids & leaving -at least temporarily & seeing if he is willing to go to therapy.

    Another thing is if you have a Rav that you trust (not necessarily your husbands Rav) I would call him as well and speak to him about the situation.

    Hatzlocha

    #842258

    i have tears in my eyes, as i read all your kind responses. but i know i probablly wont do anything.

    He is now gone into over drive of “super sweet helpful tatty mode”.

    And I feel like its all almost my fault, that “I made him get so upset as to have to take out his frustration on the kids”.

    I am seriuosly confused.

    #842259

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    It is definitely not your fault; you didn’t do anything wrong to have fault for.

    Please call tonight. At least just to discuss it with them.

    #842260

    the.nurse
    Member

    OP

    Here is what I found online:

    “Recognizing Abuse

    It may sound strange, but people sometimes have trouble recognizing that they are being abused. Recognizing abuse may be especially difficult for someone who has lived with it for many years. A person might think that it’s just the way things are and that there’s nothing that can be done. People who are abused might mistakenly think that it’s their fault for not doing what their parents tell them, breaking rules, or not living up to someone’s expectations.

    Growing up in a family where there is violence or abuse can make a person think that is the right way or the only way for family members to treat each other. Somebody who has only known an abusive relationship might mistakenly think that hitting, beating, pushing, shoving, or angry name-calling are perfectly normal ways to treat someone when you’re mad.

    Seeing parents treat each other in abusive ways might lead a child to think that’s OK in relationships. But abuse is not a typical or healthy way to treat people.”

    Please, please do something about this, OP. Your children do not deserve to live a life filled with terror, not knowing when their Tatty will snap.

    #842261

    mosygold
    Member

    Please do SOMETHING! Shalom task force, your Rav, PLEASE!!!

    #842262

    And unfortunately, I am just as “snappy”. I grew up in an abusive home. Never mind. Ok, I am going to call shalom task force to see what I should do. But i really have NO WHERE IN THIS WORLD TO GO. Do you understand. NOT A SINGLE PLACE.

    That is because I am a baalas teshuva who cut off from her mother and family years and years ago, and they are not material I want myself or children around, nor do I have “Friends” from those days, unless you consider bleeding heart liberals who are goyim as friends. And I have no money. I’d have to get on a Greyhound to Los Angelos and beg in the streets with all my kids playing harmonica around me for bread.

    #842263

    mom12
    Participant

    Forget the zoloft!

    Take B-complex.. It helped me thru postpartum depression and other bouts of depression, and a few friends I recommended it to.

    B-complex will also help you think straight and have the strength.

    If its really bad there is lithium oratate to help ones brain fluids to adjus, so u think and react properly..

    I also have a spouse with a Jeckyl-Hyde personality.. the name of the game is save the kids. It may be wrong, but I am always sticking up for them in front of him.. and I do hope I am anonymus here as well.. If its possible you shoul take them all for therapy on how to deal with this kind of father.. I have a lot more to say, it would probably take up a page..HAZLACHA RABBA

    #842264

    mom12
    Participant

    Dont know where u are located but maybe a bikur cholimin your neighborhood can help

    #842265

    mom12 please do say a whole lot more, as you said you could, even if it takes a whole page! i am listening.

    #842266

    frumeyid
    Participant

    Always,

    Please call Shalom Task force. Calling does not mean you committed to doing anything. Just call, and have a conversation. That’s all. Please come back and let us know that you spoke to them. We all care.

    #842267

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    And unfortunately, I am just as “snappy”.

    I hope that doesn’t mean physically abusive.

    #842268

    wanderingchana
    Participant

    Always runs…. PLEASE call Shalom Task Force!!! Call your rebbetzin… get yourself and your kids away from him… please!!

    #842269

    shuli
    Participant

    i second the motion.u MUST do something. you cannot let your husband, who u must admit is abusve, abuse your kids. call shalom task force, or your rav….just get yourself away from him!

    #842270

    I feel really bad reading all these comments, encouraging me to get away with the kids from him. He is really a very sweet kind person when he is his usual self.

    I also feel bad to “take action” against him because he has had such a hard life, and needs my help as a wife, and needs a base as a home and his family/kids. He could /chas v’shalom have a heart attack if I punish him with a break up. It would very much stress him out.

    Although I truly hate the way he interacts with the kids. I am not allowed to be nice or good to them. No toys. No outings. NO spending money. No bikes. When I do- then he just snorts. I have to buy little things from the dollar store and encourage him to “give” on chanuka or on a “family night”.

    If i get a gift of a beautiful royal table cloth from a friend, he calls it garbage and wants it thrown in garbage, because its too luxis. He hates luxeries. So when I say we need a new couch you can forget it. I am suppose to be the only lady on the block who is so heilige with the dirt all over mine.

    He threatens to divorce me if I take zoloft for depression.

    He threatened me last night to remove the children from my home if I feed them too big a supper portion. (causes obesity).

    I am sick of being controlled.

    #842271

    msseeker
    Member

    If you never tried therapy and he’s willing to try now, don’t break your home before you do.

    #842272

    by the way, i dont have a rebbetzin. I have plenty of rebbetzins living in the shtetle, whom I love, adore and respect, but who calls them for these things?

    #842273

    farrockgrandma
    Participant

    I went through years of denial, believing all of the abject apologies. But my children were never harmed, at least not directly.

    Face it, he is not going to change. Your children, and you yourself, can be permanently damaged. My husband, in an angry moment, yelled and shoved over the living room couch, barely missing the 4 year old child sitting nearby on the floor. Her reaction – later that day she said to me “when I grow up, I am going to be a good wife and listen to my husband”. That was an ‘ah-hah’ moment. (By the way, she is now grown up and married, and not afraid to express her feelings.)

    You can call the Shalom Task Force to discuss your situation. No one will force you to leave, but they can help you to sort things out. You can speak to them anonymously. You can pack an overnight bag with supplies for you and your family, and leave it with a friend. You are stronger than you think. Airing your problem on this forum is a first step. Take the next step, even a small one, and you will find the strength to go on.

    The hardest part is making the decision. In my case, I asked my husband to leave and move out, and he did. It was many years ago, and I have never, never, regretted it. He yelled so many mean things when he was angry, I was embarrassed and humiliated, I thought anyone within earshot would believe those terrible things. What I remember, and what gave me chizuk in the weeks and months afterward, was my neighbors telling me how happy they were that he was gone, and people telling me how much younger I looked – like a great weight had been lifted from my shoulders.

    #842274

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    I feel really bad reading all these comments, encouraging me to get away with the kids from him. He is really a very sweet kind person when he is his usual self.

    it’s the times that he’s not “his usual self” that are dangerous. So speak to Shalom Task force and ask them if it’s salvageable. If you don’t do the responsible thing, you will be responsible for anything bad which chas v’shalom happens to the children, even if at other times he’s sweet.

    #842275

    always runs with scissors fast-

    Forgive me for saying this, but you fit the typical profile of an abuse victim.

    You are making excuses for him – “He is really a very sweet kind person when he is his usual self… I also feel bad to “take action” against him because he has had such a hard life, and needs my help as a wife, and needs a base as a home and his family/kids. He could /chas v’shalom have a heart attack if I punish him with a break up. It would very much stress him out.” – and thinking that things can be worked out.

    I asked “Mrs. Try” to read this thread to see if she agreed with me.

    Her response: “She needs to get out before she or one of the kids ends up dead (c’v)”.

    We’ve seen abused wives, and this advice is based on friends and family members who went thru this.

    At the very minimum, please follow the advice given by several others here and call the numbers “poppa_bar_aba” gave – don’t delay and don’t make excuses. Your kids need your protection.

    #842276

    ChanieE
    Participant

    I wish you and your family hatzlacha!!!

    #842277

    Sam2
    Participant

    You don’t have to end the marriage or anything like that immediately. If he wants to go through counseling and maybe medications then maybe you can keep your family together, especially if he usually is as nice as you say he sometimes is. However, until then you need to find somewhere to go. It can be an acquaintance, a distant relative, or maybe even your estranged family, depending on your circumstance. But you can’t stay where you are now. I was once told that if a wife or child is ever beaten, it is assumed to be Pikuach Nefesh immediately and that you have to call the police even on Shabbos. I don’t know if I would Pasken the same, but this is a serious issue. You have to do something. It’s not in any way your fault, but leaving yourself and your children in an abusive situation is something you cannot do. Being too scared or too worried and doing nothing will only hurt yourself and your kids even more.

    #842278

    smartcookie
    Member

    Call shalom task force, and if they’ll advise you to leave, they’ll help you out from there.

    Always runs- maybe you already do, but you should post/read the imamother.com forum.

    So many women share their experiences and challenges. it’s a real social outlet.

    #842279
    #842280

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    If you’re asking why you have to leave, it’s so that nobody ends up in the hospital. But call first, and follow their suggestion.

    #842281

    frumeyid
    Participant

    Always,

    Right now you need to call Shalom Task Force. Just because you agree to call does not mean you have to leave etc. You can hear what they have to say and make your own decision. But please, please do make that phone call. Many of us have seen similar situations and are speaking from experience, and yours fits a pattern. Please tell us that you will call. We all care.

    #842282

    oomis
    Participant

    Always Runs – Honey, please listen to the seichel you are being given here. Your husband does not sound like the sweet man you think he sometimes is. He may be emotionally disturbed, he may have anger management issues, I really don’t care. HE HURT YOUR CHILDREN. The first time that happened, you should have grabbed them and gone ANYWHERE to go away. Your little one who was just injured by him could have had a concussion from being slammed into the wall. Personally, I don’t believe a Rov can help in this case. Your husband is an abuser, and unless you want your daughters to grow up to marry a man just like him, you need to make some really painful and tough decisions. Shalom Task Force CAN help you. Please don’t waste any more time in contacting them. I don’t care EVEN IF YOU PROVOKED HIM. There is no excuse for throwing a child into the wall EVER!!!!!!!!!

    And btw, even if he goes for therapy, he has to demonstrate that he has really changed for good, before it is even shayach to think about being back with him. Most abusive men are always abusive. They don’t change, or they “change” until the next time something or someone ticks them off (and it does not take much). Do you want to end up in the hospital or worse – burying a child G-d forbid? It sounds like you could have come pretty close.

    People have given you sound advice here. It takes courage to recognize you have to take a drastic first step, but if you don’t you will always regret it. Call Shalom Task Force. Now. Please.

    #842283

    amichai
    Participant

    please listen to the other posters and call asap/ to that helpline. as they wrote, even just to speak. you should not be alone in that situation. you must protect your children from him. I am sure they do have shelters for families, and will help financially. . that is not the way to live your life ,in fear, you are not at fault at all for his problems.

    #842284

    From the top of the “Shalom Task Force” web page:

    “STF HOTLINE STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL AND NO CALLER ID

    1 888 883 2323 (718 337 3700)”

    You will not be giving away anything (such as who you are) by simply calling and talking with them.

    You will not be taking any irrevocable step if you call.

    Your husband may be a decent guy who just needs help – we don’t know him or you.

    Regardless of the reason for the situation you and your kids are now in though, you do need to take steps for safety’s sake.

    Please call now.

    #842285

    1st timer
    Participant

    Please listen to everyone’s advise. Call immediately, dont think twice about it, just do it. Make the phonecall now! Hatzlocha

    #842286

    Feif Un
    Participant

    I just saw this thread, and I must say, this is a textbook case of abuse. Really, you need to do something about it. Call someone, whether it’s Shalom task force, the police, or a Rav that you trust. Even if only so there’s a record of it in case God forbid things get worse – it’s better if you can prove things were going on already.

    His being super-sweet after is typical of abusers. They try to make up for it. The same goes for your feelings of guilt – it happens very often. I understand if you’re hesitant, and if it were only you, I’d be more sympathetic. But please, for the sake of your children, do something! Don’t subject them to this. It will mess them up for life. Get help NOW.

    #842287

    cinderella
    Member

    Always- I just read this thread and I am crying for you. You really need to do something. NOW. Don’t feel threatened by him. Don’t let him intimidate you into staying with him and not getting help. You can do it. I’m going to daven for you and I really hope that you got the strength to call. Let us know.

    #842288

    Think first
    Member

    I feel terrible about your plight. You must call Shalom task force. I know ur afraid of changing ur current situation like you mentioned “I have nowhere to go” if needed they will work things out for you. They’re purpose is not to seperate the family and create divorce their mission is helping women who are living through hell like you are. They will guide you step by step. I can hear the pain in your words and I promise you, you have only to gain for yourself, yes ur husband and ur dear children by calling them. Please make the call and let us know that u did. Ur life CAN and WILL get better if you do.

    #842289

    mosygold
    Member

    Did you call yet?

    #842290

    shomershabbat
    Participant

    If you are a caring, responsible mother to your children, you would put their physical and emotional safety first. Even though you feel bad (for your husband) to expose his abusive behavior towards you and your children, you excuse your silence for “the benefit” of your marriage. Where do the kids come into the picture? They are no less important than you are. If they are minors, they are reyling on you for their physical and emotional well-being. Staying silent is paramount to “AL Taamod Al Dam Raecha”. Years down the road, it will only be detructive to the family as a whole. Things will not get better on their own. Seeking help NOW will save your life and the lives of your children. I hope you have the courage to make the right decision.

    #842292

    no, i didnt. Its not going to help. But as soon as he goes to bed in a few minutes I will. BUt it wont help. BUt I’ll do it.

    I want everyone to understand he has never hit me. But he’s rough on the kids cause they get on his nerves because he has a tremendous amount of life pressure that is unique to most ppl. Its no excuse but thats it. He is just not the father/husband I hoped for. I sometimes fall asleep shabbos afternoon and have these beautiful exotique sweet dreams we’re sitting on the sand watching the kids play with buckets and shovels at the shore, and we’re drinking tea we’ve brought in a flask, in silence, in pure contentedness watching the sunset, the clouds, the waves, the birds. But he will never allow himself to pick up and just go with it, and give me the time of my life by a picnic or outing that way. I wake up from these dreams so sad.

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