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No one buys Yerushalayim or Mearas Hamachpeilah – they are already ours and we don’t have to buy them and we are not selling them!!! “Yerushalayim is not for sale!””
Mearas Hamachpeilah was bought at one point (by Avraham Avinu) but we don’t have to buy it anymore.
Yerushalayim? no, but you’re on the right track….
So far Mearas Hamachpeilah and Yerushalayim are the closest guesses…it’s kind of a cross of the two in a manner of speaking
JF2: “Yes. They should also learn parsha, Chumash, and Nach on a regular basis.”
They don’t have to learn Parsha, Chumash and Nach (although they can if they want to, and they are fulfilling a Mitzvah when they do, and it’s certainly a better use of one’s time than many other things people do!), but they have an absolute CHIYUV to learn Halacha and Mussar.
Health: “karlbenmarx -“you should quit, this is a very dangerous situation. The One Above will provide, the yetzer hara is telling you to stay and saying you need the money.”
The decision what to do in this situation, should be made by her parents, mentors, and Rabbis.
Not by some anonymous posters!”
True, but if she is asking online, obviously, she doesn’t have someone reliable to ask, so we have a responsibility to “Al Taamod al dam raecha”.
Many 17 year old girls do not have anyone they feel comfortable asking questions to, and even when they do, the person may not be reliable. But if she can find a reliable Gadol or Rav who is accessible to ask, that would be the best of course!
An atheist is someone who is sure that there is no G-d (or any kind of god, lhavdil). An agnostic is someone who isn’t sure if there is a G-d.
That’s why some say it’s impossible to be an atheist – because how can you be sure that G-d doesn’t exist?
Here’s a joke: Did you hear what happened to the dyslexic insomniac agnostic?
20 questions and no one got it!!! I won!!!!!
Picture Perfect comes the closest!!!!!
Even though it’s after 20 questions, let’s see if anyone can get it
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
14. Is it a Chumash or Siddur? no.
15. Is it a country? no but you’re on the right track….
16. Is it the Kosel? no
17. Is it the Bais Hamikdash? no.
18. Is it a structure? no
19. Is it a geographical location? YES!
20. Meoras Hamachpeilah – no, but you’re very very close!!!!
Sparkly – I posted before your post came on, so I didn’t see it. Since the posts don’t show up as soon as someone posts, sometimes person A can post before person B, but person B can’t see person A’s post yet.
Basically, I just saw your post now, but 29 already answered anyhow.
Sounds good to me! Leilah Tov!
Sparkly – she said it’s a michshol – that means a “stumbling-block”, meaning she is concerned that you might stop being shomer if you go out with a guy who is not! That is the whole issue -she does NOT think you should stop being shomer -that is the point!!!
So we now know that it is a geographical location that should be specific to the Jews.
No, it’s not what you are thinking, but you are on the right track…
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
14. Is it a Chumash or Siddur? no.
15. Is it a country? no but you’re on the right track….
16. Is it the Kosel? no
17. Is it the Bais Hamikdash? no.
18. Is it a structure? no
19. Is it a geographical location? YES!
19. Is it a geographical location? What do you mean – do you mean is it a place like a Country, Lake, City, Street, etc?
I’m going to sleep now, so you all have app. 7 or 8 hours to figure out what IT is.
Leilah Tov!
29- when do you sleep?
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
14. Is it a Chumash or Siddur? no.
15. Is it a country? no but you’re on the right track….
16. Is it the Kosel? no
17. Is it the Bais Hamikdash? no.
18. Is it a structure? no
lol. I’m on a funny schedule right now, but I am going to sleep soon.
The reason I’m on the Coffee room so much the past few days is probably because I haven’t been sleeping and need something to keep me up.
Member
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
14. Is it a Chumash or Siddur? no.
15. Is it a country? no but you’re on the right track….
16. Is it the Kosel? no
17. Is it the Bais Hamikdash? no.
Sparkly, what do you mean, “is it towards a direction?”
Only 3 more questions – Use them wisely. Ask some general questions instead of specific ones. I don’t think you’ll get it just yet unless you ask one or two general questions. It’s unlikely anyone will get it yet otherwise.
Sparkly – I’m sure that there are things that have gotten past them. It’s hard to monitor %100, especially since hilchos lashon hara can be very complicated, and on such a site, where the purpose is discussing issues in the Frum world, it can be very difficult to differentiate b/w LH and non-LH.
Bottom line, everyone has to take achrayus and not leave things up to the moderators.
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
14. Is it a Chumash or Siddur? no.
15. Is it a country? no but you’re on the right track……
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
14. Is it a Chumash or Siddur? no.
Hint #1: Har Habayis was very close.
Hint #2: Try asking a general question.
Nu everyone? It’s really close! Who’s going to get it? We need a few general questions and then you should get it. I think that you guys should be able to get it in another 4-6 questions!
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
13. Is it Har Habayis?
No, but that was a good guess, Showjoe – we’re getting much warmer…..
Maybe try asking a more general question.
Nu? Anymore questions? It’s a hard one, but we are getting warmer….
It should be specific for Jews and it is not bought anymore (ie: it was once bought), it is bigger than a shoebox, tangible but you don’t hold it when you use it, it is kind of of a religious nature… nu? any guesses.
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
12. Is it of a religious nature? That’s a hard question to answer, but I would say, “yes”.
Nu? Nu? Any guesses or questions? Sparkly? YW Moderator – 29? Anyone else?
lightbrite: thanks! good to know I accomplished s/t by being in the CR.
It is definitely true that there are healing benefits of discussing things with others (although one should try to fulfill the conditions of the Chafetz Chaim as much as possible by speaking to someone who will listen w/o passing judgment on the other person or adding L”H,etc.), and in those situation, it is muttar. However, when someone posts things online for the whole world to see, I don’t think there is any heter.
Additionally, something that might be muttar in ordinary circumstances might be assur online due to the fact that you have such a wide range of possible “listeners.” Something that might be okay when said to someone who shares your worldview and understands what you mean might become L”H if someone might be reading it who might understand it differently and negatively.
It is always important to remember that not-religious Jews and non-Jews might be reading what we write and might understand something differently than the way we meant it.
In terms of your previous posts, maybe you can ask the moderator to delete if you think there may be a LH issue. Kidai to ask. Definitely a big zchus for Am Yisrael during the Nine Days if it really can be done!!!
Nu?
lesschumrahs – please reread what I wrote. I didn’t say that it didn’t happen My point was that the OTD of today is a specific phenomenon that started around 20 years or so years ago. There may have been other times and places where there may have been a lot of people going OTD for different reasons and in different ways. When people write and speak about kids going off the derech, they are speaking about something that has been happening in the US and Israel for the past 20 years. There may have been others (maybe even a lot of others) who went OTD in other generations and places, but that is not what they are speaking about. Every generation is different and has its own issues.
In each generation, when people went off, it was for different reasons and in different amounts. In Europe, I think it was the Enlightenment and Reform, etc. In Israel, it was the Zionists. When people came to the US in the 1800’s and first half of 1900’s, it was because of a lack of Yeshiva Education and Frum infrastructure. Nowadays, it ‘s not for any of those reasons, so educators have to figure out why.
btw, this is a side issue, but I am not a baki in history, but my impression is that for most of the years when we were based in Europe (at least up unti the 1800’s approximately), the numbers of people going OTD were much smaller than today. Even if that is not the case, it has nothing to do with what I wrote.
btw everyone, my answer to questions 8 and 11 is a good clue. Hint: NOT ANYMORE and IT SHOULD BE (specific to Jews)
Anyone else out there want to try their hands at guessing?
10. You don’t hold it when you use it
11. Do people buy it to use it? not anymore.
Joseph – good point.
Nu?
Nu? Anyone else want to ask any questions? The only really good clue we have so far is that it should be specific to Jews. Anyone want to narrow it down?
Miamilawyer – it is true that most people who call themselves Conservative and Reform probably do not really believe in Conservative or Reform philosophy, but then they are not really Conservative or Reform. The things that Joseph and myself were saying were about people who are Conservative or Reform, not those who call themselves Conservative or Reform.
In any case, even if they are not apikorsum, it is still a problem that they affiliate with a movement that is, and we certainly are not allowed to encourage them to do so. It is great that they do some Mitzvos, but it would be better if they did those Mitzvos w/o identifying as Conservative or Reform. The Chilonim in Israel keep many Mitzvos but don’t identify as conservative or reform. I am not judging the people – obviously, they don’t know better, and it is wonderful that they are trying to do what they can. I am just stating what objectively would be better and should be encouraged if possible. Certainly, as Orthodox Jews, we have to be very careful not to say or do anything that appears as though we are giving legitimacy to the conservative or reform movements, while at the same time respecting the individual people for trying to do what they can.
I just read in my psychology textbook that even when adolescents reject their family’s values, they often come back to them in the end (and this was talking about Goyim who don’t have Toras Emes like we do.
OTD has always existed to some extent, but there is a specific plague today of OTD. Most of these kids need psychological help and when/if they work on that, they do come back. Of course, it is not always easy for them to get the help they need, since it is not a simple thing, and unfortunately, many of them OD meanwhile. But the point is that most do want to come back and if their issues are worked out, do come back. No sane person would leave Yiddishkeit by choice!!! We are so lucky to have the Torah and anyone who leaves it has some kind of issue that needs worked out.
Sparkly – 1. If they have filters, then that’s called having internet.
2. If it’s a more modern place, then they are not Yeshivish. I was talking about Yeshivish people. It doesn’t make sense to compare the Yeshivish people in EY to the non-Yeshivish people in the US. The point is that the Yeshivish people in the US are similar to the Yeshivish people in EY
1. It is not alive.
2. It does not move.
3.It is not a common household object.
4. It is tangible.
5. It can’t fit in a shoebox.
6. It’s ok if it gets wet.
7. Using it does not require skill.
8. Is it specific to Jews? It should be.
9. It is not an instrument.
8. Does using it require skill? no, but maybe courage.
Nu?
Zahavasdad- I didn’t say that OTD is 20 years old- I said that the OTD phenomenon of today is approximately 20 years old. There have always been some Jews who have gone off, but there is a specific plague today that there are an unusually large number, as many experts in the field and leaders in Am Yisrael have written and spoken about.
Nu? Any more questions anyone?
7. Yes, it’s okay if it gets wet
7. Can it get wet? yes (what can’t get wet?)
5. Can it fit in a shoebox? no
Sparkly – most means more than half, so even if Joseph is right that most OTD’s come back, there might still be many that don’t.
Also, I assume that Joseph is referring to people who are now in their teens and 20’s. People in their 40’s were from a different generation (that was before OTD became “a thing”) so things might have been different, and the reasons why people went off and whether or not they came back might have been different.
The whole kids-at-risk/OTD phenomenon of today only started app. 20 years ago or less, so most of the kids who were part of that phenomenon are now 30-35 at the most.
In any case, I think it’s true that a lot come back but I don’t know if it’s most or not. It is probably a much larger percentage than the percentage of not-Frum people who end up becoming bt’s which is a comforting thought. It means that their education was not a waste! And that whatever complaints people might have about the Yeshiva system, it’s doing a very good job, since even those who go off (which is a minority to begin with) are more likely to end up Frum than people who do not have a Yeshiva education.
1. It is not alive
2. It does not move
3. It is not a common household object
4. Is it tangible/physical? yes
2. It doesn’t move 3. It is not a common household object
No (although I almost feel bad saying that!)
Now, it’s my turn. I am thinking of something very hard (I mean hard to figure out)