Proposed Solution to the Arab-Zionist Conflict: Non-Denominational State

yankel> ujm’s proposal to ‘give’ EY to the US , is a total non starter

maybe not whole EY, just Gaza and part of PA? US can have a territory without giving it citizenship (state status) until they develop institutions and Congress (Senate?) accept them. This is how except first 13 states joined.

Okay I went and did it. And you’ll still find a way to call me a narrow minded person parroting what the media feeds me. My friend I ask you have you ever even questioned the realities fed to you from birth?

Anyway here you go. For you, or anyone else reading. May there be peace on this world very soon and the end of genocide done in our name and otherwise.

1] how many innocent german children died in world war two ?
was that genocide ?
if not , why not ?

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Well 1st off are you considering the German Jewish children who were genocided as “germans”?
if so, many were, not sure the number but the Nazis genocided many german children from jewish families

if your asking about non-jewish german children, i would imagine there are many who died, but not neccesarily from genocide neccesarily.
of course other groups in germany were genocided beyond just the Jews in WWII, Romani, Disabled,
and while not exactly by UN definition genocide, we can throw in there Gay and communist germans were specifically targeted for their identities and beliefs.

Genocide definition (UN 1948): Intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group.

if your talking about the “german children” who died at the hands of the Allies, these were more casulties of war than genocide as per definition above.

What differentiates this from genocide is the intent. And this is vital when understanding what is happening in Palestine.
Just because Israel isn’t using the most efficient methods (gas chambers etc.) doesnt mean it isn’t targeted destruction of a people.

Intent from Israeli Government:

– Comments interpreted as comparing Palestinians to “human animals” — language that the commission viewed as dehumanizing and facilitating violence
– Statements by political and military leaders framed in religious or absolute terms, such as invoking the command to destroy Amalek, which can be understood as “total annihalation”
– A letter by a top official to soldiers described in the UN report as stressing a kind of “total annihilation” approach, which the commission treated as an indicator of intent to destroy a group.

Even if there’s no written “genocide plan,” the report argues that the only reasonable inference from a consistent pattern of policies and actions is genocidal intent. This is sometimes referred to in international law as making intent the only plausible explanation for what has happened.

The report highlights these patterns:
– Deliberate deprivation and siege conditions
A long‑term blockade restricting food, water, medicine, fuel and humanitarian access to Gaza, which severely harmed civilians.
– Scale and nature of mass harm
Very high civilian death tolls, including large numbers of children, from repeated bombardments and operations
– Destruction of vital infrastructure
Widespread destruction of homes, hospitals, schools, water systems, and other infrastructure indispensable to civilian survival.
– Measures affecting births
Destruction of reproductive health facilities (such as IVF clinics) and other services that affect the ability of the population to reproduce — which the UN commission treated as potentially fitting one of the Convention’s categories.

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2] given that hamas – and the majority of so called palestinians supported by many millions more outside palestine,
fanatically want israel and its jewish inhabitants to literally disappear from the face of the earth
why do you describe people dying in israel’s defensive wars as dying to ‘make space’ for it ?
why are they not considered as dying to defend their own families existence ?
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In all this, your assumption is that because they want to “wipe us out” that we have a right to self defense.

1st the current populations of Jews in israel were not in need of this “self-defense” from Hamas prior to the establishment of the state of israel.
Were they in danger in their own countries from other threats? Yes many were (and many were only in reaction to the creation of the state, but thats a whole rabbit hole not even neccasary here). Jews being in danger, doesnt mean that the answer was to plop a colonial ethno-nationalist enterprise in the center of the middle east and to displace the indegenous population that is in their weay. The answer could have been (and was for many) to find saftey in countries that will make space for jewish people (ie. the USA where the Jewish people have thrived by almost all measures).

For the small number of Jews that did live in israel continuously, I don’t think the best answer to protect them was too move all of their neighbors and establish a state around them. Many of the indegenous Jews of Palestine, as well as other Jews from the middle east were actually discriminated against by the Zionists. This endevor was certainly not done in the name of their protection.

Also in regards to Hamas and supporters of the Palestine movement wanting to “wipe us all out”

1st off Hamas does not represent the viewpoints of majority of Palestenian.
Secondly, they do not want Israelis to “literally dissapear from the face of the earth” nor do Palestenian supporters across the globe, including myself.
What they want is freedom for their people, and ability to access the land that was horrificly stolen, and to be able to have lives outside of the open air prison set up by the IDF and funded by the US.

Food, housing, healthcare, equal rights on the land.

You’ll say they rejected every peace offer. LOL.
No peace offer since the creation of Israel has included an offer that eliminated Jewish supremacy on Palestenian land.
Israel does not have a “right to exist” if that means that it will be a place where Jews have more rights than non-jews.
No land should have a right to exist that prioritizes one people over another. Particularly if those people are non-natives (or their decendents).
Obviously, Israel is not the only offender in this spce, the US has horrificly stole land and genocided the indegenous people.
The only difference is the activeness of the genocide. The US is NOT currently genociding the Native Americans. That doesn’t excuse the harm, nor erase other forms of current systemic oppression and more subtle violence, but it is in a different category of urgency when compared to what is happening in Palestine right now.

Personally I am arguing for one state one vote with reperations.
would some people need to move to make space yes, but certainly Jewish presence can remain in the region alongside Palestenians and others of all races and religions, with equality for all.

3] why are you blindly parroting the distortions by the biased media ?
why are you ignoring the fanatical armed men hiding in between those innocent children who are the real criminals
who are the ones who have the blood of those children on their hands ?

The real criminals? Blood on their hands? You mean Netanyahu and the IDF? Who are committing genocide.
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You accuse me of parroting, while you literaly parrot the logic of whatever echochambers you live inside of, you are guilty of the same.

What I’ll ask is a perspective shift. Why do we “need” israel to exist to protect the Jewish people. We are currently safe in the US. We are wealthy, succesful, integrated into the culture, government etc. I get that this was the case in Germany that many Jews felt safe. Feeling “more German than Jewish” but that doesnt mean the solution is to have a country.

A potential solution is to educate on genocide, and create an atmosphere of acceptance of all people regardless of race,ethnicity, religion etc. Currently that is not what the Jewish people are doing as a whole. We are teaching Jewish children to hate Arabs (when I am litterally an arab-jew and i am not alone). We are teaching Jewish children to hate Muslims, and overall to look down on Non-Jews and even on Non-religious Jews. For me the hatred towards goyim and non-practicing yiddim is a form of racism and is deeply innaproriate.

Education, love, acceptance, these things stop genocide, not literally doing genocide.

Whatever Hamas does, does not erase the damage the IDF and the Israel project has done, and continues to do.

This is not meant to justify Hamas’ behaviors, but instead to hold the IDF accountable for their behaviors. Claiming this is all just “fighting hamas” without the context of the Nakba and the active oppression of the Palestenian people is missing vital parts of the picture.

IF i removed you and your family and your communitty from their neighborhood, and stuffed you into an open air ghetto, would you not want to fight back? How would you feel if a group of your friends tried to fight back and yes did some awful things in the process, would it be okay if your captors came and murdered you and your childfren for it? Try for a second to imagine how it feels to be removed from your home, your land, and living in an open air prison. This shouldnt be too hard, the Jewish people have exprienced opression throughout their history. The only difference here, is we are on the side of the opressor now. At least in this case. Its quite clear given the history and power differential.

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4] why are those fanatical men not offering the usage of their hundreds of kms of tunnels to those innocent children ?
is it because they are hoping for [!] those innocent children to be blown to bits ?
and hoping for flamingOTD to write heartwrenching ‘humane’ posts about those evil zionists ?


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Are you claiming that it is Hamas’ fault that they arent offering enough places to hide from Israeli missles?
And not blaming the ones shooting the missles. Do you see how your not even considering that Israel holds any culpability in this.
The idea that Hamas wants more Palestenian kids to die to help their cause is a sickening Zionist lie, ironically sounding very much like the “blood libels” used against Jews for millinea.

5] why are you prepared to be the prop and the useful idiot in the hands of those very same criminals
who are the ones who have the blood of the children from their own community on their own hands
and are counting on you to do their bidding ?

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Not sure whos bidding im doing. You are clearly doing zoinist bidding right now. And potentially the bidding of the US imperial war machine.

I do not support religious extremism. That includes religious motivated genocide. That includes the Zionist state. I do support equality and human rights. For all humans. Not just the ones we like and consider “chosen.”
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6] what happens to a jew who walks by himself into most so called ‘nongenocidal’ arab towns in the middle east ?
what happens to an arab who walks by himself into most so called ‘genocidal’ israeli towns in the middle east ?
can you give an honest reality based answer ?
after this answer — with honesty and reality , which side is the real genocidal one ?

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Depends on the town for the Jewish person. Not every “arab town” is anti-semitic (again I am arab so please stop using this as a slur).
Look it certainly not safe to be openly Jewish in many Muslim majority coutnries with Islamic rule embeded in law.
I’m not saying anti-semitism doesnt exist. I’m saying the solution to anti-semitism isn’t the state of israel. its education, care, connection, love. Hate and violence to not create less hate and violence.

You know what isn’t safe? Being a Palestenian in a country with aspects of Torah rule embedded in law.
Hell even in their “own” towns and spaces Palestinains are actively in danger of violence from the IDF.
Just because its governemnt approved and sactioned doesn’t make it okay nor does it erase it from a context of violence.
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7] anywhere between 600000 and two and a half million German civilians died during the 1940’s as a result of the Allies war against Germany .
Is that genocide ? ? ?


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No, as i said it lacks intent. Ironically Israel has a lot more in common with Nazi germany, then the analogy your trying to make… Israeli deaths at the hands of the Palestenians are not neccesarily genocide.

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8] do you recognize the established fact that …. there are arab ministers , supreme court judges and MK’s in israel ?
so why do you repeat the lie that israel is racist ?

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We can have a black president, and black billionaires that doesnt erase systemic racism in the US.
If anything it can serve to enable these systems “see we are equal”
when for the majorities this isn’t true.

Like saying theres a chance people can get rich if they play the lottery.

In plain terms, Israel is a state that prioritizes Jewish life over others. That is ethnist/racist.

And historically it has treated its arab jewish population awfully, and these sentiments still do live in the country even in subtle discrimination against sephardis in the frum world, but certainly on larger scales as well.

This is not unique to Israel. The US is horrific in terms of actual living its supposed values of equality.
What is unique to Israel is the law that prioritzes Jewish people.
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9] do you recognize the established fact that jews come from all diverse ‘races’ . brown, white, black and yellow ?
so why do you repeat the lie that israel is racist ?

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The initial european Zionist settlers certainly were racist, considering arab Jews “bad human material”
As I mentioned these seeds of racism certainly still live in the culture.

Beyond that the word can be tricky to name given Judaism is both a religion and an ethnicity and maybe even a race is complex.
But it clearly prioritizes Jewish life over Non-jewish. And certainly discriminates against Palestenian ethnicity.
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10] considering the context of hamas hiding behind civilians coupled with international denial of civilians the natural and essential option
of running away
why do the Arab and leftist hypocrites who block their escape not have their innocent blood on their own hands ???


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The surrounding arab nations do have blood on their hands
I think their decisions are heavily influenced by geo-politics, including fear of Israel/US retaliation.

Wether or not Hamas existed, Israel would still be attempting to expand its borders and take more land away from the Palestinian people and create a country that actively erases their indegenous connection to the land, and creates discriminatory laws that prioritize non-natives (Jewish settlers) over the actual people native to the land and desperately in need of that access to land. (the fact that I as a US citizen have such easy access to citizenship and land in israel is deeply sickening considering just how safe I am here, and just how desperately the need for that access is for palestenians.

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11] Were the majority of deaths civilian in the invasion of Iraq ??
Were the majority of deaths civilian in the War in Afghanistan ??

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I do not condone the US invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. What the US has done (and continues to do) is horrific. The US has funded this current genocide in Palestine. I blame them more than the israeli governemnt, more than the IDF honestly. I believe we are acting as a puppet for the US. At best we have mutual interest, and even in this lens the US is a horrific enabler of the genocide.
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12] Why is the fact that the vast majority of deaths in gaza are civilian , any proof that israel does not target terrorists ??
is it not possible that civilians are killed because of hamas hiding and mingling with them ???
do you have real proof that this is not the case ??
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The names of the children i mentioned were not terrorists target casualities. These were people mistaken for dangers based on their ethnicity and murdered. Not unlike what happens in the US. The difference here is not just based on the side-effect casulties of Israel targeting terrorists. Its on the system of harm that has created and continues to sustain this situation. Israel existing as a state that prioritizes Jewish lif is actively oppresive towards anyone else who would try to live in that land. That would already be bad, what makes it a crime is that people that used to live in that space most recently were displaced, and opressed for generations.

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13] Why does hamas not give shelter to civilians in their many hundreds kms long tunnels ???
could it be that civilian casualties is a desired outcome for them ???

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You already asked this. I can’t imagine these tunnels would be much safer. And none of this takes away the blame from the IDF for sending the missles.
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14] if many millions of people would support nazism , would you fall in line , simply because that would be “the perspective of the world” at the time ????
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I am not supporting the perspective of the world. If anything the powers at be support Israel.
I make my decisions on ethics and values. I was raised deeply zionist. I spent much time deconstructing this belief system.
If anyone is the puppet parroting beliefs they are too tied to it is you.

Question for you…
Have you ever even questioned the beliefs you were raised with?
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15] compare arab population growth in palestine from 1860 – 1940 with arab population growth in syria , jordan and lebanon …
communities with same cultural characteristics , how come there is such a huge difference in population growth ?
the answer is arab immigration towards palestine … lured there to benefit from huge zionist investments ….
so why do they merit the unearned moniker of ‘indigenous’ ????

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Okay you are literally describing the Zionist agenda and immigration of Jews from around the world.

Being indigenous does not require that every ancestor lived there forever. It means that a significant, continuous community lived in a region for generations before modern borders and nation-state definitions. By that definition, Palestinians are considered by most historians and anthropologists to be indigenous to the region.

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16] the so called ‘palestinians’ NEVER had an independent country
not under caliph omar from 638 who was muslim
not under the mamelukes from 1239 who were muslim
not under the ottomans from 1516 who were muslim
not under the jordanians and the egyptians from 1948 who were muslim
why did their own muslim ‘brothers’ not grant them a country ??

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I cannot answer for the sins of the past of groups i do not claim to support nor agrree with.
Nor do these sins justify the violence of the present day.
I do not think having a “country” is needed to be considered an indegenous people.
Native americans did not “have a country”
Nationalism is a relatively modern invention.
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17] did you hear the true tales of the real ‘indigenous’ yazidi , of what happened to them ????
of the kurds ???
of the alawites ???
of the druze ????
why do you think the lot of the jews will be any better ???

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ISIS exterminated Muslims, Yazidis, Christians, Jews, Shiites, and Sunnis alike.
Using ISIS to argue against coexistence is like using Nazis to argue against European democracy.
We can live in peace together it is possible.

Kurds have been oppressed by:
* Turkey
* Iraq (Ba’athist regime)
* Iran
* Syria
All centralized nation-states trying to enforce ethnic homogeneity.
This is exactly the argument against ethno-states, not for them

Alawites were historically persecuted — until they captured the Syrian state.
What followed?
* Minority rule
* Brutal repression
* Civil war
* Mass death
This is not a story of safety.
It’s a story of minority domination producing catastrophe.
Which should make Zionists less, not more, confident in ethno-state logic.

And the druze have survived without a state.

Also Israel is not the only place Jews can currently live in the world.
The US is very safe for Jewish people.
The “rise of anti-semitism” is way overblown.
Jews have thrived in the US.
Quite clearly. And its not our only home, but it can be one of many.
We don’t israel to be safe….
I think Jewish success in the US has been a major point of evidence for this.

More importantly,
We should not be committing genocide to protect Jewish lives.
Not only is this sickening, I do not even think it works in the long term.
For us, and the world around us.

May we have peace soon in our days.

@flamingOTD

According to leading researchers of DePauw University :

“American propaganda during the War
dehumanized and vilified targeted groups. The Japanese were among these
targeted groups as they were depicted as savage, subhuman and in need of extermination by American forms of
media and Government .

The following US Government poster is a good example :

Stay on the job until every MURDERING
JAP is wiped out.”

My question to you : Are the Americans during WW2 guilty of Genocide ? Yes or No ?

Bear in mind the 3 million plus innocent Japanese civilians who died by American bombs ….

Genocide ??? , Yes or No ???
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@flamingOTD

UN reports are not worth the paper they are written on

They do not count at all

THE ONLY THING WHICH COUNTS IS …. REALITY

You should stop to outsource your intellect and your thinking to others !!!

Yes , there are calls for annihilation of a group .

That group is Hamas .

That group is GENOCIDAL Hamas .

Real genocidal . Not libelously genocidal.

You should not be defending real genocide .

You should not be falsely libeling those who STOP genocide .

That makes YOU an accomplice to genocide .

No matter what the biased liars of the UN say .

They are an accomplice too.

One accomplice takes the other accomplice as a witness …

SHAME ON YOU !!!!
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FLAMINGO claims : the current populations of Jews in israel were not in need of this “self-defense” from Hamas prior to the establishment of the state of israel ….
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Such a Sheker … Such a monstrous lie ….

If not for the British authorities and the Jewish self defense groups BEFORE 1948 , the entire Jewish population would be gruesomely HACKED TO DEATH
just like their unfortunate brothers and sisters in 1921 , in 1926 , in 1929 , in 1936-1939 , in 1946 , and in 1947.

My own grandfather remembered hiding as a child from crazed murderous Arab mobs in Haifa in 1936. He had to be smuggled out of his hiding place in the middle of the night , never to return to his childhood home. The whole family was lucky to escape with their lives .
And had to start anew in Jerusalem … from scratch .

That is no news for the Middle East . Ask the Yazidi’s , the Kurds , the Alawites , the Jews from 1948 in Egypt , in Syria , in Iraq , in Yemen .

Listen to the Secretary General of the Arab League who clearly said that the massacres of Djengis Kahn will pale in comparison …

Follow the activities of Grand Mufti Husseini , the ultimate hero of the Arabs BEFORE 1948 who organized Muslim army brigades for Hitler.

Who visited Auschwitz in admiration of the good work done there .

Do all that , and you will acquire a taste for REAL GENOCIDE , not for the false ersatz variety …

You are buried in lies and without drastic mental action this will be your grave .
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flamingo claims that it is “my assumption” is that they want to wipe us out …
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IT IS NOT MY ASSUMPTION

IT IS WHAT THEY ACTUALLY DID …. AND STILL DO …. AND WHAT THEY SAY THEY WILL DO AGAIN … AND AGAIN ….

why is flamingo purposely ignoring facts staring right into her face ?? is she that stupid ??

in her personal life is she also that stupid ???

when people spit in her face , does she also claim that it just happened to be raining ????
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flamingo falsely claims that israel displaced the indegenous population that was in their way

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That is another monstrous lie on the same level of the blood in the matses .

with the same monstrous results

hard to believe that flamingo is actually jewish given the monstrosities she continuously spouts

israel did not fight with any of the arab nations surrounding it , NOR DID IT FIGHT WITH THE ARABS who lived in palestine

israel GUARANTEED EQUAL RIGHTS for any arab who happened to live in its allotted part of palestine

if the arabs would accept the UN’s Partition Plan of 1947 , ALL ARABS WOULD CONTINUE TO LIVE IN THEIR HOMES

it was the arabs and millions of their crazed supporters WHO OPENLY DECLARED THAT THEY WILL KILL AND PUSH THE JEWS INTO THE SEA

it was the arabs all over the middle east who brutally attacked and murdered innocent ‘indigenous’ Jewish civilians in their countries

confiscated all their belongings and expelled them all without even a cent of compensation

those ‘indigenous’ civilians WERE OF NO THREAT WHATSOEVER , nevertheless were they genocidally murdered ….

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re the libel of so called ‘displacement’ …

it was israel who encouraged arabs to stay in their villages , while the supreme arab command encouraged them to flee.

which most of them did.

those arabs who stayed , actually enjoyed equal rights as was promised

they number now over 2 million

but flamingo liar , please tell me — conversely—- WHERE ARE THE TWO MILLION JEWS UNDER ARAB DOMINION ???

WHERE ARE THEIR EQUAL RIGHTS ????
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flamingo liar , please tell me —– why are the Jews who set foot in arab villages cruelly murdered ,
whereas arabs wander unharmed in jewish villages and towns ????

arab towns are judenrein
the jewish country is full of arabs …

flamingo liar , please tell me — honestly —- if you know the real meaning of the word ….

WHO IS GENOCIDAL ??? the arabs or the israeli’s ???

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the thief is screaming thief ….
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flamingo PERSONALLY is arguing for one state one vote with reparations …

one huge joke ….

flamingo PERSONALLY is guaranteeing that the one vote which each jew is receiving , courtesy of flamingo , will actually count ….

moreover , flamingo PERSONALLY is guaranteeing that even the one vote which each arab will have , will actually count ….

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if so , flamingo PERSONALLY should also guarantee that the one vote which each arab has in all twenty arab countries actually count ….

do they really count ????

you know what …. before we will rely on flamingo’s PERSONAL PROMISE that each vote will count in EY …

let her prove her prowess and see how she first makes sure that the one vote the arab has in all of his twenty arab countries , actually count ……

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but no …. there must be some UN report , somewhere … saying that the arab citizens’ vote within arab countries actually do count …

so that UN report trumps reality …

that sounds like an excellent refutation of my comment ….

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flamingo the filthy liar claims that we are teaching Jewish children to hate Arabs . We are teaching Jewish children to hate Muslims, and overall to look down on Non-Jews .

flamingo the filthy liar should write for der sturmer .

they would be delighted to feature her

I pray that flamingo should get her just rewards from heaven for her filthy lies

this is total sheker vechazav

my children are NOT taught to hate arabs , nor are any of the children I know , nor are any children taught to hate any muslims

nor to look down on anyone whatsoever

my children are taught that chaviv adam she nivra betselem like mishna says in avot

my children are taught to treat everyone with respect as a human being

and let me tell you — they do respect every human being

I am deeply offended by your attacks , lies and vile slurs …
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flamingo is being clear MOTSI SHEM RA on all of klal yisrael and will have to some very serious teshuva — if she is jewish ….
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realistic flamingo claims that “education, love, acceptance, these things stop genocide”

what stopped the nazi genocide ? ? ?

was it “education, love, acceptance” ? ? ?

what stopped the hamas attempted genocide on october 7 ??

was it “education, love, acceptance” ? ? ?

what did the now dead leftist victims of the october 7 attempted genocide , think while they were still alive ????

that their “education, love, acceptance” towards the pitiful arabs of gaza would stop their own murder ????

have a secret for our realistic flamingo —– the now dead leftist victims of the october 7 attempted genocide …

they thought like you ….

they showered gaza arabs with “education, love and acceptance” ….

they helped them , hosted them , ferried them around , loved them , accepted them , employed them and advocated for them ….

and it was those very same arabs who mapped their homes as preparation for the genocidal oct 7 mass murder

and later came to loot their homes ….

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how naive … how naive …..
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