December 18, 2008 3:48 pm at 3:48 pm #588913
Your Opinions, in a respectful way please.December 18, 2008 3:59 pm at 3:59 pm #831494
i think it’s fine. even the biggest talmidim enjoy speaking sports once in a while.December 18, 2008 4:01 pm at 4:01 pm #831495
However much I like sports, I think it’s wrong to allow an official thread which will lead to unnecessary worshiping and idolizing these Shkotzim who run round like Behamos all day. The Bitul Zman will be terrible and it’s just not suitable for a Yeshivish Frum Website.
Just my opinion.December 18, 2008 4:02 pm at 4:02 pm #831496
Yes.December 18, 2008 4:06 pm at 4:06 pm #831497
everything in moderation. nobody is idolizing the shkotzim. you don’t enjoy going to a baseball game??December 18, 2008 4:06 pm at 4:06 pm #831498
“The Bitul Zman will be terrible and it’s just not suitable for a Yeshivish Frum Website.”
How is it more of a Bittul Zman than 95% of the things “discussed” here?
It is probably better to discuss an non jew, at least it avoids all the lashon hara and rechilus that is prevalent here.December 18, 2008 4:06 pm at 4:06 pm #831499
Please don’t.December 18, 2008 4:08 pm at 4:08 pm #831500
I LOVE sports as well but lemaissa I agree with you.December 18, 2008 4:10 pm at 4:10 pm #831501
Why Do I Even BotherMember
“The Bitul Zman would be terrible”
Eh? What exactly are you doing with your time now?! The bitul zman would not be any worse then posting on any other thread.
So if you would rather waste your time on things other than sports, thats your prerogative. Others would rather waste their time on sports, which there is nothing wrong with.
Just my opinion.December 18, 2008 4:11 pm at 4:11 pm #831502
I can only tryMember
Although most of my relatives and I are sports fans, I agree with noitallmr.December 18, 2008 4:21 pm at 4:21 pm #831503
I agree with all those that say yes to a sports thread and also agree with those who say that a sports thread will not be anymore of a bitul zman than any of the other threads that are posted here.December 18, 2008 4:24 pm at 4:24 pm #831504
i really don’t understand, noitallmr. no to sports but yes about latkes and hamentashen and screen names.?? really, am i missing something here?December 18, 2008 4:26 pm at 4:26 pm #831505
How about the OBBL (Orthodox Bungalow Baseball League)?
KIDDING 🙂December 18, 2008 4:39 pm at 4:39 pm #831506
interesting how this question is coming up so close to chanukah—representative of the history that obsessively glorified stadium events.
Can’t imagine why this potential thread is being grouped with other very tachlisdik ones….ie–I found “Top Yeshivos” to be very productive and helpful.
I guess the question of “will this bring me closer to Hashem?” has to be honestly analyzed.
I hope this was respectful.December 18, 2008 4:40 pm at 4:40 pm #831507
amichai,jphone,Why Do I Even Bother & whatshaiches,
He made two other points as well, in case you didn’t notice.December 18, 2008 5:09 pm at 5:09 pm #831508
Why Do I Even BotherMember
Yea, I chose to respond to the point addressed to everyone OVER the age of 12. Maybe we should stop all the food threads too so people shouldnt start loving food too much.
What exactly does talking about sports have to do with idolizing??December 18, 2008 7:26 pm at 7:26 pm #831509
I’m not into sports but I don’t see anything wrong with having threads about it. My initial reaction was to be against it, but after thinking about it more I feel like there is nothing wrong with it.
To answer noitall’s well stated points one by one: As far as bitul zman, I agree with all the posters above that yes its bitul zman but why is it worse many of the the other frivolous discussions here? Ideally all of us (myself included) should be using our time more productively but if we are going to be shmoozing online, its much better that it be in a moderated frum environment than somewhere else. That should include those who will find somewhere online to talk about sports. Better here than somewhere else.
as for the reason of idolizing, I doubt that anyone will begin idolizing sports players because there is a thread on YWN about that player.
As for the reason that “it’s just not suitable for a Yeshivish Frum Website” I disagree. Its only not suitable if one of the other 2 reasons you mentioned are valid. But if the other 2 reasons are not, then I don’t think this can stand on its own as an independent reason.December 18, 2008 7:31 pm at 7:31 pm #831510
It should be closed to those in EY, where the Gedolim there hold sports is assur.
Even though in Chutz it is muttar, YWN should not allow posts about sports in respect to those posters in EY. We don’t want them to be Nichshal, C”V.December 18, 2008 7:46 pm at 7:46 pm #831511
Gavra, I cant tell if you are sarcastic or not – are sports assur in Israel?December 18, 2008 7:49 pm at 7:49 pm #831512
I hear the bittul zman reason but I agree that some threads fall into the same category so why not? go yanks!December 18, 2008 8:10 pm at 8:10 pm #831513
You sound pretty sarcastic, but seriously, is it just the rebbeim in the chedarim that decided it is assur for little children to have some fun? Or is it really something that was officially banned. I don’t want to disrespect chashuva people but I can’t understand what could be wrong with 9-year-old children throwing a ball at recess. Is it better that they do crazy stuff in the street and have chutzpa to adults who pass them?
About the sports thread, I think there are two catagories under this topic. The first is the actual playing of it and the second is the culture. I don’t know much about either catagories, but I do realize that since the separate catagory is something that is entrenched in secular culture, it would probably not be appropriate on a “Yeshiva World” website. I am not expressing an opinion on whether it should be allowed at all, just whether it should be included in this website. I’m sure there are plenty of sources for sports news. On the other hand, maybe it would be best to have the news from a kosher source.
In any case, don’t you have a moreh derech that you consult? Why are you asking us?December 18, 2008 8:11 pm at 8:11 pm #831514
I’m not. I have heard from a Gadol in EY there one of the reasons is the sports teams there play in general on shabbos, and they don’t want the frum olam following sports on shabbos.
There are other reasons as well.December 18, 2008 8:47 pm at 8:47 pm #831515
Again, I don’t mean to dispute the words of a gadol, just looking for explanation.
Doesn’t that sound a bit far fetched? The frei people do a lot of things on shabbos. In a lot of circles in America, the kids play sports and don’t have an inkling of what’s goes on at a big baseball game and barely know what the yankees are.December 18, 2008 8:59 pm at 8:59 pm #831516
I guess they feel in EY they require more seperation. That is just speculation, of course.
Perhaps someone from EY could shed some more light on the subject.December 18, 2008 9:05 pm at 9:05 pm #831517
i’m kinda sorry to say this, but i went to a soccer game in Israel. not one charedi soul in the entire stadium (except for myself and two friends!) and there were not even so many datiim. most of them did not look jewish at all. I was kinda horrified afterward – a soccer game in israel is not the place for a ben (or bat) torah.December 18, 2008 9:08 pm at 9:08 pm #831518
To all the people here that was wondering what I meant about Bitul Zman. Sorry I wasn’t very clear I’ll try and explain.
In a normal discussion it’s basically what your opinion is, post it and that’s basically the end of that. Of course you might come to that thread to argue it out but it’ll stop very shortly. Sports however is one of those never ending subjects because there are always things going on in th sports world so it will definitely lead to more Bitul Zman then the usual thread arguing which food is better. Obviously I’m not trying to say that half the stuff here isn’t Bitul Zman, rather that Sports will be just that bit more then the usual threads.
But that was Agav a Nekuda to the main point I wanted to say.December 18, 2008 9:10 pm at 9:10 pm #831519
“He made two other points as well, in case you didn’t notice.”
He made two points. One, bittul zman, was addressed by a number of people. The other, nobody is idolizing ballplayers.December 18, 2008 9:37 pm at 9:37 pm #831520
I live in ey. but not exactly in the know of how these things workDecember 18, 2008 10:55 pm at 10:55 pm #831521
The third point was that it is unsuitable for a frum website.
As far as sports in EY. It is totally, totally, totally out of bounds (pun intended) for chareidim in EY.
As for the reasons why, I prefer not to discuss things that I don’t have a good handle on.
Intellegent, the issue is FOLLOWING sports, not throwing a ball around during recess.December 19, 2008 12:05 am at 12:05 am #831522
NO, NO, NO. (I hate sports, rather play them than watch them).December 19, 2008 12:10 am at 12:10 am #831523
yes!!!! i love sporys & wat more threads like the runners thread!!!December 19, 2008 4:31 am at 4:31 am #831524
“i’m kinda sorry to say this, but i went to a soccer game in Israel”
I’d be embarrassed as well as sorry.December 19, 2008 1:59 pm at 1:59 pm #831525
I’m glad that I am not chareidi nor living in Israel if it means I have to cut sports out of my life. I *could* cut them out, but I rather enjoy them.
Well, I for one would welcome a sports thread, and maybe those who have objections would just stay out?
There are actually many good lessons you can learn from sports (both playing and watching) on what to do and what not to do.
Plus, who doesnt enjoy a good Manny and the Yankees debate? LOLDecember 19, 2008 2:03 pm at 2:03 pm #831526
Sports is not to be discussed on a frum website?
Let me get this straight. Lashon Hara, Rechilus and sinas chinam (threads about the rubashkins, chabad and others) are ok. Leitzanus (mother in law jokes for example) is ok. Stam naarishkeit (latkes and hamantashen) is OK. Sports which avoids the issues of Sinas Chinam, Lashon Hara, and Rechilus, THAT is unsuitable for a yeshivish website.
Sounds like twisted logic to me.
Editor: I am trying to keep this as respectful as possible and will even include the requisite disclaimer. NotPashut: With all due respect, what you wrote, is one of the dumbest thing I have ever read.December 19, 2008 2:07 pm at 2:07 pm #831527
Editor. I dont understand why you dont start a thread and all those who feel it is inappropriate should stay away. Nobody asks anyone to 1)log onto this site to begin with and 2)read every thread.December 19, 2008 2:24 pm at 2:24 pm #831528
noitallmr – that’s what i meant. not just sorry to say it, but sorry to have gone. but what’s done is done. you learn from your mistakes.December 19, 2008 2:51 pm at 2:51 pm #831529
“Leitzanus (mother in law jokes for example)”
You are so narow minded. Leitzonus is not jokes. Leitzonus is to make a serious Yiddishe issue not important because you made it seem much lighter then it is. For example after a mussar Shmooze to make a joke about the Rabbi who gave it is Leitzonus since the person you tell it to will not heed his words any more. Stam jokes are absolutely fine.
“Lashon Hara, Rechilus and sinas chinam”
The moderators are doing a great job keeping all that out of here, but if you think that this whole CR is all that, no-one asked you to go click on it. But If I’m already on it and I think that this place is Kosher Veyoshor it would be a shame to have a Sports Thread for the reasons I discussed before.December 19, 2008 3:49 pm at 3:49 pm #831530
Jphone is actually right. I hate sports, but if someone wants to discuss it, I don’t have to read the thread. I am changing my original answer to yes. If you really want to discuss (boring) sports, go right ahead, folks. As I said, I would rather play than watch (though I am probably too klutzy for that).December 19, 2008 4:10 pm at 4:10 pm #831531
jphone, AMAIN V’AMAIN!
It is twisted.
Also, I can’t remember where it is written or who wrote it but there was a mention of not even allowing a poster of a sportsman (or woman I guess!) on the wall in a child’s room for fear of idolizing. We all (or many of us) have pictures of Gedolim on our walls this doesn’t mean we IDOLIZE them. Respect for the art or craft doesn’t equate idolizing.December 19, 2008 7:47 pm at 7:47 pm #831532
Thank You for speaking like a Ben Torah.December 19, 2008 8:28 pm at 8:28 pm #831533
“You are so narow minded.”
HHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!December 19, 2008 8:30 pm at 8:30 pm #831534
“but if you think that this whole CR is all that, no-one asked you to go click on it.”
Where did I hear that before?
“But If I’m already on it and I think that this place is Kosher Veyoshor it would be a shame to have a Sports Thread for the reasons I discussed before.”
My humble apologies. I was not aware that YWN policy was based on how YOU feel. Salachti.December 20, 2008 8:53 pm at 8:53 pm #831539
Thanks Joesph. Good to see someone out there with some normal Shittos!December 20, 2008 9:11 pm at 9:11 pm #831540
We shouldn’t idolize gedolim but many put pictures on their wall because there is an inyan to look at a tzaddik and also, we don’t just learn an “art” from a gadol, but we are supposed to look up to and hope to follow them as a WHOLE person. Sports celebreties would probably belong to a catagory on the opposite extreme. I doubt you would want any of them as a role model on how to live your life. So let’s not make comparisons.
All those who say, if you want you don’t have to read it: I don’t get it? Isn’t there such a thing as standards and values that publications/websites/books/companies have? What if they’d all say, if you don’t like it, don’t read it? In order to open a book or go to a website, you want to know what kind of standards they have and based on that is how you (should) decide if it is for you.
Again, I am not expressing an opinion on whether or not the thread should be made, just clarifying certain issues.December 20, 2008 11:25 pm at 11:25 pm #831543
There is a MAJOR difference between hanging a picture of a GODOL and lhavdil elef havdolos a pruste sheigetz sportsman (or c’v even worse, a sportswoman.)December 21, 2008 1:20 am at 1:20 am #831545
i dont see why notDecember 21, 2008 1:28 am at 1:28 am #831546
intellegent- couldn’t have said it better myself. It’s like putting a Shmutzig picture in a newspaper and saying who asked you to look at it?December 21, 2008 1:34 am at 1:34 am #831547
harav hagaon- You still wondering why your posts don’t get on???December 21, 2008 1:35 am at 1:35 am #831548
even though sports is shttus i dont see why there shouldnt be sports on people who do follow should see whats going on in sportsDecember 21, 2008 1:38 am at 1:38 am #831549
Know what’s amazing? How “the rav” aka “harav hagaon” thinks that we are really that ignorant.
Listen, you are obviously very bored and need something to occupy yourself with, but it will no longer be on YWN…..
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