Yisrael Beitenu party chairman Avigdor Lieberman appears determined to continue his chareidi-bashing campaign which began last week with the airing of a video comparing chareidim to Hamas. In his latest anti-chareidi diatribe, the former defense minister announced that he feels if Israel’s founding fathers were chareidim, it is unlikely that the state would ever have been created.
Under the banner of “I believe – Only Lieberman will not capitulate to chareidim” he writes “The fathers of Zionism were total Jews, but not a single one of them was chareidi, and this is not coincidental. If they were chareidim, it is doubtful if the State of Israel would have been established.
“It is not inconceivable that until now, we would wait for Moshiach to redeem us from the misery of galus” he added sarcastically to his followers, indicating with the State of Israel, the Jews are out of galus.
Party officials add, “In a choice between the conception of Jabotinsky and that of MK Litzman, we select Jabotinsky without hesitation! Yisrael Beitenu is in favor of a Jewish State, not a chareidi state; a strong modern state not a dark galus one. We are for a Yiddishkheit that accepted Ruth the Moabite and against those who bury soldiers who sacrificed their lives for the state outside the fence”.
(YWN Israel Desk – Jerusalem)
I would bet that Netanyahu agrees with him.
What a DREKISH FARSHTINKENE EVIL RUSKIE,
And why is that not true?
oh so true
If Capatilists were Communists there would be no Soviet Union.
If Communists were Capitalists there would be no USA.
Comrade Lieberman’s point is senseless.
LOL, obviously. many chareidim are anti zionists!
That’s like saying, if more early Americans were British sympathizers it is doubtful if the United States would have been created.
So is the fulfillment of Zionism that a bunch of Russian goyim, attack and ridicule religious Jews and Jewish observance in the only Jewish state in the world??!!
He’s right for a change
not very intelligent , obviously if they were there they would not have created a state..
Cute… However, our gedolim WERE there and they DIDN’T create the state and they didn’t encourage its creation, either.
If they were chareidim, it is doubtful if the State of Israel would have been established…and it is doubtful if we would be in a perpetual state of war and it is doubtful if Jews world over would be at risk from the wrath of multitudes of Muslims.
About 150 years ago, a gaggle of assimilated Jewish ignoramuses grew tired of the incorrigible Antisemitism in Europe. Some of them, led by the Viennese journalist, who was ignorant of Torah and virulently opposed to traditional Judaism, decided that the solution was a Jewish state, as a precursor to mass conversion to Christianity. In their Zionist Congresses,they very nearly accepted the idea of a Jewish state in Uganda. Some religious delegates to the Congress raised a ruckus over this, claiming if we’re making a Jewish state — it should be in Eretz Yisrael. All of the Zionist indoctrination, teaching materials that appeared in those early years were chock full of pessukim, and ma’amarei Chazal (albeit often in a corrupted form) extolling the virtues of Eretz Yisrael. In other words, the entire basis for the original secular Zionism was taken from our traditional sources. They sang secular songs around campfires that were taken from the Tanach. (Today, most of them sing a different tune.)
I could continue, but the point is the entire Zionist enterprise drew its initial inspiration from traditional Judaism. What they did to it afterwards is another issue, but had there not been Torah observant Jews keeping the traditions alive, there would have been nothing for the secular Zionists to draw upon (usurp is a better word). So, to denigrate those Jews who were and still are upholding the traditions of our Torah, is to demonstrate utter ignorance of the history of our nation.
He’s correct. The Chareidim were negotiating with the Arabs for an arrangement by which the Jewish community could live and prosper in all of Eretz Yisrael as an autonomous Jewish community, within a large Islamic state. The leaders of the Arabs agreed, but the British and socialist zionists (then a minority of zionists) opposed it and sabotaged it.
If it had come off, Eretz Yisrael would be part of a large Arab state including all the Arabs east of Suez, with the current King Abdullah of Jordan as king, and would have have a Jewish population in excess of 12 million. No war, no conscription, no holocaust and the secular Jews could move elsewhere to pursue whatever they want without messing up the kedushah of our land.
crazykanooiy: the first half of your name shows where your logic is. A little event like the Holocaust did happen , remember? Maybe a couple of million Jews could have been saved if not for the misguided oppostion of your kanoim?
true. religious jews would certainly not violate the three shvuos. which, by the way, was darshaned by the amoraim no less, (see the last 2 bletter of ksubos). i dont see any chidush.
@docelisheva, thats not really an accurate synopsis, but if you will look in the writings of early zionists (jabotinsky, herzl, ben gurion, wolfsohn ect.) you will see that they believed that if zionism succeeded, there would really be no frum chevra around all that would be left would be the modernized enlightened state of modernized enlightened jews. that is really the fact black on white.
akuperma: and we would all have a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. Your analysis is so far off base that it does not even merit a response. Let me just say that 99% of Jews would not put their fate in the hands of King Abdullah. BTW-you are welcome to go live in Gaza if you love the Arabs so much.
American jerushalmi: have you ever heard of chovevei tzion? how about the Netziv? or R”Yaakov Mohilever? Or the Rebbe hachalutz? and many others. You are smoking the wrong pipe when you assert that the idea of Israel was only by secular Jews. You are dead wrong.
daas torah: there have been multitude of analysis of that gemoro in Kesubos and it shows conclusively that there was absolutely no connection of that gemoro with the establishment of the medinah.
He is a true fool and rabid chareidi hater. That said; he is 100% right on this. Virtually all frum gedolim were against Zionism and a “Jewish state”, although there were a few gedolim very much for it.
Akuperma- to say there wouldn’t have been a Holocaust is plain wrong. Hashem made that gezeira, it would have occurred regardless.