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zahavasdad,
You must like baby greens 🙂
DaasYochid,
So, having no chometz around is not an issue as far as not selling it, but you do lose the mitzvah of destroying it.
Thank you for pointing that out. We separate pieces of chametz out specifically to be burned, so I wasn’t even thinking about that aspect – just the stuff that we put away and sell.
zahavasdad,
marror too, you have to eat a certain amount. I think its about 5 stalks of lettuce for a Kezayis
Depends on the size of the stalks.
lightbrite,
I have seen people do what lesschumras said about pushing for food and even complaining about it unfortunately.
I have seen accidental pushing, with “oh, sorry, excuse me!” thrown in, but that is a normal pitfall of a large crowd trying to access a small space.
I have seen people grab an entire plate of food off the table, but it’s usually to move it closer to their plates so they can serve themselves without spilling stuff all over the table. If I ask for the plate back politely I’m usually obliged politely.
I have seen people standing at the communal tables and eating, but they are typically unaware that they are blocking others, and a quick “good Shabbos” or “excuse me” will get them to move.
and there were several otherwise normal yet ravenous individuals in the group.
I bet the davening ends fairly late at your shul.
To those asking why this specific question is a LOR question: Why?
Has anyone heard of a requirement to possess chametz before Pesach so that it can be sold to a non Jew? I would think that if it were possible to be 100% rid of chametz before Pesach (thus not needing to sell anything), that would be fine, or even ideal, and it doesn’t require a rav to say that there’s no need to go out and buy chametz before Pesach just to have some to sell.
Based on previous posts, I feel that lightbrite has a LOR, and these OPs are more for discussion than psak. If that’s not the case, then AYLOR away.
lesschumras,
So, let’s assur any activity that might possibly, however remote, result in injury.
Slippery slope fallacy, and ridiculous. Do you play Russian roulette for the fun of it?
Golfer, it’s hard not to notice when 1.someone grabs an entire plate of Kishka for himself
Never seen that at my shul.
2. When someone elbows you out of the way to get a chulent refill
Never seen that at my shul. The minhag in my shul is to politely say “good Shabbos” (translation: I don’t hate you, but get outta my way!)
3. When someone stands eating at the table and refuses to move etc.
Never seen that at my shul.
Just because you’re a member of Temple Beth Boor doesn’t mean the rest of us are.
Avram, boorish behavior is in the eye of the beholder.
I do think eating contests are boorish, but not one time did I say that or use that in an argument. So why are you arguing with me like I did?
By your definition, a frum slumlord is committing an avaira by putting the lives of his tenants at risk ( bad wiring, no heat hot water etc)
Absolutely. Not to mention potential chillul Hashem. Why would you think I would feel any differently? Dude, lose the prejudice and hatred against your brethren.
lightbrite,
What does that mean?
I was kidding. In just under a month, we’ll probably start reading complaints in the CR about how the shiurim (amounts of matza and marror we’re required to eat at the seder) grow each year, like the big ol’ fish that Bubba caught back in the day.
That wasn’t a contest, your childhood rav just held by Great Gedalia Goomber’s shiurim 🙂
lightbrite,
4. What about a children’s eating contest?
Didn’t think about it back then, but I once babysat for a Jewish family. The children had a gherkin eating contest.
The parents allowed it.
I was there watching as they were laughing and stuffing their faces.
I personally have discouraged my kids from competing with each other while eating, but every child and every situation are different, so it’s up to the loving parents. Depending on the ages and type of food, there still could be a choking risk to watch out for, but siblings at the table who are having fun are unlikely to “push past the pain” and risk hurting themselves.
CTLAWYER,
and the general populace who wanted to know how overeating and wasting food helps those who are starving and need assistance to provide meals.
Because eating contests are “entertaining” to watch – it’s a modern day bloodsport – and thus lucrative. Nathan’s hotdogs makes a lot of money off of their eating contests. Instead of watching gladiators maul each other in the Colosseum, “modern civilized” folk watch people maul their own bodies with food.
lesschumras,
Don’t let your vendetta against perceived “chumras” overload your common sense. Do you really intend to argue that endangering your life in order to win a prize is muttar?
Food “eating” contests are extremely dangerous to the participants, and for that reason alone should be assur. Eating huge amounts of food in a very short period of time is extremely unhealthy, and can cause serious gastroparesis and could require surgery.
Back in 2007, a California radio station held a water drinking contest for a video came console, and a woman died of water intoxication after trying to compete.
In 2010, a boy choked to death during a hotdog eating contest to benefit victims of the Haiti earthquake.
lightbrite,
Furthermore, someone who is that angry/deranged/skewed generally is not going to consider what I am saying or any logic for the matter. Instead the person will get defensive.
Yes, exactly. If someone is so outside the bounds of normal human decency that s/he would hurl abuse at someone, or say horrible things about someone to others as if that’s a normal thing to do, then there’s no way that person is safe to interact with.
In my mind, social disengagement is the most powerful response. Stony silence after “jokes” sends a pretty clear and strong message to most people that they have stepped outside of proper societal bounds. What seems more problematic in your case to me was that the store employees were “playing along” with the deranged customer. Rather than being treated like the loon he was, his destructive behavior was reinforced. Given that, the best response would probably still be coldness and silence towards the offending employees, but lodging a complaint with management might be appropriate too. The store managers should know if a customer had a bad experience in the store.
Health,
Let’s take it really slowly, step by step.
1. Popa bar Abba asked when the best time to start smoking is.
2. You responded that in his case, the sooner the better, because that would benefit you. Presumably this is a joke – implying facetiously that you do not like Popa bar Abba and would like to see him get sick and die and thus out of your hair.
3. Meno does not think such jokes are appropriate coming from a self-described medical person. I cannot tell if he is joking back at you or not.
Very clear! I might try the game out on an upcoming Shabbos.
zahavasdad,
The police would do nothing. The police have better than to do than deal with an Anti-Semetic verbal incident
Perhaps not if you make their job easier, with a license plate number and witness(es).
Bigfoot is real. My definition of Bigfoot in this case is someone with size 12 shoes or more.
The Loch Ness Monster is real. My definition of the Loch Ness Monster in this case is someone within 50km of Loch Ness who behaved in a mean way to someone else that day.
Unicorns are real. My definition of a unicorn in this case is a horse or pony with at least one brass instrument (trumpet, trombone, etc.) located within a 5-mile radius.
zahavasdad,
As I was walking home from Shul on Shabbos about a month ago, Someone decided to park their car in the middle of the cross walk blocking the ability to walk normally.
Just curious, did you say something to the woman about how her car was blocking the walkway before she yelled the anti-Semitic slur? Or was it completely random?
As I had to really walk around this car , this woman in the car started yelling at me how hitler did not complete the job. So I yelled back. I will not stand for someone telling that to me
I think that behavior would constitute harassment. If I were in that situation and thinking clearly (but most likely I would not be), I’d either say nothing or simply, “that was a very unkind thing to say”. And then try to memorize the license plate number and call the police after Shabbos. Especially if there were witnesses (e.g., someone walking with you or nearby who you know).
Uncle Moishy is not something that can be told over. He must be experienced properly – at high volume while squished in an 8-passenger Toyota Sienna next to a car seat during a long drive, with 6-inch drifts of cracker crumbs and toys on the floor.
Ignoring someone who is so outside of societal norms that s/he would verbally attack a random person is not necessarily a sign of weakness.
lightbrite,
RebYidd23 is Popa? Popa-inspired?
No, I don’t think so.
When you see a thread that ends, “by Popa”, you can be assured that it is a troll thread, but that usage is limited to a single poster. RebYidd23 is proposing a new troll thread indicator that is general enough to be used by any poster.
An attempt at using a general troll thread title indicator was made previously, with OPs ending thread titles with “I do shudder”, but I think that eventually annoyed the mods.
I shudder just thinking about it
Joseph,
If it’s physical call the police.
If it’s verbal keep your head low, ignore and move on. Remember you’re in galus.
Agreed, but if the verbal attack felt threatening, for example, if someone were following me or demanding I answer, I’d call the police then too.
(T) is the more generalized form of “by Popa”
The old Gedalia Goomber would’ve dropped the ton of bricks off the building in order to rush home for Shabbos. The new Gedalia Goomber gives himself extra time to get home and prepare, but still drops the bricks for fun. Then he has to find a new job the next week.
zahavasdad,
The problem as I see it , in the general world nothing is sacred and you can pretty much say what you want. You can portray any character any way you want.
That’s true, but not really germane to the discussion of whether The Chosen portrayed chassidic Jewry in a positive light or not. I do think the novel portrayed modern Orthodox Judaism in a very positive light, but not chassidism.
You can also portray people as complex individiduals . for example In the chosen Reb Saunders has a dark side. A frum book would never show a dark side to a Rav (I didnt say a sinning side, just a darker side)
Reb Saunders is not a real person at all. He is a character conceived by Chaim Potok, and as such informs us as to the author’s perceptions of chassidic Jewry, whether or not he is complex.
zahavasdad,
Sorry, I could not find the article you are describing. Can you provide more specific search terms, or post a snippet?
zahavasdad,
Read the Hebrew Mishpacha Magazine Obituary of Rav Elyashiv
Why?
zahavasdad,
is there are secular jewish work you approve of?
Einstein’s special relativity is quite spectacular 🙂
zahavasdad,
Many frum people consider Fiddler on the Roof (Tevye the Milkman) a negative portrayl, however most people think of it as very lovingly
I’m only familiar with the theatrical musical version of Fiddler on the Roof, but I would agree with those who feel that it is a positive portrayal. It’s just not a very knowledgeable portrayal.
zahavasdad,
Like Ive seen, ive read “Frum” Books and you see things like how the father spent all his time learning (and not spend with the son)
I think there’s a difference between a distant father and a neglectful father. A soldier can spend most of his time away from his family, but that isn’t neglectful per se. Reb Saunders made a conscious decision to refuse emotional connection with Danny.
You are also spending all your energy on this one aspect of “The Pain and the widsom of the silence” There is alot more to the book than that.
Silence and pain seem to be primary themes of the novel.
You dont seem to mention how the Rebbe really took a liking to the Less relgious boy and invited him over regulary (Except during the Zionist phase)
I did not perceive Reuven to be “less religious” in the novel – now you’re gonna get the MO posters up in arms 🙂
zahavasdad,
If you are not used to a more general light then the Chosen is not for you.
Aha, so I can’t properly appreciate The Chosen because I’m locked in some kind of sheltered frum box, used to sanitized Artscroll biographies exclusively? Not quite. I read The Chosen before I became frum, and formed my interpretations with that mind set. The author’s polemic against the perceived chassidic “circle the wagons” approach to modernity, and the juxtaposition of Reuven’s saintly father and Reb Saunders is quite unsubtle.
zahavasdad,
Ive read books from frum authors saying similar things.
That doesn’t answer my question. Do you think that the portrayal of a chassidic “rebbe” emotionally neglecting his son in order to teach him compassion is positive, whether or not the author is “frum”?
The problem is it came from a Non-frum author
Why do you assume that? Did I write that anywhere?
zahavasdad,
I think it is, but I am not the last word on this topic.
Do you think that the portrayal of a chassidic “rebbe” emotionally neglecting his son in order to teach him compassion is positive?
I read the book a long time ago.
zahavasdad,
Do you think it’s positive towards the chassidic frum community?
zahavasdad,
Wait, first you write:
(Its actally is quite positive towards the frum community)
And then:
I dont doubt [that those in chassidic frum communities would disagree], which is why I was suprised so many had heard of it.
Which is it? Is it positive towards the frum community, or not?
Lilmod Ulelamaid,
oh my gosh – have you guys noticed the tags showing up on the upper right? And it looks like anyone can add if they choose to do so.
Looks like RebYidd23 noticed.
zahavasdad,
It does shock me the in the frum commnity almost everyone has heard of the Chosen (Its actally is quite positive towards the frum community)
I’m not sure those in chassidic frum communities would agree.
Little Froggie,
I don’t think I ever claimed to be a computer expert or anything of that sort.
Perhaps not, but you’re the one with the thread named for you. Anyway, a computer expert is simply someone who has more complex and intractable computer problems than the next guy 🙂
Once I was a builder, and on the 100th floor,
I was carrying a load of bricks, an easy ton or more!
But now it’s midday Friday, so I take an extra hour,
I got home nice and early, an even had time to shower!
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Guess it doesn’t have the same ring to it 🙂
Joseph,
Whatever happened to him?
He took on bringing in Shabbos early.
Are posts still hidden from public view until moderated, or are they now going up as soon as posted?
Lilmod Ulelamaid,
Maybe someone else can help me.
I’m not sure that my level of help will approach even the knees of a little froggie, but I’ll give it a shot.
First, you didn’t specify, but from your posts, I’m assuming that you are using Microsoft Word. At the top of your document, there should be a row with different tabs (File Home Insert … etc). Click “References” to get the options under that tab. At the bottom of the options you should see the word Footnotes, with a small diagonal or downward arrow on the righthand corner. Click that arrow, and a footnotes dialog box will appear. With this dialog box, you can control how the footnotes are numbered in your document, including changing the starting number. Good luck!
lightbrite,
I thought he was talking about serving kids wine at Purim. My bad.
Ok. But why did you only direct your ire towards WolfishMusings, and not Joseph?
lightbrite,
Wasn’t mention overuse. Mentioned one time use.
Understood, although we don’t know how often RebYidd23 needs a coffee antidote. My “rant” about the Benadryl was more of a rhetorical recapitulation of the wine issue anyway (though everything I said is true).
I did not castigate Jewish parents for allowing older children to sip kiddush wine. They were talking about giving children alcohol on Purim. Close to drunk but not officially drunk.
WolfishMusings stated quite clearly that he does not serve wine at his Purim seuda, and thinks doing so is wrong.
Joseph asked if he served underage guests wine at his Shabbos kiddush (and incorrectly implied that it was illegal). WolfishMusings confirmed that he did.
Enter your flaming response directed solely at WolfishMusings.
I’ll accept your explanation and interpretation at face value, though it’s somewhat undercut by your follow-up post that stated that you don’t advocate anyone drinking any amount alcohol before their mid-20s – which suggested a moral equivalence between Joseph’s stated practice and WolfishMusings.
Anyway. Say what you like. Don’t need to explain when words are twisted.
Thanks for the opportunity still
Just because you don’t like my calling out your response does not mean I twisted anything.
WolfishMusings,
At the risk of invoking Godwin’s Law, then even Hitler had worth.
You already preemptively resolved this question above:
I grant the point that even a rasha gamur can have worth.
To quote Arthur Conan Doyle in The Hound of the Baskervilles:
To all the world he was the man of violence, half animal and half demon; but to her he always remained the little wilful boy of her own girlhood, the child who had clung to her hand. Evil indeed is the man who has not one woman to mourn him.
WolfishMusings,
I’m sure your wife doesn’t agree. Or your kids. Or your friends.
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion.
Their opinions are actually the deciding ones. If I think something has worth, then by definition it has worth, and it doesn’t matter what the thing thinks of itself.
WolfishMusings,
In lightbrite’s world, a father who makes a positive example about sobriety and responsible drinking by never getting drunk giving his adult kids 2 oz. of 5% alcohol is a criminal
I don’t think she actually implied criminal, although what she did say was quite harsh and confusing, and should get a follow-up. Lightbrite seems opposed to alcohol consumption at older than 21, perhaps up to 25, so I don’t think she considers this a legal issue.
while someone who sets a terrible example by getting drunk in front of their kids is fine as long as he doesn’t actually give them any himself (because, as we all know, they won’t touch it if he tells them not to…)
Not sure she stated or implied that either.
What shocked me was the harsh statement she made regarding something that is commonly done in Jewish households and is both halachically and legally permissible (and not even medically harmful), and an implied moral equivalence with the idea of encouraging binge drinking among children who are not your own.
lightbrite,
I would take a Benadryl because it makes you a bit drowsy and is mild. 25mg to start. Maybe 50mg.
Hmm. In another thread you castigated WolfishMusings, and by extension the majority of Jewish parents, for allowing his older children to have a sip of kiddush wine, using brain health as your reason. Yet here you suggest using a drug that has substantial brain impacts for purposes other than for what it was intended?
Benadryl should not be used as a sedative. Potential side effects of Benadryl include short term memory loss, confusion, drowsiness, etc., all brain impacts. Overuse of it has even been linked to dementia.