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SJS–I find your question to be engaging, and sincere, and realize your perspective on debate so I’ll try to answer in a way you’ll understand.
The spiritual luxury of being in kollel, came with a lot less resposibility than I have now. We lived with less, because we didn’t need those things. We didn’t have a number of tuitions to pay, or bli ayin hara, so many mouths to feed. The sweetness of those years, of being totally wrapped in a learning Torah environment felt like a luxury to me. It was a gift from HKB”H that in the “teva” sense really shouldn’t have happened (absolutely no monetary support). At the time I don’t know that I could have articulated the luxury part, but in retrospect it is best described as a spiritual luxury.
SJS–I try not to be the debate type. As long as people are on their ladder of growth and going upwards that is what Hashem wants to see. Harbei D’rochim Lamakom—as long as people are intellectually honest, get the proper hadracha, and actually have a derech to come closer to HKB”H, thats what matters.
I can hear what you’re saying that kollel is a luxury–when I took time to chew on that idea, I thought back to moments I savor and live over in my minds eye when we were exclusively in kollel. It was a spiritual luxury which is irreplacable. I’m doubting that’s how you meant it—but I do hear from your perspective what you mean.
Mr. Jphone—I can’t disagree with you that you would prefer to connect with other yidden debating the coaches decision on a punt, or on whether a screen pass was the best decision, or whether both feet were in bounds within millimeters of the first down marker, or why the offense isn’t self disciplined enough not to jump offsides, etc, etc, etc, (yes, I’m trying to point out that I’m not ignorant when it comes to sports)
So, to answer your couple of questions: Most of the news I get comes from reading the headlines on the YWN homepage….I don’t have time to read in depth the majority of the articles. To me, the word yeshiva seems to be an adjective when it comes to this website and it is indicitave of what it represents….I personally don’t connect to other yidden through the Latke, Blagojavitch, and other political or business fiascos….that’s not where I put my time or interests….I carefully choose what I think will be productive and invest a slice of time in those areas……
B’kitzur: News- Home Page
Connection- carefully selected threads in CR
You can have your opinion and I respect you for it. Mine is to not have a sports thread because of what I feel it represents and what it would do for me……
I’ve never subscribed to the notion that if one is doing something less than desirable (i.e. bitul zman blogging), than the other less than desirable thing (having a sports thread bitul zman) is then ok.
I assume there are those that come to this site for an investment of time to connect with other yidden on a kosher website–to get the news they need to in a kosher forum (without the disgusting advertisements, commercials etc.), and not to be osek in bitul zman.
To have a sports thread, which has some representation of people in this world who are not worthy of our admiration to say the least, I think is beneath the calibur of this website and I strongly plead that it not become a thread in this CR.
SJS–thanks for re-routing the thread….I haven’t read enough to realize it was an overdone topic to the point of sickening people.
It sounds like you have a lot of years ahead of you before you will be supporting a Kollel family (sounds like your kids haven’t started school yet)…..
I found it very interesting that you pointed out that kollel is a luxury…I’m going to have to chew on that for a while…..
Most of my friends (many years ago), and myself included, when we chose a kollel life we knew it involved major mesiras nefesh, and most of us weren’t getting a penny of support from anyone….we lived with a lot less, and enjoyed what came along with having less (things)…but the joy of sacrificing for a genuine life of Torah to build a foundation for a true Torah home has a depth and sweetness that can’t ever be replaced.
At the same time, my respect for those who are in the working field and set aside time that is truly scarce to have a chavrusa, or go to a shiur, is tremendous…..and the sweetness of that mesiras nefesh for the husband, wife, and children is irreplaceable.
As long as each person is honest with themselves, and realizes to sacrifice for Torah isn’t a bad thing, even though it is hard,,, that is what we should strive for…each in their own way and own level.
fascinating how a “yissocher/ zevulun/kollel/work lifestyle~~emunah/bitachon” disscusion affecting our generation nowadays, has evolved into a discussion about men wearing wedding bands/rings.
I guess that is what is so attractive to people about the YW Coffee Room–one never knows where the topic will lead…………
Anyone that is interested in getting back on topic, I’d be quite curious to your insights on what was originally discussed.
Mazal77–great story–it’s also adapted on a tape for kids by Rebbee Hill called “Berel and the Berel”….halevai we should all be zoche to reach such levels of emunah and bitachon.
If we go back to the history of Klal Yisroel’s birth as a nation, and even back when they were in Mitzrayim, the majority of the shevotim were not sitting and learning. It was reserved for the few. The shevotim whose tachlis it was to sit and learn, were lovingly supported by the rest (see ma’amorim by R’ Elya Lopian who expounds on this topic in Lev Eliyahu–discussing also why shevet Levi wasn’t subjected to slavery), which earned them very special merits. Everyone though was osek in Torah learning, where the amount of time that was put into it, paralleled the tachlis Hashem gave them.
We as a nation are interconnected and depend on each other because that was how Hashem wanted it to be. We should all strive to have as much of a chelek in Torah as we can and realize that it comes in many different forms, and they should all be respected.
interesting how this question is coming up so close to chanukah—representative of the history that obsessively glorified stadium events.
Can’t imagine why this potential thread is being grouped with other very tachlisdik ones….ie–I found “Top Yeshivos” to be very productive and helpful.
I guess the question of “will this bring me closer to Hashem?” has to be honestly analyzed.
I hope this was respectful.
Please don’t.
ok I’ve got it now…..no need to translate on my behalf….message well taken.
thanks BY maydel—(I”m a kollel wife as well)…what “type” is Peekskill?
Apology much appreciated
woah—I didn’t realize those sentiments existed prevalently (people claiming to know more then our gedolim—I can’t be mekabel that those people were sufficiently educated as to what our Gedolim truly are for klal yisroel)
In any case, my yiddish is not all that great, and it’s much worse when written in “Havoras English”…..but what I’m picking up is that it’s not exactly L’chatchila to be delving into the topic I brought up….
I surely didn’t realize this would lead to a request to it being removed…definitely will be more careful next time
p.s. I second the request for a translation…..clarification
R’ Feivel–I appreciate so much your clarification as well.
I’m not sure why you assumed I wouldn’t like what HoRav Miller ZTz’l had to say…it is emes and I like it…
so we will continue to say a tefillah when we hear the sirens wail. If it is a Yid he should have a refuah and if it’s not than the tefillah we say will go to Hashem and He will decide what to do with it. It’s not a stira to feel concern for whoever is in the ambulance. What I honed from the message on the tape was increasing our level of concern for our fellow yidden.
In any case, the act of being aware of one’s surroundings and in tune with the need to be compassionate in general can only enhance the midos one wants to insill in their children.
To be sure though, when it does happen again I will add that if it is a yid in the ambulance, it will enhance our Ahavas Chinom and Ahavas Yisroel…if it isn’t a yid, we can direct our tefillos to the Rofei Chol Bosor, and reiterate that Hashem is in charge of every briah. I think that would be in line with the Rov’s teachings.
notpashut–thank you. now I will try to look up which tape it was that R’ Miller ZTz”L
discussed this…and I appreciate the clarification as to what was on the tape–I see how it could seem the 2nd paragraph was being quoted from the tape, but that was what I added. (and I’m going to work on remembering who said what).
can anyone give info on the following (for mesivta and B”M) : Peekskill, South Fallsburg, Springfield? (and any other yeshivos that are similar?)
when I am driving with my children and we see and/or hear an ambulance whiz by with blaring sirens, we say a perek of tehillim or a short tefilla for whoever is need of the emergency medical help. (not my original idea—I heard it on a tape from an inspirational speaker but can’t remember which one–hope to hasten the geulah anyway despite my inability to say b’shem omro)
One of my children asked me when I suggested this for the first time “how do you know they’re Jewish?” my response was “I don’t—everyone is created b’tzelem elokim, and this will train us to be more compassionate, which will arouse Hashem’s rachmanus which the whole world needs”.
Just a thought….before worrying about losing Olam Haba…does it occur to those who consider themselves thinkers that watching TV is losing Olam Hazeh?
Hashem has given us the gift of time (not hours, minutes, days—that’s how we measure time)—time is about being and doing. Taking time and literally killing it by watching TV, and ingesting what it has to offer is losing this great gift of life that Hashem has given us in this world.
After chewing on this concept, than one can really give honest thought to one’s own portion in Olam Haba……and I leave it up to the Gedolei HaDor and Einei HaEidah to decide what it is that causes a person to lose their Olam Haba.
(I’m hoping this will redirect the fierceness of where this thread has been heading i.e the personal attacks)
There is a movement that has been advocating getting rid of TV’s that advertises to Torah day schools and beyond….”TORAH AND TV DON’T MIX”…I think there was even an incentive to trade in one’s TV for seforim (a shas?). They explain beautifully how the values of Torah are polar opposite to those the tv spews.
In any case I don’t think there is any valid argument that tv could bring one closer to HKB”H. TV= Time Vaster TV=totally vulgar (not usually my taste to share these “roshei teivos” but fitting in any case).
SJS inNYC
One must see something that is offensive first to know what to fast forward. Even a moment of that exposure is not worth it. I’m not sure exactly what it is that is worth paying for when it comes to tv.But, a thought to ponder….one doesn’t know how emancipating it is to live without a tv unless one tries it. (I grew up with a tv/vcr/movies etc. and it is one of the most liberating feelings I’ve experienced to now in the home I’ve built not be exposed to even the “best” of what the tv offers).
If that is not in your nekudas ha’bechira, I respect that. But at least give it some intellectual honesty and thought.
I agree that TV is not the cause of all bad. The point I was making is imagine how each yiddishe neshama would feel without tv….a deep thought that requires reflection.
Probably being one of the only families in the community that we live in that doesn’t have a television, it attracts a lot of questions, and frankly disbelief. In the line of avodas hakodesh that we’re in (kiruv), when yidden come to our home and witness on their own that we don’t have a TV, our experience has been with 100% of the adults, that they express admiration that we don’t have one. Many say they wish they had the inner strength not to have one. And numerous parents lament how television has destroyed the fabric of wholesomeness and innocence in their children.
I ask you all one question: Can you imagine what this world would be like if all yidden didn’t have a television in their home?
One more thing…..from what our not yet frum guests share with us on the topic of TV, it seems impossible to filter the commercials that are aired nowadays, and they aren’t something that can be responsibly monitered. The argument of viewing such a device responsibly doesn’t work.