Menachem Shmei

Moreover the Gemara says that most Jews won’t be redeemed by Moshiach, the real Moshiach.

Qwerty, you don’t stop with this attack. You claim that trying to bring all Jews to do teshuva is worthless and contradicts a clear Gemara. You have made this claim on many occasions, and with vicious, angry tones. For example:

1. “There are serious questions with regard to Rabbi Schneersohn himself. He espoused views that contradict the Gemara. For example, he said that every Jew will be redeemed by Moshiach, with no exception, while the Gemara in Sanhedrin 111a states that only 0ne of 300,000 will be redeemed.”
2. “How could the Rebbe contradict an explicit statement in the Gemara, to wit, only one out of 300,000 Jews will be redeemed by Moshiach? According to the Rebbe all Jews, including Bernie Sanders, Woody Allen and the like will be redeemed.”
3. “For 2,000 years people learned the Gemara which said that just as only 2 of 600,000 Jews left Egypt and came to Israel, so too only 2 out of 600,000 Jews will be redeemed by Moshiach. No one ever questioned this until the Rebbhe decided that he knew the real Pshat and all Jews will be redeemed.”

And many, many more.
You go on to call a great talmid chacham “kofer” (r”l!) because you don’t understand what he said.

I will try to enlighten you:

The Rambam writes (Hilchos Teshuva 7:5) “וּכְבָר הִבְטִיחָה תּוֹרָה שֶׁסּוֹף יִשְׂרָאֵל לַעֲשׂוֹת תְּשׁוּבָה בְּסוֹף גָּלוּתָן וּמִיָּד הֵן נִגְאָלִין” – “The Torah has already promised that the Jewish people will do teshuva at the end of golus and immediately be redeemed.”

The Baal HaTanya (Tanya ch. 3 & Hilchos Talmud Torah) understands this to refer to every single Jew, as it states לא (בלתי) ידח ממנו נדח – “no one who was banished from Him [by his sins] will remain banished.”

So, when the Rebbe said every Jew will be redeemed and we should try to reach every Jew for teshuva, he was just following the Baal HaTanya.

You may ask, how does this fit with the Gemara that you keep quoting from Sanhedrin 111a?
Well, if you would look at any other part of the page other than that one line, you would realize that what you are quoting is ONLY the opinion or Rava, but does not fit with the other opinions on the page!

I will explain:

The posuk says that at the time of redemption, “two thirds will be wiped out and one third will remain.”
Thirds of what?
Resh Lakish says that only one third of the Jews (Arpachshad ben Sheim’s descendants) will survive, all others will die.
R’ Yochanan says, “Hashem is not happy with you saying such a thing” – that so many Jews (or non-Jews, depends on which meforash) will die! Instead, one third of Sheim’s descendants will survive. i.e., ALL the Jews and many non-Jews will survive.

Even according Resh Lakish (who said something that “Hashem is not happy with”), at least a third of Jews will survive, which disagrees with Rava’s opinion that only 2/600,000 will survive. Certainly R’ Yochanan, who says that all Jews will survive, argues with Rava.

Next section on the amud of Gemara:
Resh Lakish says, Hashem will only redeem the tzaddikim; one Jew from every city and two from every household.
R’ Yochanan says, “Hashem is not happy with you saying such a thing” – that most of the Jews won’t be redeemed! Rather, he explains, the merit of one tzaddik will cause his entire city to be redeemed, and in the merit of two, their entire household.
[Rav and Rav Kahana had the same machlokes, with Rav admonishing R’ Kahana.]

Finally, after all of this, comes the statement of Rava that only 2/600,000 will survive.

I can’t understand why, from this entire sugya, someone would specifically choose the opinion of Rava that most Jews won’t make it, while ignoring all the other opinions?
R’ Yochanan would definitely say about you “לא ניחא לי’ למרייהו דאמרת להו הכי” – Hashem is not pleased that you speak this way!

Even the statement of Rava needn’t be understood literally (that most Jews will not be redeemed). Meforshim explain that the majority of Jews who won’t be present at the Geula refers to the many PREVIOUS generations of Jews from before the Geula. These people will rise for techiyas hameisim and greatly outnumber the group of Jews who were part of the generation that was present at the actual time of Geula. [See footnotes in Artscroll, referencing Maharal and Yaavetz.]

Conclusion: Even if you consider yourself among the greatest tzaddikim, in the top 2/600,000 of the Jewish people, and you aren’t interested in seeing the millions of other “lowly Jews” join you in the Geula, choosing to accept Rava’s (literal) opinion that most Jews won’t be redeemed — that still doesn’t give you the right to repeatedly label a great talmid chacham as a kofer and a liar (r”l) for following the views of the Baal HaTanya, R’ Yochanan, Rav, and even Rava himself, as understood by many meforshim.

Qwerty, I hope you will either refute my points or do some serious teshuva for denigrating a tzaddik so many times with the arrogance of your ignorance.

I will once again voice my macha’a against Qwerty’s use of vile and disrespectful language regarding a revered tzaddik, honored by countless Jews.
This tiny ant’s ignorance and arrogance prevent him from engaging in a civil and respectful dialogue.

No matter my personal views, I would never post that way about a Litvisher gadol, even one who may have viciously attacked my derech, out of respect for the many members of this forum who hold him in high regard.
I expect the same decency from the other side.

Menachem Shmei denies that Lubavitchers think that they are the “Master Race” of Judaism. Let me provide two anecdotes.

Despite these anecdotes, my previous point remains: Lubavitch is a derech, not a race. Those who adhere to this derech obviously believe it is the best one, just as the adherents of Satmar believe that theirs is the best derech, or else they would leave.

Menachem Shmei said that the Rebbe discouraged his Chasidim seeking higher education. But why did he insist that their secular education end in second grade?

Great question! If you want to read up on it, Google “Derher purity of the mind” and you’ll find a great article explaining this.

it explains why Lubavitchers like Seichel are functional illiterates

Qwerty, he’s not great with English, and you’re not great with Hebrew. I’m not ch”v blaming you for the education you received, but everyone has their own priorities in what they want to be proficient in.

Personally, I didn’t receive any secular education whatsoever (no English, math, history, etc., not even until second grade) and with Hashem’s help, I’m managing fine for what I need.

P.S. I’m surprised that with all the secular education you received, you never learned about paragraphs. Your grammar doesn’t seem worth bragging about, either. I’m not claiming mine is perfect, but I’m also not mocking others for their lack of education. (And I don’t (claim to) write for the Jewish Press.)

We have Aug 27 8:47 PM and Aug 21 4:39 pm.

Lol. You’ve been calling Sechel an עובד ע”ז all this time because he quoted Gemara in two posts!?

You wrote: “In Bereishis Hashem says, “Come let us make man in our image.”:At face value this is clear-cut idolatry and many have used that literal meaning to support their idolatrous views. But those who accept Hashem Echad realize that the verse isn’t actually saying this. So we go to the Gemara in which Hashem called Yaakov “Kel”. If you accept Hashem Echad then you understand that it doesn’t mean that Yaakov is literally god. Good. Hope you’re still with me. Now here’s the problem. Seichel, with all his Chassidus does take that Gemara literally”

How in the world do you know that? He only brought the Gemara to prove to you the same point that you yourself said as well, that just because a holy statement can be interpreted by stupid people as idolatry, that doesn’t make the statement possul!

How do you know that Sechel understands the Gemara any different than you!?

All he does in those posts is QUOTE it!

This is just like you calling Lostspark a kofer for writing an Aramaic phrase from Zohar!

we have Lostspark who gave his version of the Trinity today. But Shmei’s too busy to find it.

Aha, so you couldn’t find a single post from Seichel. So you were מוציא שם רע on him. A simple, low level liar. Wow.

Now you want me to condemn Lostspark’s post today.

All I saw was Lostspark quoting a Zohar (at least the way that it’s quoted in all the chassidishe seforim from Talmidei HaBesht), which you probably couldn’t even read.

No, I will not condemn that.

If you actually find a post that supports what you said, let me know (date, time, post number), and I will gladly condemn. If not, you’re admiting (again) to be a lowly liar.

Yet you claim to have a “love for truth” more than any of the other posters here. How embarrassing!

The Rebbe had two brothers, one

Qwerty, maybe instead tell us about the son and grandchildren of Rav Shach?

Philosopher would be attacking chareidim if he saw a negative documentary portraying chareidim as a devilish cult with real footage of actual chareidim (there are many such documentaries).

Is it better to err on the side of love, or err on the side of hate?

Either one of us is going crazy or someone has stolen your moniker : -)

Your whole post happened to be things I agree with, lol.

“1. none of them take the advice %100, and will use it more as food for thought for general guidance”

I, with newfound respect, beg to differ. I know a number of people who use the igros regularly to make their decisions, and many even encourage others to do so.

“None of THEM” was referring to what I wrote before “I know some people who do this” – None of THEM take it to the extreme, though I am indeed aware that some people out there do.

Of course we believe in Hashgochoh Protis, but determining what is meant to be done from a given circumstance is very dangerous.

I completely agree, great example.

There is a known joke in Chabad circles that a guy named Sholom was wondering about his engagement with Brocha from Brooklyn, so he opened an Igros Kodesh and was excited to find a letter that said “ברוקלין נ.י. שלום וברכה” (the header of every letter).

Was it worth for Netanyahu to have not agreed to a cease fire, that would have freed the hostages before they were killed?

Yes, because a ceasefire could mean thousands more Jews killed ch”v, as Hamas has no reason not to repeat what they did on October 7th.

Either renounce Seichel’s idolatry or admit that you agree with it.

I would have Dan Him Lkaf Zechus that he didn’t mean that literally except for the fact that Seichel and Lostspark do accept it literally and you refuse to call them out for taking it literally.

Whoah Qwerty, new accusation here!
We are making lots of progress these days.

You already agree that עצמות ומהות ווי ער האט זיך אריינגעשטעלט אין א גוף can be understood just like all the other similar statements of great tzaddikim, which were obviously not AZ, ch”v.

You also came to understand that saying “so-and-so is an anav” or “so-and-so is a novi” doesn’t necessarily contradict the Gemara in Sotah.

I assume you also came to terms with the vort of Rabbi Posner, since you haven’t yet condemned the Vilna Gaon or Ben Yehoyadah for saying the same thing.

You also admitted that you don’t actually know anything that the Rebbe said, and are basing all of your “attacks” on rumors overheard in shul and online (I hope you don’t start believing rumors on Twitter about what it says in the Talmud).

You have one problem left:
Seichel and Lostspark have made statements that are CLEARLY avodah zorah (unlike all the statements of tzaddikim that I quoted earlier) and I refuse to condemn them!

This is a serious accusation against me!
Please show me which posts of theirs you are referring to (please be specific, as I have always been with you), and I will definitely renounce any AZ which they espoused, r”l.

@OP you must be enrolled in the TROLLer Yeshiva, this is very big issue with the Trollers

Common,

Welcome, I was waiting for you!

At face value this is clear-cut idolatry and many have used that literal meaning to support their idolatrous views. But those who accept Hashem Echad realize that the verse isn’t actually saying this.

You’re finally catching on.

When it comes to the Rebbe’s sichos, you are part of the former group of people, and I (and fellow Lubavitchers) am part of the latter.

Lubavitchers have their own “Chumash” called “the rebbe’s sichos” (which is why it’s probably quoted a lot over here)

I know, it’s crazy for students to quote their teacher all the time.
Imagine if someone לא אמר דבר שלא שמע מרבו, such blasphemy.

there is one overriding, sacrosanct unalterable concept in Judaism, “Hashem Echad and nothing has any power other than Him.” This is Judaism 1.0 and it’s been universally accepted by believing Jews throughout the ages.

Of course, especially if one learns chassidus which focuses so much on Achdus Hashem.

However, that doesn’t mean that there lack statements throughout Torah that may confuse someone who doesn’t know how to learn. Think about all the statements that I’ve referenced earlier.

Or when it says that anyone who says Vayechulu on Shabbos becomes a שותף במעשה בראשית. According to your logic this is literally שיתוף ch”v.
Or that one must honor one’s parents because שלשה שותפין באדם הקב”ה אביו ואמו – according to you this is trinity ch”v!

Qwerty, I know that now you’ll start giving excuses and explanations of what these statements REALLY mean, but that is pointless. I’m not ch”v saying that these statements are AZ. I’m saying that it’s childish to close your ears and scream every time you hear something that you misunderstand to be wrong.

All I said is that Rabbi Pozner downplayed Avraham Avinu’s greatness by writing in his book that the Akeidah was our Founder’s only true test which is obviously false.

This is literally in Rashi on chumash (as I explained at length)! It’s not ch”v downplaying Avraham’s greatness, on the contrary, it says that after the akeida any doubts that could have risen about Avraham’s loyalty were cleared.

Anyone who learns chassidus and especially the Rebbe’s sichos can attest to the tremendous admiration given for Avraham’s greatness.

It’s absurd how much effort you put into misreading Chabad divrei Torah to interpret them in a negative way.

I challenged the Rebbe because he rejected the Gemara which says that there is no longer Nevuah. You answer by arguing that many Gemaras are wrong.

Chas v’shalom!
My point was that “Many Gemaras are wrong” – according to YOUR logic!
(Anyone with a small amount of comprehension can grasp what I meant)

When the Gemara said that humility ended it means Rebbe’s level of humility. You know that, but you need to defend your

Finally, you have demonstrated that just because someone says something that seems to contradict a Gemara (such as “so-and-so is an anav” or “so-and-so is a novi”) that doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s an apikores, rather more study is needed.

In one such essay he discusses the Akeidah and the author said that the Akeidah was the only real test that Abraham faced because the other nine were just acts of Chesed which matched his good nature. Number one that’s absolutely false.

Qwerty,

I said this before, and I’ll say it again. It’s okay to be ignorant, but the arrogance of ignorance is unacceptable. Why do you spend so much time reading Lubavitch books in order to misunderstand and attack them, instead of using that time to educate yourself so that your questions go away?

Now, let me explain what you read in Rabbi Posner’s book:

After the tenth test of the Akeida, Hashem said עתה ידעתי כי ירא אלקים אתה – “NOW I know that your fear Hashem.”

The obvious question is, why only now? Wasn’t Avraham tested nine times before?

Moreover: The Gemara says (and it’s brought in Rashi), why did Hashem tell Avraham קח נא – “PLEASE take your son”? Because if Avraham would fail this test, people would say about the first tests לא הי’ בהן ממש – “they had no substance.”

Why would the first tests be worthless just because Avraham didn’t pass the last one?

One of the answers given is that since Avraham’s nature was מדת החסד, it would SEEM that he only passed the first tests because they fit with his nature. However, by passing the tenth test (which went against the מדת החסד), it became clear that he passed all of the tests only for the sake of Hashem.

This is explained in many places, including by the Rebbe (לקו”ש ח”ב ע’ 378 ועוד בכ”מ), the Rebbe Rayatz (סה”מ קונטרסים ח”ב ע’ 642), Tanya (אגה”ק סי’ יג), etc., all based on a Zohar.

Oh, and the Vilna Gaon (not quite a Lubavitcher) also writes something similar (ספד”צ פ”ג ד”ה וענין שמא
).

Number two in their religion no one is shown any respect except the seven Rebbe’s

I’m not sure if this is a random attack (in which case there’s no need to answer) or a continuation to the beginning of your post. I will assume the latter.
Anyone familiar with Chabad chassidus, and even more so with the Rebbe’s sichos, know the major levels or respect and veneration for Avraham Avinu, and the aforementioned vort only increases Avraham’s greatness; its point is to prove how Avraham’s avoda was completely selfless.

On Sukkas they honor the Rebbe’s as the actual Ushpizin.

Every night of Sukkos, the Rebbe would say a sicha about that night’s ushpiza according to the Zohar (Avraham, Yitzchak, Yaakov, etc.), and lesson that can be learned from his avoda.

The Rebbe Rayatz said that in addition to those ushpizin, there are also other Ushpizin. Here is a loose translation of the Rebbe Rayatz’s sicha from the first night of Sukkos 5697 (סה”ש תרצ”ז ע’ 197):
“In 5654, in the Sukkah, my father the Rebbe [Rashab] said: By us there are also ushpizin, the Baal Shem Tov, the Maggid [of Mezritch], etc. This means that the first day is Avraham and all those who come with him with the Baal Shem Tov; the second day is Yitzchak etc. with the Maggid, etc.”

I rewrote it. Hopefully it went through this time

Did my post last night to “Chabad Media” go through? About nevuah?

Fandango,

Are you saying that the Democratic Party (Biden, Harris, Schumer, Obama, etc.) doesn’t actually pressure Israel to ease its fight against our enemies and show ‘mercy’ to the ‘poor Palestinians,’ ch”v, with all kinds of bogus ‘peace’ attempts that only encourage the terrorists to fight more whenever they sense weakness?

Menachem Shmei is even worse. He continually challenged me to answer his holy question calling me a liar for ducking the question. I told him several times that no such question was ever asked so he should ask me again. Like the coward he is, he dropped the subject.

See my post #2306326 from August 18 2:54 pm, where I reposted a question that challenges your false accusation that a certain obscure Lubavitch teaching is AZ ch”v.

It’s in clear and simple English.

[It was a long post, and was already posted twice, so I don’t think it’s fair to the readers to copy paste it all over again.]

1) Being a Lubavitcher in the YWNCR.

2) Every Jewish home in frum neighborhoods should have a rifle locked in a safe that can be unlocked remotely by a centralized committee, to be used in case of a riot or pogrom initiated by the alt-right if, ch”v, something catastrophic happens (e.g., Trump being assassinated by a liberal Jew) and figures like Nick, Candace, Andrew, Tucker, or Alex give the signal to incite violence similar to the Crown Heights riots (or George Floyd protests), but this time by members of the NRA. The police may not come to protect, and the difference between an unarmed neighborhood and a (even slightly) armed neighborhood is significant.

Everything here was discussed already in previous threads. All just a bunch of foaming at the mouth (perhaps from both sides).

Nice to see that there’s always a Chabad thread (or threads) active.

I looked at the post and I don’t understand your question. I don’t read Yiddish. You have a very good command of English so formulate a question and I’ll try to answer it.

Qwerty, you will lie, lie, and lie to escape the fundamental question that I asked you a dozen times, and formulated beautifully and clearly in English in the aforementioned post.

As I said before, I probably won’t get you to retract your terrible false accusations and מוציא שם רע because you don’t seem to be looking for the truth (though you claim to have an unmatched “logic and love of truth,” neither of which are showing in your posts) but the truth seeking readers will see through your nonsense.