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ubiq: see the following 2 videos showing Dr. Zelenko: Positive updates: The plague will end!
and showing Dr Zelenko 3 min and you will see that zinc is indispensable for treating coronavirus.a) the Brazilian study was not giving zinc, other studies did not mention it I think.
b) The more susceptible patients are deficient in many nutrients, they need the zinc to enable the HPQ to function
c) the first signs in some coronavirus patients is the loss of sense of taste and sense of smell. This indicates a zinc deficiency, as all the zinc in the body has been utilized in fighting coronavirus, so it shows zinc is a must to treat it.
People are giving HOQ without zinc and that defeats the purpose, it is the zinc that completes the cure in combination with the HOQ.
That is the mechanics of the virus.
“So you want other people with underlying conditions without corona virus to be given HOQ?”
No that would be to study safety, and has been done.
Was it found to be safe? It must be safe as it is allowed to be used for other conditions, but in a lower dose.It must have been proved to be safe at a higher dose, but with cautions on heart arrhythmia.You also wrote:”A control in this case would be to take a similar group to the one getting HCQ and NOT giving HCQ.”
They have done this, but without zinc in the HOQ group.
I don’t think it is ethical to stand around and not intervene when people are getting very sick, even if they agree with that, it is “putting a stumbling block before the blind”.Let’s not forget the zinc. People are giving HOQ without zinc and that defeats the purpose, it is the zinc that completes the cure in combination with the HOQ.see the beginning of Dr. Zelenko’s video I cited above in a previous post, he gives a broad outline-
‘Vladimir Zev Zelenko: What works to defeat the virus? How to prevent or weaken the illness?’ at the very beginning.“they all have various underlying medical conditions, all types”
says who? what are the conditions they have?Says Dr Zelenko, he said that.
A control group is comparable to the studied group to see if there is a difference between the two.
So you want other people with underlying conditions without corona virus to be given HOQ?
What about the antibiotic and zinc, you want them to take that too?
Oh and of course the invasive intubation, why not?!No, they (the 405 group) are already naturally randomized, they all have various underlying medical conditions, all types, and the control group are the ones who have not yet developed any underlying medical conditions as yet, obviously, as they have not been chosen to be in the “high-risk group”.
ubiq,
I, ready now wrote previously-
” In the 405 high risk group a mortality of 5% would have been expected but 2 people died unfortunately, much less than the 20 expected.”
you wrote-
how do we know it wasn’t chance? How do we know it wasn’t something else about them?I am writing now, that, “chance”, can be said of any study, that is the point of aggregating numbers of people who all have very different susceptibilities into a result.
apnoea “black boxes” which are modified and CPAP machines (continuous positive airway pressure) rather than ventilators. see-
Hero doctors in Warrington develop new COVID-19 treatment that is saving lives-
I wrote previously-
“Poor said “Instead of stiff lungs, the Mount Sinai investigation found the most seriously ill patients were suffering from “markedly abnormal coagulation.”
“MOST OF THE SERIOUSLY ILL PATIENTS”
But Dr. Zelenko is beginning treatment before they get to that stage”--much earlier than you appear to suggest as you keep saying most patients infected with COVID 19 do not get sick or recover.
But we are trying to avoid deaths so it would be better to intervene earlier if it will make a difference which it does appear to be doing. Dr Zelenko had 2 deaths out of 1450 patients. In the 405 high risk group a mortality of 5% would have been expected but 2 people died unfortunately, much less than the 20 expected. This is from the video. ‘Vladimir Zev Zelenko: What works to defeat the virus? How to prevent or weaken the illness?’ at the very beginning.From “Doctors warn coronavirus causing blood clots and sudden strokes in young healthy patients”:
“Dr Thomas Oxley, a neurosurgeon in the Mount Sinai Health System in New York, said his team usually treats less than two stroke patients under the age of 50 every month. But in the last two weeks they have seen five young coronavirus patients who suffered a sudden stroke despite being otherwise well.
“The virus seems to be causing increased clotting in the large arteries, leading to severe stroke,” Dr Oxley told CNN. “Our report shows a seven-fold increase in incidence of sudden stroke in young patients during the past two weeks. Most of these patients have no past medical history and were at home with either mild symptoms (or in two cases, no symptoms) of COVID.
“All tested positive. Two of them delayed calling an ambulance.””Poor said “Instead of stiff lungs, the Mount Sinai investigation found the most seriously ill patients were suffering from “markedly abnormal coagulation.”
“MOST OF THE SERIOUSLY ILL PATIENTS”
But Dr Zelenko is beginning treatment before they get to that stage.
That is the point. And further they say it might be a “blood” disease rather than a virus.As for the the dear 52 year old lady who was not even on a respirator, in the excerpt I posted in my previous post, there could possibly be other factors but we do not do autopsies.
2scents said ‘Politicians should not do anything to influence treatment guidelines, it is not their area of expertise.’
but they can get advice and of course some also have brains.
ubiq said ‘ready
” but you ubiq see the end game when it is almost, just almost too late, but still not quite too late.”
I dont know what end game you are referring to’
come on ubiq, mes, that is what.
From an article on ywn today-‘ It seems that some otherwise improving patients experience rapid deterioration, which blindsides doctors and leaves family members mourning in complete shock.”she was in relatively light condition. She was not on a respirator.Just a half an hour later, she was gone’
Dr Poor: “They all had this striking physiology where they had difficulty getting oxygen into the blood and getting carbon dioxide out, but notably their lungs were not stiff,” Poor said.Instead of stiff lungs, the Mount Sinai investigation found the most seriously ill patients were suffering from “markedly abnormal coagulation.” In other words, blood clots were blocking the vessels that carry oxygen to multiple organ systems.”Ubiq,
“Also, not only is Dr. Zelenko …”
No I didnt write says ubiquitin, and ubiq yes, you are correct it was 2scents who wrote that.Ubiq then did write about ” but look as though they might need hospitalization if he doesn’t treat them immediately.”
the following: “not sure what that means. This is a nonesenical claim and is one that you made up .”No, no ubiq, the Dr, he has a heart, he can see the way things progress, he reacts with a brain and with compassion, but you ubiq see the end game when it is almost, just almost too late, but still not quite too late.
When people wait to confirm with tests, which are sometimes even unavailable, they loose time.
Timing is of the essence.Dr Zelenko only medicates high-risk patients with symptoms or younger patients who look very ill.
But he has also developed a regimen for prophylactic treatment against COVID 19, with different doses but without the antibiotic, for medical and nursing staff.
Ubiq, you wrote:
“Also, not only is Dr. Zelenko still working on figuring this out and gathering anecdotal data, I am sure he understands that taking these medications have side effects, some benign that only cause people to be uncomfortable and others that are more severe such as changes in the electrical conduction of the heart that makes the patient vulnerable to deadly dysrhythmias”Just have a look at this video of DR Zelenko speaking on youtube on April 10 ‘020 entitled :GVA conference. He only medicates high-risk patients with symptoms or younger patients who look very ill.
He says the negative side effects are “theoretical in his experience.” So he is treating patients before they get desperately sick who do not need necessarily hospitalization immediately but look as though they might need hospitalization if he doesn’t treat them immediately.Ubiq wrote “As an aside, my hospital stopped giving Azithromycin along with the HCQ and zinc given the high number of QT prolongations occurring”
So please what are they giving? HCQ without antibiotics but with zinc? are these your own Hospital trials you referred to earlier?
Why don’t you contact Dr. Zelenco as to how he is monitoring adverse effects?
Yes, until the quote of yours that I rehashed above in this post, you have ignored zinc.8-12 hours from Dr. Anthony Cardillo or a few days (perhaps a couple of days, I cannot recall except it was “fast” as well, for recovery from Dr Zelenco, that is great, they may not need an EKK if the patient is recovered and perhaps already off the regimen.
ubiq:
You Ubiq said that your hospital is not medicating coronavirus patients.
Please confirm what your hospital is doing for these patients
Those Dr Zelenko treated were technically all sick, he was being abundantly cautious as he does not use a crystal ball, baruch Hashem!.“and patients should be carefully watched for heart problems, as well as screened beforehand.”
Is Dr. Zelenko doing that
Why wouldn’t he be doing that, he is a Dr with a brain.Yes, there are risks but as with all side effects and contraindications. they must be assessed or each patient.
You are yet again avoiding the zinc!
Dr Zelenco had at the time several hundred patients on his “quick, fast” regimen, and no deaths.
Better than the alternative.Ubiq:
I am addressing it to you because you asked what my point is, about why people are so against HOQ. So if more people would be more informed they would not be so against it.
The treatment should be early according to one Dr and only for seriously progressed sick patients according to another DR,(the only disadvantage could be as has been pointed out that the supply of HOQ to people with other chronic ailments who regularly use it might run out).
The zinc is apparently essential, and you have also more or less side stepped that issue.
The dose of HOQ should not be high as the Brazilian study shows, and patients should be carefully watched for heart problems, as well as screened beforehand.
No one is making a song and dance about the cardiotoxicity of the different antibiotics used.
Ubiq:
I repeat, “PS, in the Brazillian study, there was no zinc, and HOQ was not used, they used Chloroquine which is more toxic than HOQ, with the cardiotoxic antibiotics.”
So it means as I have said before, that zinc is an essential component with using HCQ, and precautions must be taken against using high doses of the drug for an extended time (The Dr here in the latest video I have cited sees a cure in 8-12 hours) and chloroquine is much more toxic than HCQ, so HCQ should be used instead.
So if more people would be more informed ……. That is the point. Okay?
Please see a youtube video entitled: “LA doctor seeing success with hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19“”, wherein Dr. Anthony Cardillo says very sick from coronavirus patients need only 8- 12 hours treatment with HOQ AND ZINC to get completely well!
He also says prescribing doctors must use caution with heart patients.
He says HOQ alone, without ZINC does nothing for the c-virus.PS in the Brazillian study, there was no zinc, and HOQ was not used, they used Chloroquine which is more toxic than HOQ, with the cardiotoxic antibiotics.
Ubiq,
It was unsafe in the high doses and safer at the lower doses and in BOTH the groups, but they were also giving two cardiotoxic antibiotics, and they did not eliminate patients for having prior cardiac problems (for the purpose of the study).
They could lower the does even further, they do not have to stick to the recommendations.In that Brazilian study “81 patients….. were hospitalized with severe respiratory syndrome”.
That is not what the Jewish doctor did. He treated his patients before they reached such a state, from what I understand.From the article,
“Overall, at least two patients in the high-dose group developed ventricular tachycardia, a type of arrhythmia that can lead to sudden cardiac death and none in the low-dose group developed the condition, according to the pre-print study’s data.”In the low dose group no one died from the toxic effect of the drugs.
Most of the patients died from Coronvirus un-intercepted by heart attack, if that is the right way to put it, not from any adverse reaction to the HCQ.
Significantly the zinc was not mentioned. It is the final bomb against the virus.
6 out of 40 deaths is 15% death rate in the lower HCQ group, but where is the zinc?!The zinc is there to fight the virus and to not let the patient succumb to the virus rather than making a high dose safer.
Further to what I wrote just above,
see: “Heart risk concerns mount around use of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine for Covid-19 treatment” (google it) to see the tests for HOC.They are NOT using an untreated control group.
COULD NOT SEE ANY ZINC THERE!
It is zinc that does the final knockout to the virus! Where is it?“some may have died, has v’sholom”
yes “MAY” have died.No not making any assumptions, just taking what the Dr said at face value, that he is sure the ones he treated were coronavirus.
Oh, by the way, have you noticed that the TB vaccine may also be useful?
Ubiq wrote: “I have no idea what you are saying. a. He DID give his regimen to people who might not have it and b. We don’t know what would have happened to any sick people had they not gotten it (the vast vast majority of these patients do fine)”
a0 No, he gave the regimen to people who showed symptoms.
b) If any sick people would not have been given his regimen, some may have died, has v’sholom.
c) By not giving the regimen to sick people who later do “fine”, he is exposing them to death as he cannot foretell or predict who will become sicker and then die.
d) You are asking for sick people to not be treated, for the sake of a “scientific study”, when it is known that the medication, in a life and death scenario, does on occasion work. That is not good, in the real world.
Ubiq,
“it isn’t random” because he is saving sick people’s lives.How on earth was he supposed to use his med regimen on people who in a “random sample” might not even have had coronavirus infection?! Of course he treated sick people as he said.
“if you take a random sample of 500 at-risk people WHO HAVE SYMPTOMS” means that it is random only in the sense that it is “first to need my services will ring my office for an appointment first”, and they are not selected by any other criteria, eg, gender, age , height, or any other disability or disease.
Ubiq,
The following is a headline from dailymail ” Britain’s coronavirus deaths surge past grim 10,000 milestone – even as death and infection rates drop: Further 737 people die taking total to 10,612 as cases rise by 5,288 to 84,279″
10,612 divided by 84,279 = That makes 12.59% death rate.
Very serious. Side effects can be avoided if patients are screened for heart trouble, they might even be able to have the medication for a more limited time, perhaps.Ubiq:
You made you “walking well”! You say “well”, everyone else says ” I am running from this”!
The people he treated had coronavirus symptoms which are different from the flu.
Of all people who have symptoms 7 to 13% die, see the stats everywhere from many countries, that is the pandemic you appear to dismiss as not requiring serious measures.Ubiq: you wrote “So we have a bunch of patients who may or may not have done well without HCQ, and they did well with HCQ. What does that tell us? Nothing”
No incorrect.
What it does tell us is that the 7 % to 13 % who would have died had they not received the HCQ with the antibiotic and the zinc did not die!that is the point.
hi, the posts -the latest ones, are not showing up.
Ubiq:
You said, “Yes, the vast vast majority of people with symptoms do well without HCQ.”But the POINT IS: you do NOT know which ones!
You do not know which ones will do well without HCQ if they have symptoms.THAT is the POINT!
It is dangerous to suggest such a thing1
No, dumb idea. Like murder.
Ubiq: I am really not picking on you!
You said, “Yes, the vast vast majority of people with symptoms do well without HCQ.”But the POINT IS: you do NOT know which ones!
You do not know which ones will do well without HCQ if they have symptoms.THAT is the POINT!
Ubiq:”Say you give it to 1000 people who were healthy and were going to do well anyway.”
No, the Dr gave the med to people who were showing symptoms.
Ubiq: “Keep in mind the vast vast majority of those infected do just fine ”
The point is, that the fatalities come from the “majority” and emerge as minority mortality.
So the Dr. Vladimir Zelenko said that in 699 COVID-19 cases, there was a 100% success rate.You can be sure he was treating people with some symptoms.
You cannot expect to cure asymptomless people nor do a study on them.
ubiq: “thats why we need studies”
The study is in progress, see above, and here below where we have the following:From “COVID-19: More Great News” below the video is from Dr. Eric Berg DC:
“Dr. Vladimir Zelenko said that in 699 COVID-19 cases, there was a 100% success rate. He used hydroxychloroquine, z-pack, and zinc. He’s recommending to hit the virus hard and EARLY with this protocol.”He’s recommending Early!100% success rate!
Who would wait around till later?If 100% of people with covid 19 are recovering with the hydroxychloroquine then no one is progressing to the5% mortality phase, so it is a success!
Possibly the hydroxychloroquine with the z pack and the zinc will work on the very sick patients too- we need the stats, the data.
Remember sightly or moderately sick people, some have been getting even sicker, has v sholom!Ubiq:”I haven’t found it to be working.
That said for a sick patient the benefit (possible survival) outweighs the risk so might as well give it.”Have you used it with the z-pack and zinc?
Fauci does not want to.
From “COVID-19: More Great News” below the video is from Dr. Eric Berg DC:
“Dr. Vladimir Zelenko said that in 699 COVID-19 cases, there was a 100% success rate. He used hydroxychloroquine, z-pack, and zinc. He’s recommending to hit the virus hard and early with this protocol.”This information is filtering out and we hope it is being used.
The doctors who know want to use it, surely!?There are 36 hidden tzaddikim. They are already praying. Have faith in Hashem only and pray too.
No person is perfect, no family is perfect, no community is perfect.
Guessing and speaking is not perfect, it is lashon hara.
Some people need reminding that respect and civility are still valued and required midos.
Wholesale virulent unrelenting condemnation of the L T community by Jews shows that anti-antisemitism has infiltrated the”chosen”.CORRECTION!!!!!:
Further to what I wrote above, the following are the last lines on star-k .org/articles/kashrus-kurrents/563/electric-shavers/
“So too, in a similar manner, R’ Moshe would often test the sharpness of an electric shaver’s blades. He would take a beard hair and test the blades! The shaver would be acceptable if the hair was held taut and was not split in half.The only practical suggestion that can be given to one whose shaver failed this test is to dull the blades,…..done by taking a key or some other hard, flat instrument and running it along the sharp edge of the blade. Obviously, this shaver will not work as well; nevertheless, it is still effective and will transform a previously questionable shaver into one that is acceptable by the Poskim who permit the use of shavers. ”
BUT I believe the “foils” in the electric shavers are also very sharp! As could be the case also with the “guards”.
So it is not clear that even blunting the “blades” would be enough, as the presence of a sharp instrument in the form of a foil or a guard would not be “scissors”, but would be shaving with a blade, issur, prohibited!Keep your beard, just trim with scissors, but not the corners!
: “f. In all the electric shavers, the cutting process is one of contact between a moving blade and the head (a metal screen). Thus, from the point of view of the action performed, these machines are scissors. And this is the basis of our current position.” FROM “zomet. org.il, certifications and guidelines, electric shavers” . Just copy this and google it, the top most result at the top of the page will give you the above information, amongst other information. Just click on the picture of the shaver when you get there!
I read on another website some time ago that the saver should be dismantled in the “cutting section” and the
B\blades” should be blunted with a metal object and then reassembled, but could not find that website today!