Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Hopefully no one relies on that Hataras Nedarim. Most assume that it’s symbolic. If they need a real Hatarah, they do it at the right time.
ca: Maybe they went in to check and make sure there were no mice near the body. They went in 7 days before instead of 8 because they thought that was enough. They miscalculated.
The difference between a legitimate Halachic opinion and holding by a very minor Daas Yachid is that it is wrong. So yes, if Chalav Stam was an incredibly minority opinion that no one held like, then it would be wrong to force people to hold like it and probably Assur to do so. Since it’s a relatively mainstream opinion, that’s fine.
This is not Davening, or Tznius, or Chalav Stam. This is an incredibly Mechudash Shittah that doesn’t make any sense in practical Halachic terms. R’ Vosner was entitled to an opinion. Random Rabbonim of communities are not, especially in an area such as this.
newbee: The Rishonim talk about why those few cases in the Gemara weren’t suicide. Well, sort of. There are a few Rishonim that comment though most don’t.
I don’t have a chance to look at the Shvus Yaakov here, but if I recall correctly he’s one of the ones who quotes the Besamim Rosh, no?
newbee: Try 19a, I think.
Do you at least admit that the suicide thing is from a non-source?
GAW: But they are claiming that this is Halachah, not social construct.
a mamin: There are plenty of Chassiduses that don’t let you leave, too. The antisemitic sections of the media love telling the stories where people have trouble leaving. They exaggerate them, certainly. But not everyone can leave if they want.
a jew who cares and others: I have seen many people, some of whom are from very Yeshivish communities, who see a community-wide ban on women driving as abusive.
apushatayid: Did you see my analogy? Would that also be none of anyone’s business?
Joseph: Elaborate, please? I have never claimed that everyone agrees with all that everyone does. Only defended people from improperly-placed attacks. Also, it’s a lot easier to say “Yeish Al Mi Lismoch” in Bein Adam LaMakoms than Bein Adam LaChaveiros.
1. There is no way to ever know, hence it is foolish to assume that you missed it.
2 and 3. Every couple is different. No couple never fights.
DY: Fasting is something separate from physically hurting oneself. We completely reject self-damaging just as we completely reject those Rishonim who were corporealists. We minimize fasting because of your Sevara. That’s not why we don’t beat ourselves.
newbee: It’s a “Tshuvah” in the Besamim Rosh. It’s a Gemara at the beginning of Nazir. It calls unnecessary fasting a Chotei. Fasting to fix a bad dream is not unnecessary. It’s the only way to fix that bad dream. And then, as a Middah K’negged Middah Kaparah, you need to fast again.
ca: It could be they messed up the Din and thought that if they became Tahor on Shvi’i they could bring the Korban because they would be Tahor the night after.
a mamin and apushatayid: I’m not saying it’s relevant in this case, but “it’s none of your business” isn’t an option. If people believe this is an actually untenable Shittah, they have a right to call out. If a major Posek of a tiny Chassidish community advocated beating wives to enforce Tznius, it would be wrong of us to not be up in arms. That’s obviously an extreme case. But if people view a ban on driving as abusive, they have a moral imperative to mention it.
DY: I was told he got around the prize money by selling it to a Goy somehow.
And I think GAW is right on the Amira L’Akum issue. The jockey’s name will go down in history for winning the Triple Crown. He wants this as much as the owner does. It’s not like he’s being hired to do a job. He was selected for a privilege that he was ecstatic to be given.
DY: Among the major Poskim in Klal Yisrael, R’ Vosner stands alone on this.
And the T’shuvah is very bare and difficult to understand. I would have loved to have asked him about this while he was alive, but if I had to guess he was told stories of inappropriate activities between driving instructors and students (which presumably happened) and that was where the Issur came from.
DY: It’s a real concept for when it happens to someone, not doing it to themselves. Sure, you might dig that up in some Rishonim. But there are tons of completely rejected Shittos in Yiddishkeit that we assume have no validity. This is one of them.
newbee: By self-inflicted suffering I meant physical suffering, such as those who used to flagellate themselves. And the Gemara does call one who fasts a Chotei.
DY: What’s this Tshuvas HaMishkal?
Joseph: We should not teach women to walk because that also is important for them to leave the house.
newbee: My source is that there is no source. That’s kinda the whole point. We all know the source is fake.
The way I always heard it, which doesn’t make sense either, is that it’s Chinuch on the Mitzvah of Peiyos.
Brisker Rov: Without digressing further (because I really don’t think we should get into this), those who hold he’s Assur to listen to hold that way because they think he wasn’t so holy or the deepest of the deep.
DY: newbee was.
And self-inflicted suffering isn’t Mechaper. It’s Mechayev. You don’t atone for Issurim by doing additional Issurim.
Brisker Rov: It’s a Machlokes Rishonim whether “Natural Law” exists and why that may or may not be relevant.
Brisker Rov: You will not find any source Assering music during Sefirah or the 3 weeks before the Pri Chadash. The Mishnah Berurah quotes this Pri Chadash. The general Mehalach in Rov Poskim is to treat Sefirah and the 3 weeks the same. Contemporary Chassidish Halachah Seforim make some Chilukim. The reason this is very Sasum in the Poskim is because they are all working under the assumption of OC 560:3. When people started listening to music all year round, Minhagim developed as to how to treat music during Sefirah and the 3 weeks. This point is all Talui on Minhag. There is no “Halachah” about it because, on a simple level, Halachah says all music is Assur all year round.
DY: The Poskim came out very strongly against those who tortured themselves.
Anyone who “Mattired” suicide as a form of Teshuvah did so out of the mistaken assumption that the Rosh said it first. The Rosh never said that.
Brisker Rov: It’s so nice that you are able to make Halachic distinctions between Minhagim.
newbee: Yes it is so Pashut. The Makor for such a Shittah was a “Sefer” written with the intention of destroying the Halachic process and has no Halachic weight whatosever.
I don’t like dafbiyun’s story, though Yasher Koach on quitting smoking. (That’s not how Halachah works; we should never assume when we can actually learn what the right thing. To quote R’ Schachter (from another context), not learning the Halachah and just deciding to be Machmir is making a man-made religion. We have a God-given religion, that sometimes tells us to be Meikil and sometimes to be Machmir. Zil Gmor.)
See Yabiya Omer 9 108:43.
Also, when you see OC 1:6, it’s entirely possible that R’ Ovadia did not hold that recorded Kol Isha (so long as there are no Hirhurim) is Assur outside of Devarim Shebikdushah.
I have heard from Talmidim of R’ Ovadiah (who I will keep nameless, because as far as I know they have never stated these things publicly) that of course R’ Ovadia knew what she looked like–her picture was on every street corner in Egypt when he lived there.
Mentsch: I already pointed out that you are probably incorrect in your citation of Acher.
And I think you need to understand confirmation bias. If you define listening as a relapse, then of course it hurts your Yiddishkeit. But if you don’t view it as bad for Yiddishkeit in and of itself, it probably won’t.
There are many studies that show that workers work better with background music. And it’s B’feirush in Poskim that if the music is to help you work, it is Muttar.
Really, mods? If you didn’t let the link through, fine. But what’s wrong with the post?
R’ Aharon Lichtenstein wrote a classic article on this issue titled, “Does Jewish Tradition Recognize an Ethic Independent of Halakha?”
sushi: Disagree. Punk rock, rap, R&B, and similar are violent and lewd because of the society that created them. There’s plenty of emotional R&B. It’s just less common because the community that likes R&B best prefers its “gangsta” culture in its music right now.
Avram: Only because you characterize terminating the pregnancy as “killing an unborn baby”. He clearly doesn’t.
DY: Well, I believe that is one of the Tzitz Eliezer’s Taanos on R’ Moshe.
And frankly, life isn’t cheap. General society values life more now than ever before in history.
DY: R’ Moshe is certainly a minority opinion in this. He’s how every Posek in America holds, but most Poskim agreed with the Tzitz Eliezer.
And your claim isn’t fair. They don’t hold it’s okay to kill babies. They hold fetuses aren’t babies.
newbee: I would have commented that the Gra only matters if you did Tannaim already, which no one does (and which wouldn’t matter anyway because our Tannaim are totally meaningless) had you not preceded me with your comment.
I didn’t say actually do it. It’s not relevant nowadays anyway. I was just responding to what I perceived as an insult to the Gra,
42: I would assume your assumption is correct. Well, not the Gra per se, But the Cherem he’s referring to.
newbee: Well, the Gra really did hold that way.
Or we should only listen to uplifting music at all, whether Jewish or not.
Why did you start this thread asking for suggestions if you were going to drive home your opinion a day later anyway?
Daniell: Everything you do in life rubs off on you. That’s how we exist as people. So if a song is inappropriate it will have a negative effect. If a song is Minus it will have a negative effect. If a song is uplifting and thoughtful it will have that effect, whether written by a Jew or non-Jew.
You are asking two different questions. The first is answered by a Gemara (yes, there is a difference). The second is a classical philosophical/theological conundrum that would take a very long time to answer.
I love it. Stam people dictating extreme recourses for T’shuvah. I mean, I happen to agree in this example. But at least I know that my opinion on this issue is worthless.