ZSK

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  • in reply to: Rabbi Yaakov Kamenetsky and the modern State of Israel #2429031
    ZSK
    Participant

    “the requirement of every Jew to personally adamantly reject Zionism”

    Speak for yourself.

    Like I’ve said to HaKatan multiple times: R Teitelbaum did not have binding authority outside his community. Period. Ergo we do not have to listen to his opinion.

    in reply to: Any Seminary experts? #2427552
    ZSK
    Participant

    AAQ’s response is the best.

    Definitely do not send your daughter to EY to seminary.

    Source: Partially from having witnessed many, many public displays of bad behavior on the part of seminary girls in EY, and mostly based on Mrs. ZSK’s knowledge of how seminaries work, her experience, and her friends’ experiences.

    ZSK
    Participant

    Grow up.

    ZSK
    Participant

    HaKatan:

    1) It’s fine. Do learn some Arabic. If not, read Risaala Al-Yemeniyya with a reliable translation. The Arabic and Hebrew are slightly different and the context and position of the Oaths therein, as well as their use, is important. It’s not pratical Halacha there, it’s a rhetorical device. The Qafih (Hebrew) edition is best.

    2) I didn’t question whether the various authorities quote them. That was never a doubt.

    3) For the millionth and final time, I questioned: (a) the practical Halachik applicability of the Oaths, considering (1) Halachik methodologies and approaches to Halacha vs. Aggada, (2) the context of Ashkenaz vs. Sephard, Edot HaMizrach and Teimanim and (3) the very different reality we live in where there is a Jewish state in existence as opposed to the past where this wasn’t even our ancestors’ foggiest dreams; (b) R Teitelbaum’s authority to issue his ruling considering the factured state of Halacha and our (Jewish) legal system, and (c) the supposedly binding nature of such ruling outside his community.

    You’d be surprised to learn that you and I probably agree on more than we disagree. Which is the case with most Charedim, Datiim and MO.

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2426714
    ZSK
    Participant

    Ujm:

    “Right wing” or “too Jewish” has nothing to do with my reaction.

    A significant portion of your post history is a nasty screed and canard against the RZ Tzibbur that demonstrates your true colors – a deep-seated hatred for that community and EY. This thread continues such.

    Quit the darvo already. You are not the victim here.

    Anyone can look at your posts, then look at mine, and figure out that my reaction to this thread – which never should have been started in the first place – is based on your documented post history.

    End of discussion.

    ZSK
    Participant

    1) Risaala Al-Yemeniyya is Iggeret Teiman, not Dalalat Al-Hai’irin – aka Moreh Nevuchim. Go learn Arabic. And yes, Rambam’s opinion does in fact matter, because you keep on invoking Rambam to back your case, when that simply isn’t so.

    As for other Poskim, it may be the Ashkenazi position that the rulings of previous leaders must be taken into account. But it is just that, an Ashkenazi position and tendency. It is not a Sephardic position at all, nor it is an absolute amongst Ashkenazim. In fact, because there is no Sanhedrin and more often than not there is no central bais din in any given city, no Rav has binding authority. Therefore, we can respectfully question and reject a previous court’s ruling with justifiable reason for doing so. If you bothered to read that acutal works of the Rambam (and Ri Megash, and the Rif) you keep on trying to use to back your case, you would know this.

    Which leads to my next point.

    2) Re Aggadeta. This actually matters, but you’re not listening so we’re done here.

    3) You’re not listening again. I’m saying that R Teitelbaum did not have any binding authority over anyone other than his community. Period. End of discussion. He did not. No one recognized him as having any binding authority outside of his direct followers and those who joined his “Chassidus” in the wake of the Holocaust after their religious communities were annihilated by the Nazis YMSV”Z. He didn’t even have binding authority within his city of residence, much less in Hungary, Eastern Europe, Ashkenaz or all of Am Yisrael.

    Kindly stop with the nonsense that a R Teitelbaum had absolute authority over all of Am Yisrael to issue his ruling when he did not.

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2425764
    ZSK
    Participant

    @ujm – Keep telling yourself that. Your post history shows otherwise.

    @AAQ – I don’t get the deletion of the thread either. Once we got past the hatchet job part, that was a really tame discussion heading into Ashkenazi and Sephardic methodologies. Really tame, especially in comparison to the more bombastic threads here.


    @YYA
    – I find that most American Jews are very unfamiliar with life in Israel.

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2425231
    ZSK
    Participant

    So ujm, you intend to call anyone else a non-Jew or is it just me? You might as well do so now and tell us all how many of us who support the State of Israel aren’t Jewish according to you.

    You digging in your heels on your accusation shows that either my subsequent post saying you’re a troll and possibly not Yeshivish is true, or that I am a bit to close to the mark for your comfort regarding your real life beliefs about your fellow Jews.

    I will point out that you haven’t denied the hatred in question here.

    I will also point out that I never said Golus ended – it hasn’t and that’s obvious. Whether we are currently in אתחלתא דגאולה or עיקבתא דמשיחא is another matter, one you and I will clearly disagree about עד ביאת גואל, may he come within the next few weeks.

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2425129
    ZSK
    Participant

    @ujm: I’m well aware of that. However, there are also many, many families who cannot trace back past 1-2 generations before the Holocaust. I consider myself lucky that I B”H can trace my family back to just before the Haskalah started. Also what YYA said, which is why I responded to you in the first place, because I am aware of those Halachos in Yore De’ah.

    Let me guess, you’re casting doubt on my Jewishness because (1) I disagree with you over one issue – the State of Israel, and (2) because of a deleted thread where I defended a so-called “Conservative Rabbi” who wasn’t actually Conservative, and called out Artscroll for slander. That isn’t a good reason.

    Grow up.


    @YYA
    : That is true and I tend to agree with you. Usually you don’t find Chassidim on the internet, but there are exceptions. As it happens, I do question just how Yeshivish/Chassidish ujm, HaKatan and somejewiknow actually are (I increasingly believe they are either flame throwing secular, OTD or MO trolls posing as Yeshivish). However, I unfortunately have had nothing but really bad interactions with Satmar and Vizhnitz Chassidim.


    @GadolHadofi
    : Could be. More likely he just didn’t like me calling him out.

    ZSK
    Participant

    “I don’t understand why these Zionist idolaters continue to insist they are right and making silly claims like the Satmar Rav does not pasken for all of Jewry and the like.”

    Because you don’t understand or know how Rabbinic authority works post-Bavli. That is patently obvious from your responses.

    “The Satmar Rav was not the one who invented the oaths and their halachic applicability. But he does bring down numerous poskim through the ages, including BUT NOT LIMITED TO the Rambam, who invoked them as halachically binding. The midrash indicates that the oaths were the reason or the unimaginable ocean of Jewish blood spilled in response to Ben Koziva’s rebellion in Beisar. And on and on and on. Even the famous supposed quote from the Or Sameach that the Zionists love to distort (as mentioned above), clearly indicates that the oaths are halacha. Period. Please stop already with the nonsense that it is “non-halachic” just because it’s mentioned in an aggadita gemara.”

    Go read Risaala Al-Yemeniyya in Arabic with Mori Qafih’s translation into Hebrew already. Learn Arabic. You don’t know what you’re talking about.

    in reply to: Davening for Russian-Jewish Soldiers #2424414
    ZSK
    Participant

    According to Joseph, Not Israeli obviously. Everyone else.

    Stirring the pot again are we?

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2424243
    ZSK
    Participant

    @YYA – Yes, all that is true. Ujm, HaKatan and Somejew have never experienced any of this (which I suspect you and I regularly interact with, since we both actually live in Israel).

    Ujm/Joseph is absolutely a pyromaniac type troll (see his thread about reparations to slave owners as an example of that), but I still felt it necessary to respond to a claim that I’m somehow not Halachically Jewish when I can B”H document my family back at least 250-275 hundred years, which is more thoroughly than some of the frummest descendants of holocaust survivors, who most unfortuntately cannot trace their families back more than 3-4 generations.

    Most people’s actions and statements in real life are very different from online. It’s very easy to hide behind a pseudonym.

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2423641
    ZSK
    Participant

    ujm: I have a family tree that demonstrates clear Jewish lineage on my mother’s side from at least the 1700s and on my father’s side from at least the mid 1800s.

    Try again, Sonei Yisrael.

    in reply to: Israel is in Golus #2422603
    ZSK
    Participant

    Ujm hates Eretz Yisrael, his fellow Bnei Yisrael and especially the RZ Tzibbur.

    Nothing new here.

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2422386
    ZSK
    Participant

    @HaKatan: Child, bless your heart (I mean that as the lowest form of insult). You’re utterly wrong, but it’s okay. I’ve spent enough time disproving your weak opinion and you know it.


    @somejew
    – A spokesperson for Neturei Karta is not a valid source for anything. You know why.

    @Non political – So Charedim can insist that the RZ Tzibbur follow their Rabbonim, their minhagim, etc.? No, two can play that game.

    The reason for my requiring a court to issue a binding takana is simple: Charedim claim they are the only ones who truly represent Judaism. That’s a joke and utterly ridiculous, but that’s the claim. If that’s the case, then you need to show me you followed the Halachic process when deciding that Charedim should be except while everyone else isn’t. The most indisputable to do that is a Beis Din issuing a binding takana. Otherwisem, anything stated or published, whether proclamation or signed Pashkevillim – which everyone knows are an absolute joke and not worth the paper they are printed on – are simply written responsa to be considered but not binding in any manner since we have good reason for such, and there is no excuse for no service. It’s really that simple.

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2421646
    ZSK
    Participant

    @HaKatan:

    Nice job trying to pull DARVO (“deny, attack, reverse victim and offender” for the ignorant). You’re not getting away with it.

    You are on record consistently and constantly denigrating the RZ community and flipping accusations of heresy. Your statements are literally all over this forum and you know it. If the mods allowed screenshots and links, I’d just post them all. They are even within this thread. Don’t deny it.

    If you haven’t gotten my point or understood anything I’ve posted, how I’ve consistently questioned and taken apart the various things you – and somejewiknow – have posted to defend your position – in extreme detail, I might add, you’ll never get it. All your present response definitively demonstrates is just how unlettered, closed-minded and unwilling to be educated you are.

    Improve your reading comprehension, go back through my reponses to you, learn something and bother to internalize what I’ve written.

    Regardless, you are absolutely and indubitably wrong, there is no doubt about that.

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2421223
    ZSK
    Participant

    @HaKatan: Denigration? Go look in the mirror. You are guilty of that more than anyone here.

    You and your ilk should take back every single horrible thing you have said about the RZ and MO communities over the years. And again, I will note you have never substantially answered anything I have said in rebuttal to you, ever. You instead either don’t respond or continue to quote the same Rabbonim and repeat the same slander and misinformation, even when it has been called out, taken apart, questioned and utterly debunked.


    @UJM
    : Joseph, don’t play innocent. You know as well as I do that you think the RZ community believes that DBG and TH were Moshaich, which is false.

    @Non Political:
    It’s also not good form to constantly call the RZ community heretics and project what you think the RZ community believes without even attempting to find out what those beliefs are.

    Re hagiographies, nice red herring, but I’ll bite. If you think hagiographies are reverance rather than deification or something slightly less worse, Chassidishe Rebbelach and Roshei Yeshiva being attributed the sort of divine spirit Christians claim their saints have, and you have no problem with that, you’re being obtuse. On top of that, hagiographies give wrong impressions of real lives, which are often more inspirational than claims like “Rashi knew all of Chumash by heart at age 5”. But that isn’t my point and it never was. My point is that the above behavior combined with Rabbonim ruling and controlling their followers by edicts and bad actors (and there is no way you will convince me that Askanim are good for the community) rather than through an actual Bais Din with Takanos duly issued per the prescribed process in the Rambam, Mishna and Bavli does actually replace the Torah with something else. And I will repeat that this was in direct response to HaKatan once again accusing me of heresy, which is so far from the truth it is ridiculous.

    As as side point: Regarding Rav Aharon Feldman in particular (who wasn’t even on the radar in my comment since he isn’t part of the Charedi establishment in Bnei Brak and Yerushalayim), I’m very well acquainted with his extended family and his beliefs reflect living in Bnei Brak for many years, as opposed to the rest of his family that have far more nuanced beliefs, which I have first hand knowledge of. And that is with all due respect to him as the Rosh Yeshiva of Ner Yisrael, et cetera.

    Re Gezeros, Takanos and Pesakim regarding the Army and the State, okay, I’ll play ball. If a recognized local Beis Din had gotten up in 1947-1948 and duly issued a Gezera, Takana or Pesak that it is prohibited to serve in the army or have anything to do with the State for xyz Halachic reason, that would be one thing. There would be clear grounds avoid contact with the state and a justification for such. That has not happened. To the best of my knowledge, no Beis Din with any sort of binding authority has done any such thing (remember, binding authority is either through a local court or a national court, the latter of which has not existed since the Bavli, if not earlier). There have been proclamations and statements by Rabbonim as well as Seforim written about the subject. Those are not Takanos, Gezeros or Pesakim. They aren’t binding. Therefore, there is no excuse for avoiding the IDF beyond not trusting Chilonim, which while totally understandable (I’m not thrilled about my kids serving in the army in the distant future, especially together with Chilonim, and that is putting it extremely mildly) is still not a good enough excuse to avoid service at all costs, especially considering the efforts the IDF actually does take to ensure that Charedim can maintain their lifestyle within reason.

    None of you have to like my opinion and that’s fine. However, I demand the same respect for the RZ community that the Charedi community demands; I insist on it and will accept nothing less. These anti-RZ and Israel threads are quite frankly unacceptable.

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2420713
    ZSK
    Participant

    @ujm – If you think the RZ community believes any of that, you’re as guilty as HaKatan.

    in reply to: What now? #2420528
    ZSK
    Participant

    @ujm: absolutely not. Even if I did live in the USA , I would never move to NYC.

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2420536
    ZSK
    Participant

    No, I have not added any such heresy. Rabbonim are not gods, they certainly are not HKB”H Himself, although you may think they are like the Pope (certainly Chassidim behave as such). I’ve responded to you repeatedly, but like usual, either you’re acting in bad faith or your reading comprehension level is considerably lower than I thought, even for an Appalachian Transcarpathian like yourself. To clarify again, because I’m not going to let you claim שתיקה כהודאה:

    1) Charedim have deified Rabbis (see Artscroll hagiographies as blatant examples of that) to the point of the Charedi community replacing the Torah with something else entirely, that being Rabbinic edict and deification of Rabbonim, which beyond being legally unacceptable by Halakhic standards (an actual Bais Din is required for a Gezera or Takana, not what currently occurs in Israel or the Aguda, and certainly not what gets slapped on Pashkevilim) (2) more often than not is not guided by Rabbonim, but by bad actors – also known as Askanim – who provide partial or false information for their own personal gain. This is a known thing, and it is unfortunately only the Charedim who don’t see it or the harm it brings. I lament this state of affairs where I am forced to question what Rabbonim say because it’s simply unconscionable that Rabbonim would actually sign or utter such things; the fact that you don’t get that is very telling.

    Sinas Yisrael is partially what Yankel Berel said – מפקיר דמם של ישראל, which you are guilty of. Sinas Yisrael is accusing an entire community of essentially being an עיר הנדחת, which beyond being completely and utterly false, is acccusing a community of acting in a manner liable for capital punishment, which you’re also guilty of. Sinas Yisrael is taking every single government handout possible and giving nothing material in return, such as paying taxes and working rather than using תורתינו הקדושה כקרדום לחפור בו. Sinas Yisrael is saying “Your children have to die protecting me, but my children will not die protecting you and yours”.

    On the other hand, Sinas Yisrael is not expecting the Charedi community to pull its weight. Do I need to quote Moshe Rabbeinu’s statement to Reuven, Gan and half of Menashe to you? Only Chilonim want to shut down Yeshivos. The RZ community absolutely does not want that, and you declaring such is מוציא שם רע, מוציא לעז, רכילות and לשון הרע, and there certainly is no תועלת in such. What the RZ community wants is for the Charedi community to stop the התנשאות והתנהגות של גאווה toward everyone else and show they actually care. Without minimizing what the Charedi community has done during the last war, more needed to be done, and that more is specifically serving in the army and giving the RZ community a chance to rest.

    Again, I have never said the IDF is perfect. However, the IDF has tried gone far out of its way to create frameworks for Charedim to stay Charedi in the army. The army lets people skip early morning lineups to daven, they bring in Rabbonim to speak (which Chilonim freak out about for no reason other than their total ignorance and שנאת תורה הקדושה), there is maximum effort to meet Kashrus standards. Meanwhile, it’s patently obvious that anyone Charedi who goes OTD while in the army already wanted to do so and is using the IDF as an excuse. But of course, you’ll just use the No True Scotsman fallacy to declare any Charedi person who has served to not truly be Charedi.

    Lastly, for the millionth time: RZ does not worship the State as an idol. Period. The fact that you can’t see that reflects entirely on you.

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2420529
    ZSK
    Participant

    Just think – If you read HaKatan’s history, you will see that he does nothing but slander the entire Religious Zionist community any chance he gets. It’s a constant thing with him.

    Square Root isn’t totally wrong, most unfortunately. I wish he were, but he isn’t.

    I highly suggest you read his post history before assuming I’m picking on anyone

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2420114
    ZSK
    Participant

    HaKatan: “HaTorah haZo lo sihei muchlefes.” You did that with the Rabbonim you worship like Catholics worship G-d via the Pope, also known as “Gadolatry”.

    I am also not going to take it up with Rabbonim who died nearly 100 years ago. I will, however, take umbrage with you, who is a Sonei Yisrael and deserve to be treated as such.

    Yankel: “the RZ tell their rabanim what to say”. That’s unfair. The same could be said about Charedi Rabbonim who sign whatever Askanim place before them (yes, that actually happens).

    in reply to: Matzav article about Golus and Eretz Yisrael #2419860
    ZSK
    Participant

    “So, “Hesder Jews”, who practice the idolatrous and heretical “Religious Zionism”, and also allow themselves to be shmaded in the Zionist army, are obviously not practicing the “correct Derech HaTorah”. The “correct Derech HaTorah” is to remain Jews who serve only G-d, not Jews who also worship the Zionist idol and also not to allow themselves to be shmaded in the Zionist army.”

    Again, you will answer HKB”H for slandering an entire community of Orthodox Jews.

    You just don’t get it, and you never will.

    ZSK
    Participant

    HaKatan:

    Again:

    1) R’ Teitelbaum did not have binding judicial authority outside his own community. He certainly did not have such authority in his own country of origin. He did not have that binding authority anywhere else in Europe, certainly nowhere in the Middle East and North Africa. He was one opinion. You clearly do not understand that simple fact, just like you don’t understand how judicial authority is supposed to work within Judaism as a whole, the non-binding nature of moder practice and what we call Minhag (which isn’t actually Minhag), the fact that there has been no true binding judicial authority since the Bavli, and the fact that there are major differences between Ashkenazi and Sephardim with regard to following legal precedent. Hint: Ashkenazim tend to demand it, Sephardim do not. It is not a violation of Halacha to say, “with all due respect to the prior court, we’re ruling differently for xyz reason”. So your Halacha LiMaaseh argument is void.

    2) Whether your utterly pathetic self likes it or not, Aggadeta such as that in Shir Hashirim cannot be used for pesak Halacha. Period. End of discussion. They are an Asmachta at most, which makes the oaths possibly Dinim Muflaim, Rabbinic Laws that can be overturned. Your claim otherwise is also void.

    3) You are wrong vis-a-vis Risaala Al-Yemeniyya, notwithstanding your insistence to the contrary. Understand: You don’t know what you’re talking about. If you bothered to read Risaala Al-Yemeniyya in the original Arabic (like I have), or a reputable Hebrew translation from someone such as a member of the Qafih family, instead of whatever biased, Ashkenazi half-translation you read, you would know that Rambam does not issue any sort of halachic ruling with regard to the so-called “oaths” and that the precise context of these “oaths” is encouraging Yemeni Jewry to stand strong in the face of pressure to convert or face violence/death. The only halachic material is laying out how to determine if someone is a false Messiah. The oaths are a rhetorical device. That’s it. You’re wrong and you wearing a fedora, kopek, streimel or whatever headgear you want will not cover up that fundamental misunderstanding.

    In the end, we don’t have to listen to anything R’ Teitelbaum said. It’s really that simple. You can kick, scream and name call all you want. It’s pathetic at this point, and you’re not changing minds.

    You also will answer HKB”H for slandering an entire community after 120.

    in reply to: כחי ועצם ידי #2412056
    ZSK
    Participant

    This thread, quite frankly, is pure idiocy.

    ZSK
    Participant

    ujm – That is not your business.

    There is something seriously wrong with you, HaKatan and somejewiknow.

    in reply to: Rabbi Chaim Kanievsky and the modern State of Israel #2410391
    ZSK
    Participant

    @qwerty613 – Many of us have asked Mr. Small to explain his position on several occasions and his response is to fire off the same tired statements from various Rabbonim. There is no substance to his arguments. He will not expain what within Zionism – and especially RZ – is idolatry. There are only claims that “Zionists worship a state, not G-d”, an argument relevant 80-125 years years ago, but not relevant today.

    @Non Political – The RZ movement is not at war with the Charedi world. The Charedi world is titling at windmills a la Don Qixote.

    ZSK
    Participant

    @somejew – First of all, please provide the Hebrew original.

    Second, the objections are the same tired objections the Charedi world expresses every 30 seconds, which are not going to change without Charedim enlisting en-masse and forcing the change they want. They have nothing to do with your favorite bogey-man, Zionism.


    @ujm
    – Zionism has nothing to do with this, Joe. See above.

    in reply to: The Peaceful Dismantlement of the State of “Israel” #2407291
    ZSK
    Participant

    @AAQ (Dr.?) – He’s reversing the order specifically to denigrate Rav Soloveitchik. He can’t help himself.

    in reply to: Jewish critics of the State of Israel, where do they reside? #2405598
    ZSK
    Participant

    @somejewiknow – I wasn’t talking about R’ Teitelbaum. That leaves exactly three people I could be referring to.

    in reply to: The Peaceful Dismantlement of the State of “Israel” #2405274
    ZSK
    Participant

    Aheimisher – I believe that Judaism should follow the baseline rulings of the Misha, the Bavli/Yerushalmi, Mishne Torah, then whatever historical halachik precedent you want (more of an Ashkenazi approach than Sephardic) – if you even want to do that much. We do not have a national judicial authority with broad consensus and pesak being voted on. We haven’t had such since the Bavli (and Yerushalmi). There is only local authority – meaning a local Beis Din, and even that doesn’t really exist, considering that each Shul considers its Rabbi the “Mara D’asra”, and there usually muiltiple Batei Din unless you live in a small community.

    R’ Teitelbaum did not have judicial authority outside his community; he certainly did not have any binding judicial authority, ergo no one needs to listen to what he wrote.

    somejewiknow – What a load of bunk, and that is putting it extremely mildly.

    If you think NK is promoting peace and understanding, you’re beyond clueless. Might I remind you that NK went to Iran – which has stated repeatedly that Israel should be wiped off the map and it aims to do so, R”L.

    Don’t play games, Sonei Yisrael.

    in reply to: Jewish critics of the State of Israel, where do they reside? #2404863
    ZSK
    Participant

    Yaakov Yosef – Yes, we don’t fit perfectly into the boxes, and Israelis definitely don’t fit the checkboxes they claim to. It’s also why so many Anglos tend to eventually start their own Shuls and institutions – because of not totally fitting into mainstream Israeli society.

    ujm – No. It wasn’t an excellent point. It was stupid, but definitely what could be expected from an Appalachian Transcarpathian.

    in reply to: The Peaceful Dismantlement of the State of “Israel” #2404849
    ZSK
    Participant

    R Teitelbaum’s works are most definitely not binding Halacha Le-Ma’aseh. On top of that, R’ Teitelbaum most definitely did not have judicial authority outside his community.

    No one else is required to listen to him.

    in reply to: Jewish critics of the State of Israel, where do they reside? #2404108
    ZSK
    Participant

    @somejewiknow – In that case, you have absolutely no right to state your opinion about Satmar, Vayoel Moshe, etc.

    in reply to: Jewish critics of the State of Israel, where do they reside? #2403881
    ZSK
    Participant

    Yaakov Yosef – Exactly right. Both ujm and HaKatan have no clue.

    Charedim call me a Zionist, the RZ public considers me very Charedi-leaning.

    in reply to: Jewish critics of the State of Israel, where do they reside? #2403327
    ZSK
    Participant

    To answer the question directly, I do live in EY. Proudly so.

    And I have my criticisms of the State, but those specific criticisms are only shared privately with those living in Israel. Not with those living in Chu”l.

    in reply to: Jewish critics of the State of Israel, where do they reside? #2402883
    ZSK
    Participant

    I would assume most live in the Tri-State area.

    Those who live in EY tend to have a more nuanced attitude (i.e., no one would say the State is perfect).

    in reply to: Abolish the Rabbanut (Israeli government) #2401469
    ZSK
    Participant

    This is pure idiocy and ignorance. Or to quote Ramban: אין טעם ואין ריח.

    Let me set the record somewhat straight before the resident Appalachian Transcarpathians weigh in.

    1) First of all, the OP vastly overestimates the willingness to fund independent Kashrut organizations and the necessary (expensive) infrastructure. Even Tzohar, in addition to its fundraising, depends to a certain degree upon Rav Stav’s position as the Rav of the city of Shoham, affiliated Rabbis’ positions within the Rabbanut and the Rabbanut Kashrus infrastructure. Let me be clear: I am not attacking Rav Stav or Tzohar. Whether the OP and folks here like it or not, Tzohar has become a legit alternative to the Rabbanut and Misrad HaDatot.

    2) There is the Rabbanut and there is the Misrad HaDatot. They are two different, albeit connected entities. The Rabbanut is under the Misrad HaDatot. That was how you ended up with the bizarre situation of a minister threatening the tenure of a Chief Rabbi.

    3) The Misrad HaDatot is a government ministry that is corrupt and full of Shas and Agudist lackeys. That corruption was how you ended up with the totally preventable situation about 10-15 years ago where the Petach Tikva Beis Din decided (brainlessly) to reject a completely legit conversion done in the USA and thereafter experienced massive blowback from American Orthodox Jewry, from LWMO to Charedim. Rav David Lau warned the court of blowback on both politcal and halachic grounds, but the Shas and Agudist lackeys decided they knew better and got egg on their faces as a result. From the perspective of both an American and an Israeli, it was incredibly embarassing.

    The reason why so many Chilonim hate the Rabbanut is because of the Misrad HaDatot, not the Rabbanut in of itself. The Misrad HaDatot dictates – before marriage – who the bride and groom are to learn Hilchos Nidda from. Outside Yishuvim and DL majority areas, they are usually Charedi individuals who should not be teaching Chilonim. Yes, Chilonim are hostile to the idea of learning Hilchos Niddah and they come in with a massive chip on their shoulder, which they should not do. Charedim do not help, considering their inability to reach Chilonim in any meaningful manner.

    The only reasonable employees at the Misrad HaDatot are those who are not Charedi. I know this first hand. Upon Aliyah, it was a Charedi clerk who wanted to declare our Ketubah invalid on grounds of “not liking” wording. The wording was the standard American. It was his DL supervisor who first berated the clerk (he recognized my Rav’s name on the marriage certificate), made the clerk call my Rav early in the morning in the USA – while I was in the office, and ask his question. My Rav’s response was, “You call me to verify other Rabbonim. You’re questioning a wedding I performed?”. Even Charedim don’t want to interact with Charedim at the Misrad HaDatot.

    4) There is the Rabbanut itself. It is a government office, but its purpose is to maintain a specific level of Orthodox Judaism that is more or less acceptable to all. It intersects with the average Israeli at major points in life such as birth, bris milah, marriage/divorce and death. For the most part it does what it is supposed to do. They try their best, but they are hamstrung by both the secular legal and political system and Charedi politics and policy.

    5) Kashrus: The Rabbanut does all the work and is minimally the equivalent of the OU. Charedi hechsherim show up, check one set of lungs (not enough to verify for Kashrus purposes), look at a few ingredients, then leave. The hechsherim are worthless. It’s similar to how the OU does the overwhelming majority of the work in the USA, and the Charedim just piggyback again and do a worthless, cursory check. Charedim might as well rely on the OU and the Rabbanut.

    6) If the OP thinks abolishing the Rabbanut will end the things he would like to see disappear, he is blind. Chilonim will just consider it a victory and then try to ban funding to both Charedi and DL Yeshivot and other institutions.

    in reply to: ENGLISH SHOULD BE OPTIONARY #2401470
    ZSK
    Participant

    @Yaakov Yosef – No, different people. This is a kid trolling.

    But ujm and HaKatan may be the same person.

    in reply to: Time to Make Aliyah #2399402
    ZSK
    Participant

    If you’re considering Aliyah, do so intelligently and plan carefully. But definitely do so.

    in reply to: Hypocrisy among the Charedi politicians #2398728
    ZSK
    Participant

    Well, they are, and anyone who reads the Hebrew language media knows it. Including Charedim themselves.

    in reply to: Hypocrisy among the Charedi politicians #2398273
    ZSK
    Participant

    Well, they are, especially a certain housing minister.

    Anyone who reads the Hebrew language press knows this.

    in reply to: The Peaceful Dismantlement of the State of “Israel” #2394906
    ZSK
    Participant

    What on earth is wrong with you?

    in reply to: Day of Prayer #2382664
    ZSK
    Participant

    @AAQ – I have no idea, but I suspect not. Certainly there was nothing of the sort when I was in school in the 90s-2000s.

    That’s an interesting statement by RJBS – and I agree with it. I’ve said before that there are far too many people with Semicha who shouldn’t be allowed within 10 feet of a Shulchan Aruch.

    in reply to: Three Oaths essay from Rabbi Avraham Rivlin of Kerem B’Yavneh #2382263
    ZSK
    Participant

    @HaKatan

    “You can’t, because Jews do not have a common land, language and culture.”

    What on earth are you talking about? We most certainly do.

    Did you sleep through Chumash class from 1st grade through the end of Mesivta (and by extension, Matan Torah)?

    EY, Jews, the Torah and Yiddishkeit are inextricably linked. I get you’re trying (pathetically and in vain) to remove Zionism from the picture by any means necessary, but all you’re actually doing is severing the link between them.

    in reply to: Three Oaths essay from Rabbi Avraham Rivlin of Kerem B’Yavneh #2381551
    ZSK
    Participant

    HaKatan

    Hold up, boy-o.

    You said:
    “Every form of Zionism believes in at least two things:
    1. Judaism is a Nationality, not (only) a religion, and Zionism is the current manifestation of that Nationality.
    2. The Zionist “State” is the Nation-State of that religion.”

    First of all, I am guessing your overly reduced point is: Zionism believes Judaism is a nationality only and the State is the Nation-State of that secularist entity. If that’s your point, you’ve stated it very poorly to say the least.

    If that isn’t your point and that you think Judaism is not a nationality and is instead something else, please spell out exactly what sort of group you think Jews are, if we are not a nation and ergo by definition a nationality. Nations have a unique language, culture, religion, writing system, etc. We have these things. These are the things that separated us from the Egyptians, as pointed out by Rashi. Do you deny this?

    If so, please confirm you believe that term “Am Yisrael” is a misnomer, and that the term “Am” – that appears hundreds of times within the Chumash alone, is incorrect. Please also confirm you believe the phrase in Parshas Yisro – “Mamleches Kohanim ve-Goy kadosh”, as well as the phrases in Ve’eschanan – “Am chacham venavon” and “Goy gadol”- are not true and that we’re followers of one religion like Islam, Hinduism, or the followers of the so-called carpenter, rather than what we are – a nation and a rather obvious ethnoreligious group.

    in reply to: Day of Prayer #2381547
    ZSK
    Participant

    @AAQ – I like the idea.

    In Israel, the RZ sector has “bagruyot” – basically tests you need to pass to be considered to have graduated high school – that are in Tanach and Torah She-Ba’al Peh.

    I don’t see any problem with such a test being applied globally, and modified as needed to suit communal needs.

    in reply to: Day of Prayer #2381302
    ZSK
    Participant

    @ujm

    There are at least 80 Hesder Yeshivot with permanent Kollelim. They are army yeshivot, and receive money from the IDF/Israeli government. So no, the IDF (and by extension the Israeli government) does not devalue Torah Study. Quite the opposite, actually.

    To be sure, there are certainly things in the IDF that should be less priority (some of the things you mentioned) – but you have those things when there is an ideologically secularist upper echelon.

    As for Charedim being the only ones significantly engaged in Torah Study in a permanent manner – again, you’re a pathetic liar. And I can easily argue that Charedim are not any more engaged in Torah Study than the RZ sector is (something that is blindingly obvious to anyone who has lived in or adjacent to Charedi enclaves for any extended period of time).

    The excuses you’ve provided are pathetic. RZ soldiers are attending Shiurim in between rounds of fighting in Gaza and Lebanon. The photos of soldiers’ notebooks full of Torah have been shown all over the place in Jewish media, as have photos of those Shiurim.

    You’re wrong, hopelessly ignorant and completely unlettered.

    @AAQ – He wouldn’t accept a test to determine exemptions – because it would have been developed (and possibly administered) by Zionists, which by definition is a no-go in his book. Even if the Gedolim created such a test, he would reject it on the grounds that the Gedolim caved to the Zionists – and they are therefore not Geolim anymore. To ujm and his ilk, there is no situation where anyone may have anything to do with the State unless it is to take money.

    in reply to: The antizionism amongst religious Jews has no legitimate detractors #2380738
    ZSK
    Participant

    @AAQ – No, there aren’t. Because they consider Z and MO to be heresy of the highest level, they’ll never engage seriously.

    in reply to: The antizionism amongst religious Jews has no legitimate detractors #2380647
    ZSK
    Participant

    @somejewiknow

    3 brief points (I’m done arguing with you):

    1) It is patently false that you have not rejected one Sefer. You’ve rejected anything that is authored by an individual who supports Zionism, Chibat Tzion, Chovevei Tzion, Mizrachi, HaPoel Mizrachi, etc. That means you’ve rejected works by: 1) Rav Reines; 2) Rav Alkalai; 3) Rav Kalischer; 4) Rav Teichtal; 5) Rav Kook; 6) Rav Soloveitchik; 7) Rav Yeshayahu Shapira (Brother of the Piacezna Rebbe); 8) Rav Aviner – These are all Rabbonim who backed Zionism to varying degrees and/or have works supporting such (I’m not sure about Piacezna’s brother). The last one wrote a work that is a direct challenge to Vayoel Moshe.

    2) You absolutely are using the no true scotsman fallacy. To you, no true Rav/Gadol could possibly be a Zionist, therefore any pro-Zionist work is heresy or a forgery and its author is a heretic. Which is why you reject all the Rabbonim above and their works (and in some cases, actions).

    3) I don’t think anyone here rejects the sources used by the SR, or the sources in general. It is a rejection of the methodology used – You cannot rule Halacha based on Aggada. Because R’ Teitelbaum founded his entire Magnum Opus upon Aggada, it contains a fundamental error impeaches its authority. Its conclusions can be questioned.

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