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YO
I guess I don’t really understand your question then
YO
I’m not sure where you looked
OC 473 is leil Pesach the first cup ie KiddushThe very first word is Mozgin
what does “mozgin” mean?Before you say it means to pour. See Rambam Chametz umatza 7:9
Mozgin means “we dilute”
now you could say it is lav davka, our wine doesn’t need dilution it is already diluted etc etc
but it does talk about diluting the wineNow you know!
YO
Among other places
OC 473:1“1) why do we pour water from becher into wine bottle before kiddush?”
The reason I’ve heard (I believe from R” Belsky Z “l) is that during the time of shas, wine had to be diluted as it was thick syrupy and high in alcohol content. so much so that pouring cup is often described as “mozgin” literaly – diluting.
Today in a nod to Talmudic practice we too are “mozgin” the wine before kiddush#2 sounds made up
UJM
thats for sure true.
But shas joined in 92 not BECAUSE of R’ Shach. He was opposed to Shas joining, the fact that they joined anyway created a bit of a rift between the two as damoshe alludes to
UJM
In 1992, UTJ did NOT join the government as per Rav Shach’s instruction.
Shas joining was not because of Rav Shach, in fact the opposite is trueymr
I’m so sorry I didn’t understand your last post
you say ” If you imagine that each one had their throats slit,”
but I’m not the one who says that. YOU said Shechita ONLY applies to “kosher food or קרבנות.”
Though you conceded there are a few exceptions.
So I’m asking you leshitascha, why is it used there. Accoridng to YOU it would mean each one had there throat slit making sure there was no sheiyah, chalada etc *I don;t have any such question. Shechita is used the same way slaughter is in English (lhavdil)
It is used for Jewish ritual Slaughter; OR it is used for a bloody death whether human or not human.Thus a “Goy who shechts” is not a question at all according to me Sure a goy can shecht but his shechita is no good. This is wha t the mishan says
“And yes, מפרשים discuss why ושחט was used with רי זירא. Because it isn’t the normal use of the word. Look it up next time דף יומי comes around.”
I can’t wait that long. And I suspect you are making them up. sure there are meforshim who say it doesn’t mean killed literally ** in which case it is certainly a borrowed term but I’m skeptical that there are thsoe who say it does mean killed literally , but the “shechita” isnt literal *** since shecita only applies to kosher animals
* Though they still arent kosher animals, nor in the beis hamikdash so yet another exception !
** showing yet AGAIN that shechita isnt always used to refer to Jewish ritual slaughter. IT can mean he caused him to be full till his throat with wine (Maharsha) or drew forth his torah learning (Ben Yehoyada)
*** Though again whatever those exceptions are you’d have to add them to the growing list
Lol
“After all, everyone understands shechita as referring to kosher slaughter.”
No
You are still making the same mistake
shechita does not (only) mean ritual slaughter.
Hardly anyone would even imagine such a thing. It is not hard to look up the word “shechita” in a dictionary to find the modern defitnion, or in a concordance to find it used in Tanach for non-ritual slaughterR’ Zeira died by shechita (before he was revived)
so did the Bnei Ephraim (Shoftim 12:6) Sons of Achav and family of Achazyah (MElachim 2 10)“The אבן עזרא explains that the term וישחטם is used instead of the proper term ויהרגם because it took place in the wilderness, where cattle normally graze.”
YES!!!
So it is not only used for cattle. It is sometimes used for people.
Why use such a gruesome word for people? Especially since by the meraglim there was no dying by slaughter. As chazal tell us they dug graves lay in them and many died. How on earth is that “shechita” ??? So the mefarshim explain., as you were kind enough to supplyAnd besides . Ok so you don’t like this example. Thats ok I have tons more!
So your statement “You will not find שחיטה used in תנ”ך or הלכה outside of the preparation or kosher food or קרבנות.”
Has 3 exceptions now.
Except in the beis hamikdash, except in the wilderness, except by a Goy who is proficient.what about The Bnei Efraim in Shoftim why is the word Shechita used there?
Also
Just occurred to meyou says “The אבן עזרא explains that the term וישחטם is used instead of the proper term ויהרגם because it took place in the wilderness, where cattle normally graze. So the פסוק would properly be understood as “to slaughter them like cattle in the wilderness”.”
but shechita only means ritually slaughtered (according to you) not just random cow slaughter. After all the post in question involved the slaughter of a cow, and you insist that that is NOT shechita.
So why is the word shechita used which ONLY means ritual slaughter in your view.
how does he answer the question (as you understand it) ?No need to apologize
this whole thread was silly
I’m fine having fun with it
If in the process we learn something all the betterthanks for the mareh mekomos. Though I’m not sure what they add.
I don’t deny that a person being “shechted” r “l is very unpleasant. And even if one had to die, to die by “shechita” r”l is a terrible way to go, and when the Passuk uses such a gruesome term especially
at the hand of the Ribono shel olam; a pshat is warranted .nonetheless, clearly they weren’t actually shechted as required to make food kosher.
Your complaint was “שחיטה is a הלכה משה מסנ”
This isnt true*. The word shechita is used lots of times in Tanach not referring to halachic shechita. (some examples provided there are more)
It is used lots of times in the Gemara not referring to halachic shechita especially when the shechita is passul for whaever reason . (example provided)
Another example (not in the beis hamikdash) ” Kam Rabbah shactei L’reb Zeira”Furthermore in modern Hebrew it certainly includes any form of slaughter have a look at any Hebrew dictionary.
So even if we couldn’t find “=non-halachic examples of “shechita” in Tanach/shas (we found plenty) ok so YWN is using it in the modern hebrew sense . whats the problem?* of course the exact method how to correctly shecht is haalcha l’moshe misinai, but that that is ALL the word means is not true.
If you want more examples
(Though unclear why a mishna describing a goy shechting is not a perfect example of a goy shechting that isnt korbanos nor kosher food)Bamidbar 14: 16 not korbanos nor kosher food
Shoftim 12:6 not korbanos nor kosher food
Melachim 1 18:40 not korbanos nor kosher food
Melachim 2 10:7 not korbanos nor kosher food
Melachim 2 10:14 not korbanos nor kosher food
Melachim 2 25:7 not korbanos nor kosher foodAnd none of these “shechitas” occur in the azarah so your borrowed term “distinction” doesn’t work either.
Again, I don’t doubt you can come up with creative distinctions for each (this was many people so it’s different, that was before the beis hamikdash was built so it’s different)
The simple fact is the word shechita isn’t only used for halachic shechitaYou sure did, but not convincingly
Simple question
Is the root שחט used for a non halachic shechita?Yes or no will suffice.
I’m not asking if you are creative enough to come up with an artifical distinction , no matter how lomdish you think it is. I have no doubt you can“You will not find שחיטה used in תנ”ך or הלכה outside of the preparation or kosher food or קרבנות.”
This is incorrect.
I gave you two examplesBarry
You say “On the contrary”
but nothing you wrote is contrary to what I said .
In a nutshell: “Left/liberal parties got some votes too I think.” Am I mistaken in that assessment?
ymrbiat
Great Questionshechting doesn’t always mean “שחיטה” It means Slaughtering and is quite often used that way. The Gemara refers to Zecharia ben Yehoyada being “nishchat beheichal” It doesn’t mean they fulfilled the Halacha L’moshe Misinai of shechita R”L. It means he was slaughtered in the heichel. Even if he was killed by decapitation it is not uncommon to refer to, say “6 million Kedoshim who were shechted al kiddush Hashem” Although few of them were decapitated (shechita isnt decapitation of course) they were slaughtered, or shechted if you will.
The Arab was slaughtering his animal. Thus he was shechting it.
This answers a great question you must have on Chulin 13 a.
The Mishna says “shechitas nachri neveila” What do you mean the shechita of a nachri is neveila? A goy can’t shecht????Must be of course he can shecht/slaghter however the halachaic status of his shechita is that it is neveila.
hope this helps!
“The most annoying thing, is the Jewish in name only American Liberal Jews thinking they know what’s better for Israel, than Israelis.”
don’t let a silly talking point annoy you.
Israelis don’t agree on what is best for Israel .
There was just an election. although Netanyahu and the “right” have a clear majority.LEft/liberal parties got some votes too I think. The second largest party (Yesh Atid) for example. Even Meretz that didnt cross the threshold got over 100,000 votes.
So When Liberal Jews oppose Netanyahu it is silly to say they know better than “Israelis” They think they know better than some and agree with others.
Fantastic mareh makom
“However for young students our ancestors IN RECENT TIMES have not taught them Tanach and one should not change this tradition.” (emphasis added)
IT is always interesting to me when A gadol, says befeh maleh that changes in practice in gweneral, and chinuhc in particular occur.
Once upon a time kids learnt Tanach, after all “the halacha is that one should teach Tanach” however “in recent times” this is no longer doen.Thanks for sharing!
vira
I’m not sure what your last comment added
to remind you where We are.You raised concern that the group i question will make it easier to find each other (leading to more averia)
To which I replied that I hear you though am not so concerned, because there already is such a group (remebemr thats how the whole story began the yare suing for official recognition, but the group exists) . The only thing that would change is that the Yeshiva would have some say over it .I don’t understand what your last comment adds.
If you are raising a new concern that an officially sanctioned club would lead to acceptance . Again I hear, though society is heading down that road anyway . and I’m not convinced this leads to acceptance. ITs hear we know it we dont need to accept it. Same as Guard your eyes, or machsom lfi does it lead to “acknowledging that we say Lashon hara” ? Obviously, but we all know that. Same here the problem exists as you say ” kids have no problem holding hands with their sin partners in public,” So what now ?
We can ignore it, and hope it will go away (and write those people out of Orthodoxy)
Or we can acknowledge it and provide support.In short if I understand your new concern correctly; that it lends them support / brings it out into the open. As you already acknowledge the yare already out in the open
Smerel well put.
My only quibble is I think in theory an official “club” is a good idea. In practice I agree I don’t think this is that. I don’t think many will join, this is not what those suing want. , and the administration knows that. I suspect thhis is a ploy to have a “club” on paper to help YU legally
Avira
“Ubiq, a recognized club will draw way more members.”
The opposite is true not many LGBT are interested in being outed by their teshiva. And they are very wary that the “Torah approach” will include conversion therapyUjm
Lol ok so let’s take the lowest estimate for LGBT. The highest for oedophilia . All in a desperate attempt to make your point.You conclude “As such, you still cannot deny that the aveira of pedophilia (which also severely victimizes innocent children) should be addressed with at least the same alarcity as that of the aveira of homosexuality.”
Ok sold. Start the club you have my support. Beracha vehatzlachaalso I love that you wrote “Whereas somewhat under 5%”
when the article you cited said “The prevalence of pedophilic disorder is unknown,… Estimates of its prevalence range from one to five percent of the male population ”
So the numbers aren’t known it may even be less than your transposed 1.7% a far cry from it being “very clear”
never change
Ujm
“According to research, approximately 1.7% of the population…”
Yiu accidently wrote the number backwards
Gallup poll in Feb 2022 estimated 7.1 %And I enjoyed that you stuck in “exclusive” as if oh it’s not exclusive then it’s ok
UJM
I have no idea what you are talking about
YOU brought up pedophilia. Why don’t you back it up *
To answer your questions
Why are you accepting at face value that homosexuality is a more prevalent problem than pedophilia?”
Because The research is readily and easily available.
AND because we are discussing an LGBT club. as they say the proof is in the pudding.” But you admit above that you do not know the comparative figures.”
I admitted no such thing . It is easy to Google plus puk chazi (l’havdil elef alfei havdolas) plus
” As such, you should have the humility to not deny the problem of pedophilia.”
I never denied the problem* (i’m not really asking, I know why it is because you are not an honest person)
just
“ubiq: How on earth would you know that. Do you have any proof?”proof of what?
avira
Yes I understand your concern.
Though as I said the club exists regardless. The difference is whether it is recognized by YU. YU recognizing it won’t lead to illicit relationships.UJM
No need to repeat yourself
If you have a source by all means I’d be interestedYO
You are most welcomeOf course 8 minutes is much to long for a daf yomi shiur. If ou listen double speed you can get it down to a 4 minute daf
Ujm
Are you in denial that pedophilia is a real, serious and consistent problem in our community, MORE so than even homosexuality?
Complete denial.
It isn’t even close. I suspect you are making stuff up againAvira
I dont fi d thst aspect interesting, so I ignored it.
I don’t think it will any more than an unofficial club.
If you do you do. I hear you“What does all this have to do with my OP?”
You made refrence to the “Torah velt” that it belongs to all
LF and dovid both said similarly that t there is a Torah world with same set of values for “3000 years”
1 then made reference to covering up for abuse
Avira defended the Troah world by saying that it was not known how bad abuse was, and in the course of that mentioned even today it isn’t well understood
That led to severa,l in particular Syag, to call out Avira for his nonsense.and that is how we got here
One man’s junk is another man’s treasure
UJM
“Is this YU group trying to help homosexuals STOP ENGAGING IN HOMOSEXUALITY?YES OR NO?”
That’s like asking did you stop hitting your wife yes or No. I don’t know the teiyereh yidden who will join the club I am required to give them the benefit of doubt and assume that although they have this YH they have never chas veshalom acted upon it.
OF course if any R’Chl has then the answer to your question is a resounding YES (al caps)
as the letter says “we have been working to formulate a Torah framework to provide our LGBTQ students with an enhanced support system that continues to facilitate their religious growth and personal life journeys.”Avira
“nice try in attempting to evade your moral relativism when it’s clearly pointed out.”
what do you mean try? I am evading it . It has no bearing on this thread. You are trying to slip it in to pontificate, I’m not taking the bait.
“You then attempted to say that Rav Moshe’s Torah is relative to how goyim in his time viewed toevos”
Again no attempt. I quoted R’ Moshe as supplied by UJM VERBATIM. I didn’t add a word . Perhaps you disagree with R’ Moshe. I have no problem with that , though I am not sure why you would. Perhaps you disagree with the translation you’d have to point out where but ok thats fine.“Again, how would you feel if YU made a support group for people who are attracted to children? Do you think a yeshiva is a place for that?”
I’m surprised this is controversial.
If there was a need I’d feel terrible if they DIDN’T create such a group
It sounds dangerous not to!Avira
That was a nice long shtickel.
I don’t get the relevance.
Let’s rewindYu sent out a letter announcing a club
“In this context, we recognize that our undergraduate students, including our LGBTQ students, who choose to attend Yeshiva come with different expectations and navigate different challenges than those who choose a secular college. And as such, we have been working to formulate a Torah framework to provide our LGBTQ students with an enhanced support system that continues to facilitate their religious growth and personal life journeys.”
The op criticized yu for this
I pointed out it is no different than GYE which offers support to those struggling with a different issue.
Yiu said it was different because (among other reasons) GYE deals with a common natural YH.
I do t understand this difference. YH is YH if it is something people struggle with they need support just because you can’t understand the struggle. Sure it’s immoral what does that have to do with anything inever said or implied otherwise. I have news your you GYE is also protecting against something immoral. It’s called “niuf” for a reason. Your hair splitting is not coming from an honest place“You took one line and wrenched it out pf context.”
Um no I quoted almost a fifth of UJM’s post
“or would you bemoan the fact that the world had changed so drastically from what the Torah wants even for goyim?”
why is it either or? why can’t it be both?
We bemoan the fact the the world is getting more depraved while helping and supporting those who have this struggleYou deal with the reality at hand.
Once upon a time Yeshivas did not appreciate the severity of child abuse.
If we dug up a letter from an adom gadol written > 50 years ago in which he ” simply did not understand the far reaching psychological impact of abuse. … [and he felt thatl] disrupting major mosdos over it seemed like overkill.” Would that be relevent TODAY * ? I’m guessing you would say it isnt (please corrct me if I’m wrong)I’m surprised this is controversial
Once upon a time the trauma of abuse wasn’t fully appreicated; today it is
Once upon a time hitting was deemed proper chinuch; today most mechanchim/gedolim say it is not for our dor
Once upon a time this was “abomination that the whole world despises.”; today it isnt
Yes obviosuly the aveirah didnt change. and I never suggested nor impied otherwise.
But our approach to those dealing with this YH can change* I’m not asking about the view of him then
“In fact it is one of the greatest abominations that even the nations of the world know that it is an incomparable abomination…. The world already holds that the transgressors of this sin are disgusting and are not members of civilization at all. ”
Is this still true?
In the world? In the US? In NYC?Certainly It was true when it was written ~50 years ago (!)
It is not true today (certainly not in NYC) And not even in the US (see report from PEw research center 6/25/20 where 72% said it should be accepted. Even globally 52% said should be accepted though that report is limited to 34 countries and missing Large countries like china)As I said “Things change. Attitudes change circumstances change. ”
Thank you for the confirmation
Avira
“Rabbeim have been helping people like this for decades; it’s nothing new.”
Yes! Nailed it! shalom al yisroel
“doesn’t mean that we disregard Rav Moshe”
Obviously.
Though I don’t understand what R Moshe has to do with this thread“and this one is “acceptable” solely because the goyishe world sees it that way”
I don’t know what this means. YH is YH . If you have aa yetzer Harahan you deal with it. The gemara gives advice for a person who has a yetzer Harahan for murder. That does t mean it’s “acceptable ” but if that’s your struggle, hey become a shichst. Don’t pretend it does t exist.
Ujm
“Are you implicitly saying that Rav Moshe’s attitude and perspective on this issue expressed in the referenced teshuva is no longer acceptable in today’s day and age?”And if I am?
Things change. Attitudes change circumstances change. Smoking was once allowed on Yom tov, many poskim say today ot is assur as it is no l9nger shava lchol mefesh. R Wolbe and R Shteyman both Saud hitting children is wring form of chinuch. Does that mean they ate implicitly saying previous approach is no longer acceptable? Things change approaches change. R Aron Feldman is familiar with R Moshe he takes a different approach.
Sure you can accuse him of lying (!!!) because it doesn’t got your narrative. Though that makes me sad for the abject spiritual poverty in the fabric-wearing community who don’t trust our gedolim“I love how people can say that the gadol hadors perspective is gross…”
Rav Moshe says not to help those struggling with mishkav zachor?
in fact the opposite.
He offers support to the fellow struggling., and writes a letter ( just as long as to the other more natural struggles in the next teshuva)
OF course that letter was written almost 50 years ago
Attitudes and perspectives change. See R’ Aron Feldman’s letter written more recentlyyou must have another printing of Ig”M. I’m not sure what part of the the “gadol hadors perspective” you beleive I called gross
OR were you referring to yourself as the gadol Hador?UJM
“ubiq: How many men do you know that lack a Yetzer Hora for women?
I dont think many.
why?Avira
“that’s a normal yatzer hora, and it’s something every jew faces,”
speak for yourself, just because you struggle doesnt mean all do.And what a strange claim, so the struggles you have are real struggles that warrant organizations and support. but other people who struggle aren’t entitled to support?
What a gross perspective,. Nay, an abomination!
You think thats bad !
YWN often advertises for Guard your eyes.
A “club” that supports people struggling with shemiras einayim, and other aveiros that the Zohar tells us are worse than murder.Reportedly it has haskamos from such Institutions as Ner Yisroel, Lakewood clearly modern orthodox
“still didn’t look up the DG”M, don’t know if he says this or another sevara”
main reason is its a psik resihe on a D’rabanon especially since its K’lachar yad and mikalkel
“I have to look up the No”b you quoted; I’m not familiar with it”
Its a dagul mervava on siman 340
There it is discussing letters on food itself (which arguably is worse)
The MB brings itvut removing the letters wouldnt help
There are 2 seperate melachos
Koreah/tearing
Mechika/erasingKoreah has nothing to do with letters. Removing letters wouldnt remove koreah. If Koreah is a problem that is regardlesss of whther letters are present or not.
(As always correct me if I’m wrong)The OP’s puzzlement is over the words that are torn. “full of words, everywhere,” this has nothing to do with koreah
“The go-to shabbos poskim, like shemiras shabbos kehilchasa, rabbi ribiat, rabbi simcha bunim ohen”
ITs a bit odd to dismiss the Nodeh Beyehudah (brought in MB) becasue the “go-to shabbos poskim” dont bring it though some do in footnotes, I havent checked which) . And it isn’t just mekalkel it is also psik reisha dlo nicha lei on a d’Rabanan.
Though without question the general minhag is to be machmir And I am not saying to change that.I agree with the OP It is weird that hemishe companies don;t make it easier. (my last line in first comment was meant tongue in cheek)
RE
I assume you mean 340:14
Though I dont think has nothing to do with letters. That is korea tearing the wrapper would be the problem.
Though IT isnt a problem as the MB there explains, it still requires some toeles which most people when they tear wrappers do not have in mind.Presumably they rely on the Dagul Mervava who argues on the Rema 340:3 and says it is muttar.
He concludes המחמיר יחמיר לעצמו ולא לאחרים. So even if the manufacturers themselves are machmir like the Rema, that is for their candies not yours
“Tintin himself is not much of a role model either. In the books (and the movie), he is depicted as quite a young man, appearing not a day older than 16. Where are his parents?”
Although he APPEARS young he may in fact be suffering from a medical condition, specifically hypopituitarism resulting from repeated head trauma.
see:
Cyr A, Cyr LO, Cyr C. Acquired growth hormone deficiency and hypogonadotropic hypogonadism in a subject with repeated head trauma, or Tintin goes to the neurologist. CMAJ. 2004 Dec 7;171(12):1433-4. doi: 10.1503/cmaj.1041405. PMID: 15583175; PMCID: PMC534570.Yes
AAQ
Do you have a great Esrog guy, or did your Mocher Pomegranates take you for a ride?
I retract my original comment
the Story surfaced, and while many of the orignial WhatsApp forwards were exaggerated the gist is rightYou think music is bad?
The words are so much worse.
I noticed many of the Piyutim. Rhyme!! Some have – shudder- refrains !!! and don’t get me started on motifs.
Oy mah hayah lanu! How did this get so out of hands. There are no rhymes in Tanach. Who instituted this modern innovation of rhyming tefilos?? IT must be stoppedJoseph, my rebbe, you will be pleased to know when the Chazan, excuse me I need a second I feel uncomfrotable writing this out, but when he said Kaddish and used a , again forgive me for saying this, it is strictly to share my tzidkes, he um used a tune rachmana litzlan, (some said this tune is used for neiilah rachman litzlan to contemplate such a thing) But you wil be pleased to know I banged on the bima and made a huge machaah
You’ve taught me well Rebbe. Hope you are proud
CS
Here to answer all your questions ! !!!
Troll or not troll? – not troll
Kokosh with hot coffee or cold milk? – under age 16 milk over 16 coffee. Age 16 itself mix the two
Woodburne or Fallsburg? – Woodburne
Tums or Exlax on Motza? – Tums
what is the minhag of eating pizza on Motza? – Pizza is round like the moon but as slices are removed it gets smaller until a new pie is brought out, this reminds us of Kidush levana whcih there is minhag to do Motzoei Shabbos
or a half baked slice on Motza Peasch? – Since it isnt fully baked it can still rise to contrast with Matzah
What is the minhag of having a sushi platter at a vort? – Suchi is lashon of Sos osis which was the Haftorha for chasanim
What is the minhag of Horseradish with Geflite fish? – so that we cry thinking of the Liviyason’s mate that was killed
What is the minhag of yelling out Kohaleh during laining? – I give the answer in the thread you linked to
What is the minhag of serving Kichelech along side of the herring at the kiddush? – When eating on Shabbos we should progress through brias haolam Herring was day 5 (fish) kichel is day 3 (plant) it is improper to skip staright to day 5 so we have day 3 with it
What is the minhag of flushing twice using public toilets? – you answred this one
Story doesn’t make sense
allegedly the teacher is a “woke activist” yet story is no where to be found
Why isn’t the teacher getting all her activist friends reved up.
surely some media would pick up the story . ITs pretty sensationalWhole story is really bizarre
Avira
“They learn yiddish no differently than public school kids learn English.”Please don’t lie.
Satmar doesnt have Yiddish grammar/vocabulary classes ( I wasn’t referring to literature) . definitely not past kitah beis. Public schools do (English not Yiddish).
You maintain they don’t need to, and they are doing just fine. “that’s not the focus of chasidishe chinuch.”
B’seder that’s fair .
In fact I essentially said that in the last paragraph (“It’s a bit weird…”) .Avira
Not my main point,m so need to get too bogged down
Briefly
“My grandfather, a yiddish speaking doctor from Europe, wrote a book in yiddish on it.”
Great! Have them teach it in schools Everybody wins. not sure on the point of this“Ever read the yiddish magazines? They’re full of health news, and mention diabetes, heart disease, etc… Quite often.”
Yes indeed. This may surprise you though, not every person reads every article. So a system where such major gaps are meant to be filled in by hopefully them stumbling across your grandfather’s book or them reading every article in a newspaper. ISnt a great one.
Again, not terrible. Just a flaw I pointed out.“While amusing, they’re not statistically representative of the majority of people.”
Agreed, which is part of why I mentioned this wasn’t a particularly convincing argument. Its not like chasidim have a higher incidence of diabetes, dialysis etc (as far as I can tell), so it isnt the biggest deal. And there are wonderful chesed oprganizations to help guide through the medcial maze (maybe even providing a net benefit?) Though I’m not sure Id characterize telling a patient that if he didn’t start taking insulin he’d end up on dialysis and it was if I was explaining physiology to a child “amusing” (I bristle at you describing regular Chasidim as Developmentally disabled, if it never came up it never came up)“It’s simply hateful. You’re misrepresenting your own brethren and you’re full of hate.”
If that makes you feel better. Sure why not. Pure hate .To be clear though; you dont seem to be disputing my main point. Namely that they don’t really learn Yiddish, they just pick up what they need as they go on. Correct?
(not that this is bad per se)